Fort Bill axed from 2025 uci dh

Where has replaced it? i.e. whose gain is this loss

It's been common knowledge in Fort William for roughly six months. I think competitors had complained that the course is too long.

There was also a change of dates this year which didnt help as organisers managed to pick a date that clashed with the Scottish Six day Trials, already the busiest week of the year in Fort William

This  was not a factor in the decision but didnt win UCI any friends amongst accomodation providers.

Surprised to hear this as always popular with fans and riders.

is this correct though? I was told by someone on the race circuit that it was actually very unpopular with riders

It does seem to be a number of factors, and lets be honest there was a wobble a couple of years back I think?
Disappointed we won't get to go see another, we really enjoyed going.

Mixed reactions, I thought that Fort William was consistently voted best dh of the season by riders?

I can understand it in a way, its a schlep of a road trip from the Euro mainland races and has Brexit added another layer of asshattery?

This change may have been on teh cards as Mike and Lesley at Rare Management opted out a while back.

I've many great memories of working on the event, some great people were involved to make it all happen and I've seen some iconic racing there. Sad for the change, I hope at some point it returns.

On teh up-side, Lenzerheide is back with a DH and XC full program....

I think it's one of the best venues when it comes to support but I don't think it's one of the best courses, too much of it is man made IMO.

That’s a shame, really enjoyed this years with my lad. He’s five and really enjoyed a lads and dad weekend biking, watching biking, camping and gondolas. He’s been buzzing about going back next year.
I can see various reasons though, long road trip from Europe as above, a long track that some competitors didn’t like, this years clashed with the trials, weather can be “challenging” and times move on. Tracks change, styles change.

I must be rest dense. Can some one give an example of a downhill track that isn’t man made?

Fort William is really dull race TV wise. Speed and brutality of top section doesn’t come across and not much in the way of line choice. Riders disappear into the woods then reappear minutes later with big  time gaps, then it’s onto the motorway jumps and again little in the way of line choice and almost always by then the race is already won/lost.

Can some one give an example of a downhill track that isn’t man made?

obvs they are all man made, but lots of board walk, sculpted jumps and berms etc as opposed to a much more natural feeling trail.

**** the UCI

**** Discovery

RIP DH.

If you watch all the Vital Raw and Wyn TV stuff you'd have noticed that the riders have been openly critical of Fort Bill for years now. I know it used to be wildly popular and it was like party time all week but that was 20 years ago now.

For the teams it's really expensive and logistically difficult to get to compared to every other round.

Other long standing venues like MSA, VDS, Vallnord always seem to come up with new routes and features to keep it interesting. Fort Bill is practically set in stone.

There's 10 races next year. I'm quite happy to see a break from FB and see what the new venues are like.

It was always going to happen someday, better it went out on a high than a slide into crapness like other venues have. Change is good, yes it sucks from a local perspective but maybe it will be to the benefit of the venue in the long run and we get more variety.

I've heard it's hosting the European DH champs next season

I think competitors had complained that the course is too long.

Pffft I manged down it fine and I never got it groomed prior to riding it. *** pro riders Pah!

Fort William is really dull race TV wise. Speed and brutality of top section doesn’t come across and not much in the way of line choice. Riders disappear into the woods then reappear minutes later with big  time gaps, then it’s onto the motorway jumps and again little in the way of line choice and almost always by then the race is already won/lost.

Nailed it. This totally represents almost every year I watched it.

I'm not understanding this - it's the UK home round of the World Cup downhill and everyone is shrugging their shoulders and meh with its demise.

The top section is fast and brutal but doesn't come across on TV??? That's not a fault of the course.

Lack of camera coverage in the woods isn't a fault of the course

Motorway = TV spectacle

Too far for teams to travel? It's a historic track in a country that's been pivotal to the sport, there's no other gondola mountain in the UK and they've been driving here for 20years including post Brexit so I'm not buying that either.

If Discovery/UCI meddling has resulted in less coverage for the sport/less revenue then that's not a fault of FW.

Always wondered if Dyfi has enough space to hold a WC race. Anyone been who could confirm?

I’m with you RustyNissanPrairie.

As an avid DH watcher (tv not at the venue) I genuinely don’t think it’s any less of a spectacle than many other tracks, in fact it’s significantly better than many as riders can get caught out in a lot of sections rather than some courses where there is less jeopardy. I mean Leogang is a terrible spectacle really if we are comparing how well something translates to tv.

The whole coverage with discovery this year was really poor. Comms were ok especially when Gwin was in the box adding some genuine insight. But they didn’t make the most of the rights they bought IMO. Not sure what future the sport has at the sharp end with various cuts and teams slimming down or pulling.

Back to the OP - I think it’s a huge loss

Huge loss. Been going for 15 years and never tired of the place. I too am amazed at the general lack of interest at the UK losing the World Cup. Hopefully this will be enough of a push to revitalise the team, track and support and get it back to where it should be.

Does anyone actually know if the promoter put in a bid to hold the race next year or are we just assuming the uci turned down their offer of a few hundred grand?

I don’t think fort William is the kind of track Warner bros want going forward, think they’d be happy with 10 versions of Andorra cos people who don’t know about bikes can understand big jumps, but riding over some rocks doesn’t look as spectacular. See also rampage this weekend with fairclough vs the others

I’m not understanding this – it’s the UK home round of the World Cup downhill and everyone is shrugging their shoulders and meh with its demise.

Yeah, over 20 years.

Where else has been on the calendar for as long?

It's had a bloody good run, I remember the double header 4x years. I don't think Nevis have put a shovel near that track since Phil Saxena walked off of it. Its been in the doldrums for years, the last good thing built was Top Chief and that must have been about the same time they realigned the WC track to run from the gondola station.

It's great but it would be better if it offered more. There's no reason it couldn't but it's currently stuck in a rut and needs to dig itself out. I think it will, snow seasons are shorter and less predictable and now they don't have a guaranteed WC slot to take for granted they might take a step back and consider their options.

FWIW I don't buy course length issue either, it's the WC not mini-DH.

I don’t think Nevis have put a shovel near that track since Phil Saxena walked off of it.

What?

There's been loads of changes from the deer gate down in the last 10+ years

Riders don't like it because it's too long and/or too hard ?

Sounds like DH riders have gone soft.

It is a damn shame but tbh which tracks get a visit every year? Leogang, les gets, msa and fort william including champs, if I'm right? (nothing in the rules obviously, I'm just fairly sure they're the only venues that have been every year for the last 5).

I'm curious if they'll have the desire and the ability to put on a big show anyway. You can't beat the worlds but,something like the first time Tweedlove "lost" ie could not be *ed dealing with the EWS and just did the Our Own Event With Hookers And Blackjack thing. Fort William Invitational. Maybe a bit late to bring back kill the bill eh. * it, run the endurance race again with the big noise again, do something to keep the place in the eye. Big weekend/bookended week of stuff. WHo knows maybe they could even...

squirrelking
Free Member

It’s had a bloody good run, I remember the double header 4x years. I don’t think Nevis have put a shovel near that track since Phil Saxena walked off of it.

Yeah but that's pretty much inevitable, the economics just don't make any sense. They do just enough to keep it basically fit for purpose, but of course 4X tracks are so expensive to build/rebuild. They hosted a protour in, what, 2022 but even the uk series can't be bothered and no wonder, it's a bloody long way to ride the same old track but also the series is about the only southern dominated bike racing there is- not a single event north of Bedford last season.

Meanwhile they're basically guaranteed 2 big dh races a year plus the everyday income, plus they've still got a blue to un****. Nothing to be done about it unless you've got a golden goose.

Riders don’t like it because it’s too long and/or too hard ?

Sounds like DH riders have gone soft.

Just for balance I've never heard any of the riders say this.

Fort William is really dull race TV wise. Speed and brutality of top section doesn’t come across and not much in the way of line choice. Riders disappear into the woods then reappear minutes later with big  time gaps, then it’s onto the motorway jumps and again little in the way of line choice and almost always by then the race is already won/lost.

Absoloutely, was dull as **** to watch for years. Recent changes improved thing somewhat but I won't miss it as a fan.

Re. the riders "going soft", I think it's more that the course isn't as challenging as they'd like. I can ride all the tech bits on my enduro bike without getting scared, and I bet I couldn't do that at any of the other rounds.

There's a world of difference between mincing down it on an enduro bike and hitting it at elite level speed on a dh bike

There’s a world of difference between mincing down it on an enduro bike and hitting it at elite level speed on a dh bike

Tell that to the racers who moan about it being too easy, not me (winky face emoji)

I think it’s one of the best venues when it comes to support but I don’t think it’s one of the best courses, too much of it is man made IMO.

It's great for infrastructure too, and the track doesn't feel man made in a bad way - it's also punishingly physical - but it's just not got the gradient a WC DH track needs these days.

BoardinBobFull Member
There’s a world of difference between mincing down it on an enduro bike and hitting it at elite level speed on a dh bike

At the speed they go it’s considerably smoother than at mincer pace. Going warp speed keeps you above many of the holes that mortals find themselves in.

Back in the day I had to try (in vain) to keep up with fast folk at the like of Ft Bill and Glencoe. I could actually see they were having an easier time of it than I was but I could never mentally get over the hump to get there.

of course when it goes wrong at those speeds it’s going to really hurt, but such is life.

A great shame. I went every year for 12 years and loved it, but I have not been post covid.

We stopped going as it was all a bit too samey, but it was always a great event with a good crowd of people.

I was only saying last week how much I have missed it and we thought about going next year, a sad loss for the people and the area...but then sometimes 'change' is a good thing??

but then sometimes ‘change’ is a good thing??

Yes but sadly from a UK context this isn't a change, it's an omission. It'd be great if it had changed to somewhere else, but to not have a UK round at all, that's a massive disappointment.

It would be great to see somewhere else in the UK host a world cup DH but without a ski lift it's difficult to see it happening. I know uplift has been used at some venues in the past but it's not a great solution

I absolutely agree as stated in other threads, it can't honestly happen anywhere else currently.

but to not have a UK round at all, that’s a massive disappointment

100% agreed. There's not really another UK venue that currently has the facilities/ infrastructure to host a world cup DH despite there being a few tracks that would be world cup standard. Hopefully it's not the end of world cup DH racing in the UK

While I'm gutted that its not coming back, I have to say I'm unlikely to bother with finals day as having only 45 riders coming down the hill with a 5 minute gap between them doesn't appeal as a spectator..

Nevis can and should tell WBD to GTF and run their own thing instead, whether its Euro Champs or something else. For a Scottish company, ESO has properly screwed over the Scottish race calendar.

I still can't get that upset about it. Fort Bill needs a major revamp.

Next year there are more races than ever before, 2 brand new venues, some we haven't seen for a few years and they've scrapped semi-finals.

If you really can't live without spectating in person organise an STW bus trip to some Euro rounds and I'll chip in for a seat. Loudenvielle and Leogang are on consecutive weekends in June.

On a related note, Warner Brothers are in about $40 BILLION debt. With any luck they'll drop MTB and let Red Bull pick it up.

 I know uplift has been used at some venues in the past but it’s not a great solution

The last one was the Lousa double header during covid. That had a far lower entry turnout than usual, but maybe closer numbers to what they're aiming to have competing in the near future.

Wasn't this year's ft Bill race a last minute addition to make up for lack of other venues?

It would be great to see somewhere else in the UK host a world cup DH but without a ski lift it’s difficult to see it happening. I know uplift has been used at some venues in the past but it’s not a great solution

The Cairngorm Funicular is supposed to be fixed for this coming winter. Time to start campaigning for a DH track there.

🙂

That’s a shame, really enjoyed this years with my lad. He’s five and really enjoyed a lads and dad weekend biking, watching biking, camping and gondolas. He’s been buzzing about going back next year.

Yep, gutted for our wee man (7 now) as we had a brilliant World Champs weekend staying at Glen Nevis, sessioning the new pump track and watching the racing (from the Gondola, mummy vetoed a full track-walk as being too much for little legs).

Really wanted to take him back and walk down the track with him. Hoping a round of the SDA or similar will still cut it.

Neither he nor I can really be bothered with any televised DH footage though.

You could visit and get the chairlift up and then walk down the course though, so that is still possible, just unlikely to have all the tapes out.

They're still using a funicular in Lourdes and it's the only way up for riders and spectators. It's a nightmare. The queue was 2 hours long all weekend in 2022. They extended practice to 6 or 7 pm I think.

Wasn’t this year’s ft Bill race a last minute addition to make up for lack of other venues?

Rings a bell yeah.

So we're saying Fort Bill is basically Chris Ball's late night booty call when he's struck out at the club?

@sharkattack that's basically why Lourdes was dropped. Even when closed to the public, the funicular is too slow to handle the uplift needed for a world cup.

I think competitors had complained that the course is too long.

Bruni's winning time at Ft William this year was 4:04 Brosnan's winning time at Mont St Anne was 3:54

I think if you've got both of those longer courses and you want to keep just one of them, then keeping MSA is a no-brainer. It's the only other North American/Canadian round; it's just as long and hard (insert your own joke here) but more interesting, and if all the other tracks are in continental Europe it cuts down on everyone's travelling costs.

It's a shame for the large crowds that come to watch, including a lot of kids - there cant be that many other sports where you have such open access to talk to the pros, kids get photos / autographs etc. Shame for the local economy and a shame for GB in general not having a race.

However I'm surprised anyone on here cares - its just a bunch of oiks that don't even pedal up the hill, isnt it 😉 ?