[Closed] FS 29ers - "xc" vs "trail bikes" ?

(& I have a nice 29er HT, that I mostly run SS rigid bit it can take gears and sus forks, so just overlapping with that in terms of functionality is pointless).

my nicolai helius AC has 120mm of controlled Horst Link stable platform.

it's a perfect trail bike.

gravity sports could hook you up on a nicolai within your upper budget i'd expect.....

[url= http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8241/8458674400_1181c44d53.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8241/8458674400_1181c44d53.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/62031621@N06/8458674400/ ]IMAG0089[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/62031621@N06/ ]the_lecht_rocks[/url], on Flickr

oh, mine has a seemingly steep HA at around a measured 71 deg but it keeps the wheelbase shorter and it's brilliantly nimble for a wagon wheeler.

have a looky on twentynineinches.com they have some brilliant real world reviews of all the sorts of thing you want

I loved my Anthem, very capable xc bike. My Trance is a beast though and is much more at home on the trails

I've plumped for an Anthem X1, should have it in a couple of weeks to compliment my Kinesis FF29 HT; the Whyte is heavy and not as good spec for the same money IMHO.

You'll be surprised what you can ride with 'only' a 100mm 29'er, I'm faster both up & down at places such as Llandegla and The Marin, also Lee Quarry too on my Kinesis than I was on my 26" wheeled Nicolai Helius CC (130mm FS), so I can only imagine the Anthem is gonna be faster still, especially once it points down 😯

My non-trail center based riding takes in a lot of woodsy, rooty single track and again the 100mm 29'er is faster.

I can't offer anything more than questions I'm afraid, but why a 29er?

I'm also intrigued by the notion that you don't need long and slack bikes to get down technical stuff. I tend to agree that longer and slacker just lets you go down faster (with bigger consequences when you crash) but doesn't actually let you get down anything that you couldn't ride on a shorter travel, steeper bike.

That nicolai would be the perfect test of this theory I guess. A 71 degree HA with "only" 120mm of travel sounds as though it's not going to handle anything too technical. But it probably does just fine in the right hands.

FWIW (which is basically nothing) my totally subjective and uninformed choice would be an Orange Gyro.

Why FS? I have a SS rigid Curtis 29er for general xc use and just built a 2 souls quarterhorse as a trail bike, 140mm fork, dropper post, and 2 x 10, taking this to Spain later this year. Rides fantastic too.

Some of us are softer than you my friend!

Not much I can´t get down / have´t got down on the Orbea Occam I tested a while back. [url= http://www.basquemtb.com/orbea-occam-29er-s1-mountain-bike-review/ ]Orbea Occam S10[/url]

They do aluminium ones too which I´m hoping to test soon. I´d probably buy an Aluminium H30X I think it is, with the 120mm fork.

Thx all.

Why 29s? I'm a 29 convert. I don't want to get into 26 vs 29, but it's 29 for me.

Why FS? Because I have nice HT (which I happen to run SS rigid but coud take forks/gears) so I want something "more different" than a slacker HT.

But it's all to play for, perhaps I'll go full circle and stick with my Blur.

@vinny, what do you call a 'trail'? I was thinking this at CYB, the climbs are XC the descents are XC but a tiny bit steeper with a few tidy rocks.

I live & ride down south, I guess actually my experience of real 'trails' if that means the Lakes, Scotland etc, au naturel, is limited.

If you're after a more XC orientated bike then the C'Dale Scalpel 29er looks great. I've got the hardtail Flash alloy 29er and to be honest I use it more like a trail bike than an XC and it handles it fine. It also climbs like a train, really irons out the trail and is extremely manoeuvrable when things get technical (every bit as manoeuvrable as any 26er i've had, if not more). If the Scalpel is anything like the Flash, it'll be a real serious machine.

That Occam is nice. But £7k .. nah. Yes an aluminium version could be interesting.

Nicolais and Oranges always look a bit girdery to me, but I haven't ridden them. Yeah the Gyro could be a contender.

Scalpel - could be, thx for the idea. I don't think I have a dealer local.

I'd happily wheel a Trek Rumblefish out the bike shop door if I had a few G's spare. I couldn't believe a mountain bike could move so quick, but feel so in control. Absolutely not what I was expecting.

Went to a bike demo recently at Dalby & tried a Pace RC129, Santa Cruz Tallboy, Santa Cruz Superlight 29er, Santa Cruz TRc, Scott Genius 720 (650b) but the best & last bike I tested was a Scott Spark 920 (29er). It just felt right, light & capable.

In WhatMTB? there's a full range of short travel 29ers on test - the Whyte M109 won.

Or Salsa Spearfish custom build - frame £640.

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or the ellsworth are all ones I keep considereing

First ride on my Anthem X1 today and over the moon with it. Mines a 2013 model and got it for a cracking price. If your interested in one mail me and I'll put you in touch with the shop I got it from.

Steve thx I have a Giant dealer locally.

I love my Salsa Horsethief, it's chuffing awesome.

Matt, I was in the same boat last year. XC 29 or Trail version. From testing it was vey clear for me - XC bikes suited me much more thatpn trails bikes. Then like you, my head has been turned by Trance 29 ER. So doing a head to head demo of trance versus anthem to finally make my mind up!! I will report back!!! Of course, I am also complicating things by demoing a cube AMS 120 pro this week as well.

I have a Lapierre XR529 which is a 10.7kg 100mm XC race whippet(ish) after a wheel upgrade and love thrashing it round the trails. Here's some poorly angled GoPro clips from CYB for your comparison: [url=

The Devinci looks nice, and the Rocky, are you secret gearie Taz?

And any bike like the Rumblefish that has the shock inline below the top tube looks right to me.

There's too much choice really.

You really want a Nicolai.....
[url= http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8526/8481912373_6120a3616d.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8526/8481912373_6120a3616d.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/62031621@N06/8481912373/ ]IMAG0103[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/62031621@N06/ ]the_lecht_rocks[/url], on Flickr

@teamhurtmore I responded on the thread we were using a couple of days ago btw - there is a Giant dealer in Guildford in case you're not aware. Yeah report back pls!

sorry lecht but it totally does not float my boat visually! but I'll demo one if I can 4s, ta for the recommendation.

are you secret gearie Taz?

Only for serious stuff, considering the south downs double, 29er boing and gears perfect for the under 24hrs I want...will then do it SS for a personal challenge and aim for under 30

Only for serious stuff, considering the south downs double, 29er boing and gears perfect for the under 24hrs I want...will then do it SS for a personal challenge and aim for under 30

Count me in!! 😉

I have had a Specialized Camber since November and for me it does all the things you want it to. Climbs very well and has already saved me from some ambition over ability descents so far. Just need some nice dusty trails now like in the brochure.....

Sorry Matt I have been away. I know about the store thanks. Looking forward to straight head to head on the same runs. One day bashing around SH, the other more XC stuff up and around Punchbowl area. Should clarify the mind.

Tried a davinci 26 last summer, nice bike v other 26 trails (stumpy, fuel ex) but why the extra price? Can't see that one.

Count me in!!

for the SS or geared version clinky?

when it was all shiny and new....
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How about the canyon nerve 29, looks great on paper, just lack of test ride means its a bit of gamble. Tried and tested linkage though. Or transition bandit?

Count me in!!
for the SS or geared version clinky?

Either/both!

Canyons look OK Gotama, have you ridden one?

So 20 hours later I'm thinking for a trailsy XC/ST bike rather than a full-on trail bike. As someone said at the beginning, most bikes can get down most things, pilot allowing, and I'm not an edge of the seat rider anyway. Also I quite enjoy a bit of a climb.

And I'm thinking max budget £3k and a tad, to include dropper, but happy to spend less. Value is king. I'm liking the look of the M109S especially those wheels, but overall it comes out a bit heavy.

(or an XC-ST ish trail bike!)

With your budget Matt, you should also try the Spesh epic. IMO head and shoulders above other XCs I demoed when it came to climbing. Flew up Pitch Fire Roads as if it had a motor on it. Fast down and very manageable - but the difference not as noticeable against its brilliant climbing ability. I demoed the epic expert carbon (but sadly 4k, which I won't spend on a MTB)

As someone said at the beginning, most bikes can get down most things, pilot allowing, and I'm not an edge of the seat rider anyway. Also I quite enjoy a bit of a climb.

I think that was me, but would you really be comfortable riding down a steep technical section on something with 100mm of travel and a 71 degree HA? That's a genuine question. I have no idea, but would be nervous of getting a bike that would exclude me from some trails.

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My Trance 29er in the Peaks yesterday....by god do I love it (my first full susser and first 29er). Feels so stable on descents and rolls over anything, rocks/boulders/walkers etc 🙂

Did I mention that I love it!

I think that was me, but would you really be comfortable riding down a steep technical section on something with 100mm of travel and a 71 degree HA? That's a genuine question. I have no idea, but would be nervous of getting a bike that would exclude me from some trails.

I have no idea either!

(If I don't like the look of something nowadays I walk anyway, I've served my hospital time and have nothing to prove).

@th yeah 4k's too much, 3.5 is probably too. I'm going to go ponder and ride my 9 year old Blur a bit more. I'll look at the Epic ta, somehow I don't see myself on Spesh but that's a bit of inverted snobbery partly. Cycleworks Leatherhead are doing a demo day in March @ Holmbury btw.

roverpig - Member

but would you really be comfortable riding down a steep technical section on something with 100mm of travel and a 71 degree HA? That's a genuine question. I have no idea, but would be nervous of getting a bike that would exclude me from some trails.

short forks can be great on really steep techy stuff, they don't dive as much when you use the brakes.

and we like slack head angles when we're riding down steep stuff as it pushes the front wheel out in front - which helps with the weight balance. More or less the same thing can be achieved with a longer 'front centre' (BB to front axle).

i may be wrong, but it seems to me that there's a trend towards longer front-centres on bikes these days - paired with shorter stems.

Thanks. That ties in with my experiences too for what it's worth. I've been playing with an old Five with a 150mm fork that I've set up to be very slack (66 degree HA) and a newer Trance with a 125mm fork and a 69 degree HA. What surprised me was that I felt more comfortable on the shorter steeper Trance than the longer slacker Five. Not what I was expecting at all, but it's basically for the reasons that you state. The longer travel on the Five means larger changes in geometry as the fork compresses. The Trance is also a large, where the Five is a medium. So, despite being steeper the distance from the BB to the front wheel is pretty much the same on both bikes.

Of course this doesn't mean that longer and slacker is wrong. For those that want to fly down without touching the brakes I'm sure the self centring effect of the slacker HA comes in very handy. But for those of us who nervously pick our way down steep sections it doesn't seem that longer and slacker actually provides any benefits at all. In fact, if anything, it makes things harder and that's before we even get to climbing back up again.

@roverpig if that all adds up (& it makes sense to me) I think you've just confirmed slack & big boing isn't what I want. (Thx).

No problem, although I'd wait to have it confirmed by somebody who knows what they are talking about before spending any money 🙂

dickie - Member
Went to a bike demo recently at Dalby & tried a Pace RC129, Santa Cruz Tallboy, Santa Cruz Superlight 29er, Santa Cruz TRc, Scott Genius 720 (650b) but the best & last bike I tested was a Scott Spark 920 (29er). It just felt right, light & capable.

I had a Spark on loan and agree that it's a really nice bike which fits well between the full-on xc race type FS and a slacker longer trail bike. When locked out it was super quick on the climbs and it felt great descending. My only bike is a Spesh Enduro so I expected it to be lacking on the descents but I really liked it. I had a Carbon version with alloy rear end. Spark 30 I think. Well worth a look.