which bit? the bit where the cables stretch more than hydraulics? I think thats fairly proven.
But the fact is that the compression characteristics of cable brakes mean that they can not generate as much pad pressure for the same lever throw
The physics not withstanding - I’ll let someone else bother with why that’s illogical - Which is it ? Compression or stretch ?
Compression or stretch ?
as far as I understand, a bit of both. The inner stretches and the outer compresses. Hydro outers expand a little too, you can sometimes see the outer move a little when you clamp your brake on hard.
The amount of stretch in a good quality brake cable inner will be negligible. Cheap outers will compress, especially if the ends haven't been cut square. With good quality levers and outer cables, it's barely a problem as long as you keep them lubricated and adjusted. You should be able to set them up with very little free play in the system and run the levers quite close to the bars.
Hydro simply wouldn’t have failed.
how do you work that out?
No one who has hydraulic brakes has ever had an issue with them, ever.
Things fail. some things more than others, usually down to user error. I dont think there is much in it Hydraulic vs cable disk brakes.
When hydraulics go wrong it’s often expensive and time consuming requiring bespoke parts
Shimano aside - when do hydraulics just "go wrong"? I can count on 1 finger the number of times I've had a trailside issue that couldn't be repaired and that's in almost 18y of riding. Even that was caused by a random branch/cable interaction which bend a braided line to such an extent that I couldn't get fluid through it.
Well if cable brakes are as so amazing I probably have some BB7s in a box somewhere. Yours for only £200 a pair.
A friend, swayed by the argument of easier maintenance, fitted cable discs to her audax bike for TransCon.
When the brakes failed, she was stuck up the top of a mountain in freezing conditions and heavy rain unable to actually do any repair cos she couldn’t even feel her fingers never mind adjust cables and bite point.Hydro simply wouldn’t have failed.
Her bikes now have hydro discs and no further failures.
Yet..
Cable discs don't 'fail' in that way though, they drift out of adjustment. Your friend may have been using equipment she wasn't familiar enough with to be racing on, that's all. Left the simple cable tension adjustments too long. Or would have been in the same position with any brake if it was replacing pads on a brake with frozen fingers.
I've raced long distances and done plenty of touring on cable discs, 12 years on, zero problems*. I spoke to someone last week who was looking for shortcuts off an event route due to failed hydro piston seal. It's all just anecdata though.
*for balance I also have 11 year old XT hydros on a bike that have been bled 3x in that time, they work perfectly. Wouldn't race/tour on them though for fixability reasons.
Edge cases do not make an argument, how many people are going to be half way up the Andes when their hydro or mechanical discs fail.
Hydro discs for the vast majority of users are pretty much fit and forget, for years. I’ve taken old deores out of the spares box and fitted then to my kids bike recently and they were as good as when I bought them.
They are just better in every way. It’s why professionals now use them, it’s why high end bikes use them. It’s why high end cable discs are an edge case not the norm. Arguing against it is like saying solid tyres were better because you never got a puncture
Edge cases do not make an argument,
Exactly, anecdata. They can illustrate a point though.
how many people are going to be half way up the Andes when their hydro or mechanical discs fail.
Very few. More of us go away 1-2x s a year in the UK or Europe, trips that are massively valued and hard to get time for. Wales or the Andes, no matter, the performance of hydros might not be needed and minimised failure or problem points that can't be fixed trailside might be more valued. That's all really. No-one's saying hydros aren't better performers. Cable brakes are simply good enough for some uses (or some bike builds) where they have advantages outside of pure performance.
It’s kinda like those memes where folk correct others confidently but wrongly.
I dont agree with your flat denial and attempt to troll. I started on canti brakes, then on to V brakes when they came in so i kind of know that theres a bit of stretch in cables, even the per-stretched cables. There is a bit of give.
And yes, I set them up properly. You pull on them, pad hits rim, and you can still pull on the lever a bit taking up the springiness of the cable.
I don't think there needs to be an argument here. Hydro's are 'better' than cable disks are 'better' than vees are 'better' than cantis - no doubt.
But, they all still have their place. Cantis for a superlight CX racing bike, vees for utility or lightness, cables disks for peace of mind reliability and hydro for fit and forget performance.
Choosing any of them does not make you right (or wrong) or in fact a better person. You're just choosing the 'right' tool for the job.
I don't understand the evangelical arguments and, yes, I have and have had all of them plus U brakes (shudders).
I've had good U brakes, Odyssey Springfield's, on my BMX. I'd rate them well above above the Tektro caliper brakes I had on my Aether.
Choosing any of them does not make you right (or wrong) or in fact a better person.
Hold on, I think the internet masses will disagree! 😀
