Never said blindly worship, and clearly as with every walk of life there will be some "bad 'un's". But those joining the military normally do so for with good intentions/motives (even if sometimes naive). If you accept that we need a military, then I suggest that the one we have is a good one and those individuals that make it up collectively deserve our gratitude. Of course if you think we should not have armed forces then there is no need for any gratitude.
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Tony Blair snubbed...is this why?
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Posted 1 year ago #
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cheers big n daft I dont tend to disagre with you when you post reasoned stuff... I am not sure which one of us should be most worried by that
Posted 1 year ago # -
CHB - point is simple -= those who have been under fire tend to be far less gung ho about military adventurism than those who haven't.
On that basis I challenged the pro intervention types on here to state what their service was unsuprisingly none of them have served under fire.
Zulu - waffle on all you like. No one is paying any attention.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Ah - the TJ run away defence!
Specific questions TJ - not waffle, specific questions, politely asked, and entirely relevant to your claims! You've made specific allegations, back them up!
i) show me one post that calls for military intervention, that was not posted by you!
ii) can you please Identify a specific non military target that has been deliberately attacked by the coalition
C'mon - answer!
Posted 1 year ago # -
You should go into digging tunnels, Z-11, you'd be very good at it.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Junkyard - Member
cheers big n daft I dont tend to disagre with you when you post reasoned stuff... I am not sure which one of us should be most worried by thatbased on the personal mudslinging directed at me I suggest that you should be worried. Some people on the forum see things in black and white and feel happy to make sweeping generalisations in one context and rail against them in another. All I do is ask questions about the information that supports their view. This seems to upset them and the name calling starts.
at the end of the day it's an internet forum and doesn't really matter. If you really care about something stand for political office and make the changes you want to see happen.
HTH
Posted 1 year ago # -
Re the rebels killing civillians: there is a difference between collateral damage and deliberate targeting.
Are we arming them? We're allowing them to be armed, which is different.
To those talking about armed insurrection against, "the legitimate leader of Libya", putting down any protest through force for 42 years is hardly legitimate is it? I guess the rebels figured that an unarmed insurrection was likely to be unsuccessful.
Those who ask whether we would support a foreign power intervening militarily in the UK to support protest against our Govt; yes I would, if the Tories ruthlessly seized power and put down any opposition through force for 40-odd years. As we have the good luck to live in a democracy, though, the analysis is total hoop!
denegrating the whole army.
Whole Armed Forces!
The argument about Qadhafi being a legitimate target as CinC of the Libyan Armed Forces, if not as head of state, may be convenient but it's true!
Posted 1 year ago # -
The argument about Qadhafi being a legitimate target as CinC of the Libyan Armed Forces, if not as head of state, may be convenient but it's true!
Not according to our prime minister - he reckons that it's not true. He has emphatically stated that Gaddafi is not a target.
Mmm who to believe, Zulu-Eleven or David Cameron ?..........it's a difficult one ain't it ?
Posted 1 year ago # -
Oooh - tricky one. Is there a "neither of the above" option?
Posted 1 year ago # -
putting down any protest through force for 42 years is hardly legitimate is it?
Of course not, but try telling the British forces in NI that.
Posted 1 year ago # -
I'd love at least "ok, I was wrong in that assertion, but...." from TandemJeremy
Come on, do it, do it. No-one's that ridiculously stubborn, are they?
Oh and for the record, it was me that double-tapped Osama.
Good enough credentials?Posted 1 year ago # -
Feefoo - whare was I wrong? Show me I was and I will accept it.
Posted 1 year ago # -
The UK force are acting in obvious breach of UN resolution and they killed a load of civilians the other day.
Give me the evidence of the "obvious" breach.
As Zulu said:
ii) can you please Identify a specific non military target that has been deliberately attacked by the coalition
If you have no evidence then it is just conjecture, not fact.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Feefoo - nothing Zulu says is worth responding to.
Obvious breech - clear bias in not deterring the rebel side from causing civilian deaths, supporting the arming of the rebel side, assaaination attempts.
Plenty of news reports of the civilian deaths
specific non military target. Gaddaffis compound. Civilian deaths acceptable there.
Of course it is just opinion, However the evidence is there.
Posted 1 year ago # -
That is indeed food for thought, but still conjecture at the moment.
I'll leave it there as I have fundamentally different opinions to you about "walking past three kids giving one kid a good kicking and doing absolutely nothing about it"
Trite and facile example, I know, but for me gets to the crux of whether there should or should not be any intervention.
Posted 1 year ago # -
OH in that case I would intervene and indeed I have done so.
however getting involved in the deposing of another countries leader is different and dubious.
In the case of Libya its clear to me that more people will die as a result of our intervention.
Thanks for actually thinking about the issues raised tho
Posted 1 year ago # -
specific non military target. Gaddaffis compound. Civilian deaths acceptable there.
Hahahahhahahahhaaha - 'king hilarious TJ
Whats your garden look like? many concrete bunkers at the end of it - oh, and how many civilian casualties were there in his compound TJ? Any evidence of civilian casualties? camera crews everywhere but no photo's!
The BBC team saw a lot of soldiers inside the compound and some old, light anti-aircraft guns attached to the back of trucks.
"There was a feeling that there were bunkers underground - I saw some air vents," says one member of the BBC team.
Posted 1 year ago # -
I was initially feared the intervention would be gung ho in a Bagdad sort of way. It hasn't been and the death toll remains in hundreds rather than tens of thousands. In my opinion the death toll would have been higher without intervention.
I'm afraid I consider Gaddafi and his sons legitimate targets. They are the ones directing the military attacks on the civilian polulations of the cities that have declared independance. Any military infrastructure and arms under Gaddafi's control are also legitimate targets as far as I'm concerned - wherever they are.
Posted 1 year ago # -
In my opinion the death toll would have been higher without intervention.
So what was the death toll before intervention then ?
Posted 1 year ago # -
So, why was Tony Blair snubbed?
Posted 1 year ago # -
'cause he's a git.
Posted 1 year ago # -
He was busy prepping the Seal team for Osama. (Or he's a git.)
Posted 1 year ago # -
TandemJeremy - Member
Feefoo - nothing Zulu says is worth responding to.
I would have thought comments like that to be beneath you. Zulu makes some very valid points and holds you squarely to account, it would help your credibility to respond to him in the same measured tone that he affords you.
FWIW I think we simply can't afford a war and foreign interventions, justified or otherwise are a costly business.
Posted 1 year ago #
Topic Closed
This topic has been closed to new replies.
