I have trp spyres on my diverge and they do work but they take 10x the power though the levers to stop me (I do weight 16 stone) compared to hydraulics.
Apart from price and maybe if you are doing some middle of nowhere touring cable discs are just hugely inferior to hydraulics, I want to slow down without feeling like I'm going to bend the bars...
The biggest improvement I've heard of for cable discs is segmented aluminum outer and a proper shimano stainless inner.
It was going to be the next stage for one of my bikes about 5 years ago. But a elixir warranty took so long that i bought some slx instead. And the warranty pair came back with xt stamped all over them. 😉
I think i now have 2 or 3 sets of bb5 and 7 in a box in the attic.
Got bb7's on my cx. They're fab and way better than cantis. I swapped out the Magura MT2's on my ss/rigid/adventure/gravel/bikepacking/touring machine for bb7's (mtn version) and have run them with both flat bar levers and v-brake compatible sti levers. Always reliable and better than low quality hydros. Much easier to fix at a campsite.
I won't however be swapping my slx or deore hydros from my proper mtb bikes. I just get the impression with the hydros that there is more power on tap and they're less prone to gunk in the gubbins.
I've used Hayes, Juicy 3's, Juicy Carbons and Tektro something hydraulics. I now use BB7's.
The hydraulics were great but brake-fade on long descents was an occasional issue - could be pads, could be fluid.
I've not had brake fade with the BB7's (touch wood) but that could be because I don't ride down steep hills any more. 😀
With all hydraulics. but consistently with Avids there was always the eventual "lever to the bar moment" when they failed - bleeding by LBS or myself was only a temporary solution.
As we frequently inverted the bikes to remove both wheels (to get the bikes in the car), we found that hydraulics (specifically Avids) didn't like this and would require "pumping up" or in some cases bleeding - not an issue with the BB7's.
In my view BB7's aren't [i]quite [/i]as good as a set of working hydros but are fine. The tips for BB7's I've gathered are:
- Follow the setup guide closely.
- Use Avid Speed Dial 7 levers - they seem better than "normal" levers.
- Don't blame the brakes if you're using after-market pads/rotors.
- Pads and rotors need time to bed in.
- Not everything that comes off Ebay is genuine.
The downsides to the BB7's have been:
- After rough & rocky hooligan rides they often need adjustment - not just pads, sometimes the caliper needs aligning. I think this might be a general issue with the Avid caliper locating hardware as occasionally the hydro brakes did to.
- The cables really need to be replaced regularly.
- For uninterrupted, fully enclosed cable runs to the rear caliper, they can become sticky - I solved this with a Middleburn cable oiler (hardtail) but as Middleburn have gone TU, alternatives may be needed.
I run BB7s with speed dial levers on my Hemlock using 203/180mm rotors. Bike is 30lbs, I'm 12.5 stone and ride up to T3+. Never felt the need for anything else.
Can set up a pair in ten minutes, and pad adjustment is a one minute job.
ton - Member
long term user of avid bb7 here. anyone who say's they are not as good as hydro's has A. never used them, or B. never set them up correctly.
Agree. They are good brakes. Just don't cheapskate on the bits that aren't BB7 (ie cables and levers) and don't let numpties set them up. If good hydraulic brakes came as a set of components we'd hear the same sort of complaints.
They are getting long in the tooth though. I've been trialling Spyres with the double action for a year and that's what I'll use from now on.
I would consider cables again after my Shimano Hydraulic fiasco.
Just sent my 2nd RS785 caliper back after leaking!
Right at the start of cross season.
Funnily enough the rear brake feels superb!
Any more issues I am thinking of a Hope v-twin or maybe the TRP part cable part hydraulic caliper?
Thanks,
Max
I have trp spyres on my diverge and they do work but they take 10x the power though the levers to stop me (I do weight 16 stone) compared to hydraulics.
I *think* the levers on the Diverge (Tiagra 4700?) have a 'variable pull ratio', so they have very little leverage in the first part of their travel. Mine seemed to work better when set up with a lot of slack in the cable (as opposed to the normal advice to 'preload' the arm on the caliper when fitting the cable), but they're still not as good / confidence inspiring as Shimano MTB hydraulics.
I reckon most road bike levers are far too flexy for disk brakes - you lose too much effort in flexing the lever.
That's why I went to great lengths to track down a dropbar which takes mtb levers.
I'm getting the impression that cable discs are fine but only if you get superior after-market ones rather than the ones the bike came with.
[quote="epicyclo"]I reckon most road bike levers are far too flexy for disk brakes - you lose too much effort in flexing the lever.What sort of crappy levers are you using? And how many holes have you drilled in them?
Got one (BB7) on the front of my single speed which has always been capable of sending you over the bars for greedy lever grabs. More impressively, it is still on its original pads of 12 years ago.
Wifes bike has cable Avids too as they work with the combined levers she likes and are more predictable than hydros.
Lighter feel at the lever is all hydros really have going for them.
The only real issue I had with BB7's is they'd need a bit of cleaning and maintenance if using them regularly in wet/muddy conditions. By comparison the Shimano hydro's I have on most of my bikes now seem almost completely maintenance free in comparison.
I'm getting the impression that cable discs are fine but only if you get superior after-market ones rather than the ones the bike came with.
My Genesis came with TRP Spyres which *are* the superior after-market ones. They are at least as good as the BB7s on the bike it replaced and with being dual piston setup is a lot simpler.
Spyres are great until grit and grime get into the bearing mechanism.
Then the arm starts sticking and brake lever feel is very heavy.
Two years on my cross bike was what it took to stop them working.
Probably not so much an issue on a road bike.
Thanks,
Max
ghostlymachine - Member
'epicyclo » I reckon most road bike levers are far too flexy for disk brakes - you lose too much effort in flexing the lever.'
What sort of crappy levers are you using? And how many holes have you drilled in them?
They feel perfectly fine until you replace them with a mtb lever, then you realise they flex.
Drilling holes? I suspect you must know me. 🙂
Funnily enough I've used both extensively, and the level of flex in either is well below the threshold of what you'd be able to feel. I reckon what you've felt is the difference in cable/system compression, added to the changes in leverage ratios.
Unless you were using mtb disc calipers with road levers. In which case you deserve all you get.
ghostlymachine - Member
...I reckon what you've felt is the difference in cable/system compression, added to the changes in leverage ratios.Unless you were using mtb disc calipers with road levers. In which case you deserve all you get.
I usually use tubing instead of cable outer so my system is virtually compressionless other than the short run to the bars, and it's when using that that the difference can be felt.
I do know the difference between the various lever pulls. 🙂
[url= https://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1702/26616203305_8fa7053c19_b.jp g" target="_blank">https://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1702/26616203305_8fa7053c19_b.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
[url= https://flic.kr/p/GxYZWZ ]OK I will stop tinkering eventually, but you've got to admit these new #shimano #dxr levers look pretty sweet on my @traversbikes #RussTi[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/jimbosussexmtb/ ]Jim Barrow[/url], on Flickr
I've got TRP Spykes on one bike, I used Shimano DXR levers, purely because they were shiney, but they actually have a really strong spring in them so work well and I don't have any issue with them sticking. The only time I would say the brakes were any worse than a hydraulic was on some of the long descents, ten miles plus, on the divide. Then I did get aching hands and struggle to pull them. Super reliable though, which was exactly what I was looking for.
My Tripster has HyRd's on it and they are good, but TBH I'm thinking of changing to Spyres because the Spykes are so good on my Travers, I prefer the look of them too.
My "normal" MTB has XT's on it if that is relevant.
