[Closed] more people switching to flats for xc riding....

Why the change ?

It's betterer and for most people the efficiency gains are meaningless.

Did you ask them?

Why would you think that your group is now (or in the past for that matter) representative of the wider riding community?

Did you ask them?

Why would you think that your group is now (or in the past for that matter) representative of the wider riding community?

err, no, just wondering about it on reflection.... 😯

Same reason why tyres got fatter, stems shorter, bars risier and angles slacker.

People seem to be more interested in grins than xc speed.

When this first started happening (for me it was 1998) we called them "fat and happy" bikes. Having said that, I only swapped to flats about 3 years ago.

I've moved to flats for two reasons, firstly my spds are on my commuter and I can't afford to buy another set nor be arsed to keep swapping. Secondly it's a new bike and I always get a bit too ambitious so the flats give me the bail out security. I'm loving the flats again so will probably just upgrade them rather than replace with spds.

It could be that XC is getting more technical.

Personally I've gone with flats because I find them much better for the bits when I'm not on the bike (e.g. pushing/carrying), easier to get started again if I have to dab in a technical section and because I can't detect any performance advantage to SPDs. It's not that I haven't tried. I've done timed runs on the same segments with flats and SPDs and I just can't detect any significant difference in speed. YMMV of course.

define "XC"

I use both SPD and flats.

define "XC"

Trail centres happened I reckon. Before casual riders like me, would have just gone out for ride, heathery singletrack and fire roads mainly, now I can nip out and he sort of trails that used to be hidden in the woods are now nicely signposted for me, so I'm doing more techy riding than I used to.

I still own some spuds, might have to put some on one of my bikes later today I've run out of decent flats and can't afford another pair for my new bike 😕

In the past it was seen you had to use SPDs to be a serious rider as they were that much better. But they aren't that much better, they are just different and I think people are realising this and trying flats more. I use clipless on my xc race bike but flats on my trail bike. There is a lot I like about flats and to be honest I don't notice a loss in efficiency enough to worry about it.

SPDs for general trail riding, most natural stuff, and all that just get out and ride stuff.
Flats for trail centres, and the slightly more technical or mountainous natural stuff.
And sometimes PD-M545's which are caged SPDs.

I gave flats a try around 2 years ago for my xc wheels on the ground riding after 5 years of toe clips followed by 20 years of spd's. I've no intention of going back, I just prefer not being attached to the bike and I think the improvement in pedals and shoes means I have no concern about my feet slipping. The only worry I have is is it ok to mix flat shoes and Lycra? 🙂

there is a certain percentage of 'serious' or shall we say snobby mtb riders than consider spds to be what you choose when you are serious about mtbing, like 'pahh he's still on flats, must be an amateur'
I've noticed this on here and other forums and within my local mtb club. I prefer flats too. DMR V8s here.

There's some strange views on here... I use spds for everything, xc racing, commuting, trails... I just feel more secure with my feet clipped in - nothing to do with snobbery 😆

Use what feels comfortable to you.

It's betterer

I'd guess either people are doing more technical riding/crashing or it's a fashion thing.
fashion stating previously "SPDs are for serious cyclists" so most were on spds and now "flats are for gnarr cyclists" and we get a big shift to flats.

SPDs for me, used to have flats for playing around on (aka practising skills stuff), don't get time to play now, I just ride so I'll take every advantage. I don't fall off much so the ejector seat side of flats doesn't appeal to me but I do however pedal every ride so efficiency gains of spds do appeal 🙂

Numerous contributory factors for me:

1. My riding is tending more towards big mountains and tech descents, so flats suit me for both the hike-a-bike climbs and the tech descents. Good all-round compromise.

2. Getting clipped into spds was sometimes an issue when there was no easy run-in to an obstacle.

3. More feedback and less float. First thing that I noticed on first day on flats was that there was slight wear in the swingarm bearing. Never felt it on SPDs.

4. Consistancy. I have a few bikes, ranging from 180 F/S to 140 H/T. Flats work for all of them.

5. Wear. SPD pedals and cleats both wore out pretty quickly for me, and with a few bikes/shoes wearing at different rates, interchangability between which pairs of SPD shoes on which bikes was just overcomplicating things.

i think its cos the stock advice now is to learn on flats - people buying bikes are advised to get flats to learn on. therefore more people start on flats and once confident the move to spd`s is harder to justify.

i ride both and see teh benefits of both. for decent length rides spds are more efficient but it does limit that 'ooh a cheeky wallride, i'll give that a go' aspect to your ride which i miss when i'm clipped in.

100% about flexibility for me. My bikes get used for riding with my two young children, club xc out in the hills riding and utility trips. I would be changing pedals twice or more a week and frankly I cannot be bothered. If I was planning a rare full on day in the South Downs I might bung the spuds back on for the extra arch support from the disco slippers.

I also think my pedalling action (flexing properly at the ankle) is better on flats because it needs to be.

there is a certain percentage of 'serious' or shall we say snobby mtb riders than consider spds to be what you choose when you are serious about mtbing, like 'pahh he's still on flats, must be an amateur'
I've noticed this on here and other forums and within my local mtb club. I prefer flats too. DMR V8s here.

Eh? Where did you get all that from?
Has anyone ever actually said something like that to you?
If anything STW seems to be full "Flat pedal evangelists" at the minute but I don't think there's quite the tension over pedal choice that you seem to imagine?

I'd say the vast majority of MTBers actually DGAF, it's only bike-bores that over think and then "Tribalise" these minor kit choice "issues"...

My personal "Journey" with pedals has been Clips and Straps for a most of the 90s, went to riding flats in the late 90s stuck with that through the 00s and took up SPDs in the last 3-4 years or so and now only ride SPDs...

Apparently I buck the supposed current "trend" but the reality is that people use whatever they believe works best for them, I simply decided SPDs worked for me (after years of resistance), I could pick up flats again tomorrow, but I'm not all that bothered by them at the minute...

Both clips and flats are used quite successfully by all sorts of riders for all sorts of riding, its really not a big deal... Honest.

SPD's for 90% of riding, except i switch to flats for riding in the Alps, don't know why, just prefer it being easier to bail out, plus find it easier getting on/off chair lifts and pushing the bike.

And flats on the fat bike, mostly ride on sand, so often just grind to a half and flats and large standover mean i still have both testicles.

cookeaa - Member

Eh? Where did you get all that from?
Has anyone ever actually said something like that to you?

I've had, in all seriousness, "Surprised you've not upgraded to SPDs, you're quite good now". Like flats were something I was supposed to have grown out of.

Fashion isn't it? Sam Hill won some stuff, Steve Jones decoded it must be because he was on flat pedals and everyone decided that rad riders wear flats.

I prefer SPDs for all riding, I find I have much greater control over what the bike is doing, don't dab and my feet will not come off the pedals unless I want them to. Flats for me are a backwards step, and I have noticed that the fastest dh riders (the ones winning world cups) are back on spds again now.

it's a fashion thing.
fashion stating previously "SPDs are for serious cyclists" so most were on spds and now "flats are for gnarr cyclists" and we get a big shift to flats.

This.

I think that now you can buy a 160mm bike you can pedal all day, switching to flats just reflects that fact. Even probably 5 or 6 years ago, a 160mm bike was compromised for everyday use in the UK, and so most people had an HT or shirt travel FS, and rode in SPD's. Now you can buy a super capable mince tank yet riding it anywhere, i think more people have moved to flats to suit the more technical riding that bike can support. And the trail centre point made above is pretty valid to i think

I've never had a crank spin round and **** me in the shins since I went to SPDs, and for that alone I'll stick with them. I do pedal noticeably better on them too, but that could be be familiarity.
Probably just use case though - how many flat pedal users are out doing 20-30 miles with a few bits of nice singletrack vs hammering technical terrain? My riding is mainly the former, and I prefer SPD for it.

munrobiker - Member

Fashion isn't it? Sam Hill won some stuff, Steve Jones decoded it must be because he was on flat pedals and everyone decided that rad riders wear flats.

Then last year, Pinkbike ran a pseudo-science article "proving" that SPDs were best, because only one rider had won a world cup race on flats in the 2 seasons before. But ignoring that only 4 riders had won a world cup at all- so what it basically meant was "Whatever Aaron Gwin and Greg Minaar have on their feet wins races"

My switch was for medical reasons, my leg's not keen on any sort of twisting but still, I'm probably as happy on flats as I ever was on SPDs. And I love that I can just jump on my bikes and go

For me, it's so I can do this round Cannock...

[img] [/img]

[i]SPDs for general trail riding, most natural stuff, and all that just get out and ride stuff.
Flats for trail centres, and the slightly more technical or mountainous natural stuff.
[/i]

This.

If I'm riding by myself or looking at XCing with 1 or 2 others I'll run SPD's> If we are going for a local group ride it's bound to include a load of (more) technical stuff - so flats.

[i]how many flat pedal users are out doing 20-30 miles with a few bits of nice singletrack vs hammering technical terrain? My riding is mainly the former, and I prefer SPD for it. [/i]

When I was Southern-based it just wasn't worth going flats for the few yards of real techie stuff, but now living in Scotland I've downhill trails that last for nearly a mile 🙂

I can't speak for anyone else, but the thought of having to change my shoes in order to just dick about on a bike makes me sad.

I've always used SPDs and like being connected to the bike. Other than that I couldn't care less what other people use, like or dislike TBH

It's probably a mixture of fashion and what you are used to. There's also the cost of switching: it used to be that switching to SPDs was the expensive direction but looking at flats nowadays there isn't much between switching either way. Give or take: pedals - £50, shoes - £90, you might need shin pads when going to flats as well.

When SPDs first came out most flat pedals weren't particularly good so the benefits of clipless outweighed the cost of switching. Modern flats are much better so the difference is much less.

[i]I can't speak for anyone else, but the thought of having to change my shoes in order to just dick about on a bike makes me sad. [/i]

What, you think we carry whichever shoes/pedals we aren't using just in case? 😉

how many flat pedal users are out doing 20-30 miles with a few bits of nice singletrack vs hammering technical terrain?

a 30-40km ride for me is quite common. I've tried SPD's and didn't like them, feel far more confident and happy on flats. So, it's flats for me.

Like most things, it's largely fashion.

For me, SPDs are more efficient for flat-out XC speed. Lots of the guys I ride with are (unfashionably) into sprinting about all over the place and I find keeping up with them on flats is a pain.

I prefer flats for those (fashionable) technical, downhill-orientated rides where you're not rushing up the hills and along the flat bits.

As has been said, it's mostly fashion. SPD's used to be in fashion, now flats are. Just the same way as an upright riding position was in fashion, then a low, race position with narrow bars, now back to upright with bars getting wider everyday. Other examples are available.

As much as the mags and sites like this praise the current trends as the greatest thing ever, they were doing exactly the same for the old fashionable things in the past. I remember when long, slack bikes were scoffed at even though the benifit of them now was still the case then. If you shout loud enough and repeat it over and over people will believe you.

Recently had a foray with flats after years of spuds.

Flats were 100% responsible* for my now broken scaphoid. If I was clipped in I wouldn't have superman'd and landed on my hands, I'd have stuck with the bike and landed on my elbow pads / shoulder / hip.

*not necessarily true

What scares SPD users from riding flats for XC is the fear that it'll make them much slower because of the huge loss in efficiency - but it's simply not true. Yes there is a marginal gain hence it would be foolish to do serious XC racing in flats (except in really muddy conditions) but it is a tiny difference in average long-term applied power.

When I started riding again in 2009 most in my circle were on clips but now it's definitely the other way around. Some of the clips riders have switched to flats all/part of the time but most newcomers are starting on flats and staying on flats.

Why would you want to wear SPDs for a GMBC ride? You'll only get 10' before you need to unclip and wait for someone to stop faffing. 😛

GHill - Member
Why would you want to wear SPDs for a GMBC ride? You'll only get 10' before you need to unclip and wait for someone to stop faffing.

Posted 1 minute ago # Report-Post

iainc - Member
I guess youre missing us then Grant ?

Only for the cafe stops and banter 😉

I agree that the speed advantage of SPDs is marginal. But it is real and noticeable when riding hard.

For me, the advantages of flats are marginal, too. When I use them it's because I like the feel/experience, not because they are 'better'.

Spuds are cheating, but then again, I still use clips and straps.