… to replace my 853 Inbred!

I've got an 853 Inbred and it's a lovely ride but, when chainsuck occurs it doesn't half damage the frame. There have been threads on here before about On-Ones and chainsuck and, like most other people, I can't see how a frame can cause it, but the damage that a single strike can cause when it does happen can be suprising. I had some chainsuck issues early on which I solved with steel rings and a less gloopy lube but I had another strike today whilst pootling along in the dry on a cycleway (chainrings look fine, the chain is about a month or two old). Like before the cranks jammed and the chain got wrenched up between the chainstay and chainrings, and was well and truly wedged (cutting through the protective zipties and innertube along the way) and damaging the chainstay again. I occassionally got chainsuck on my old DN6 Inbred but when it happened it just grazed the paint, there was plenty of room for the chain to pass the stay on a 47.5mm chainline without doing significant damage (on the 853 with a 50mm chainline damage is marked as there's a tiny amount of clearance). I've been wrestling trying to fit an old anti-chainsuck plate but the extra-wide bridgeless stays make this a real problem too.

I can't really afford a new frame but I don't want to be riding along wondering whether the next pedal revolution might write off the frame, so I'd like something with sensible chainring clearance rather than a 'mud room at all costs' approach that won't get damaged when the occassional chainsuck occurs.

So, suggestions please, under £400, steel, 100mm fork compatible and geared, 853 would be nice but not essential and I'd rather something resilliant that race light. Top of my list is an 853 Genesis Altitude 3.0 frame (although I can't find anyone selling them at the moment), does anyone know what sort of chainring clearance you get with a 50mm chainline. I I'm also rather drawn to the Kinesis UK Decade Prestige (although I know nothing about it), a Cove Handjob looks nice but at nearly £500 is rather too much.

Love/hate ?

2010 Altitude 853 frames are landing towards the end of Oct (£399.99srp).

Same cherry red colour as this year's Alt30.

James-O will probably be along soon to give you the lowdown on the clearance on a 50mm chainline.

To be honest, I love the acid green of the current Altitude 3.0 frame, so would really like one of those if anyone knows where I can find one. I think that the clearance on the Altitudes is tight, but should be ok on a 50mm chainline.

Looking at the pics. of the Kinesis Decade Prestige I can see that it too has bridgeless stays so that might be in mangling range too. There seems to be a bit of a trend towards very wide chainstays, so perhaps I'm worrying too much about chainsuck. A lot of my riding is on the road and country trails, so I don't come across huge amounts of mud.

Brant makes a point of showing how much clearance there is on the Blue Pig.

Pjay,

Have you considered a Rocky Mountain Blizzard?

Depends what size you are looking for but Merlin still have 18"s in stock for less than £400.

I have a brand new immaculate 18" frame built up for sale so could offer you the frame plus some components for less than £400.

Let me know if you are interested.

Cheers, but I think that an 18" would be a tad small, my Inbred is 20" (I reckon that a 19" Altitude would be spot on). It's a shame though as the Blizzards look lovely.

I've been trying to contact Genesis about clearances for the Altitude but their website appears to be experiencing problems as I can't get into the contact form.

the new inbred has a flatter tube by the chainrings to give more space ive not had a problem

I can't see how a frame can cause it, but the damage that a single strike can cause when it does happen can be suprising

The frame doesn't CAUSE the chainsuck, but the lack of clearance makes it's effects far worse, as you have discovered.
It was my 853 Inbred that chainsuck snapped the stay on. The first time I ever got chainsuck on that frame, the chain jammed in so hard I had to take the chainset off to remove it, and as soon as I was aware of the problem I used to replace my middle ring very, very quickly!
It's a pity because they are wonderful bikes, I like mine so much I got a new chainstay put in, with a different bend in it at my request (Basically, it's straighter) which has 100% cured the problem. I can leave rings until they are really knackered now and chainsuck just doesn't happen, ever. I've done more riding with the new stay then with the old one, and I've literally got about 3 tiny chips in the paint. The fix cost £70 for the stay, plus paint, and it works.

It might be better to go this route rather than buy a new frame, especially if you like the bike 🙂
Argos Cycles did the job for me, but I guess any custom builder will be able to do the same.

New chainstay with different profile –

Plenty mud room

Plenty chainring clearance. Sorted!

Why on earth they aren't built like this I'll never know…..Mud clearance stays the same (Well, maybe 1-2mm less, but there's plenty of room) it's gotta be cheaper to make a straighter stay, everyone's a winner….
😀

Hmmm, that's interesting peter, I've an inbred frame with a bent chainstay, only £70 to get it sorted sounds appealing

in response to the OP, I too had MASSIVE chainsuck problems with my 853 inbred. The clearance on the Blue Pig is simply astounding. It's immense. And the blue pig with the Pikes would right down feels very similar to an inbred, with them would right out it feels brill 🙂

Can I just say that orange bike is astonishingly clean ? Do you have too much time on your hands Peter ??

SFB – In those pics it had JUST come back from Argos Cycles, with new paint, and I'd just built it up with a new drivetrain (And forks I think) so yes, it's looking a bit spangly. 😀

The paint has weathered very, very well though. It still cleans up to a shine like that if I can be bothered. I do keep my bikes clean, but not anally so. 😀

SFB – In those pics it had JUST come back from Argos Cycles

OK, I'll let you off – and that's a very neat job for so little money!

OK, I'll let you off – and that's a very neat job for so little money!

Well, the chainstay was £70, which isn't bad I agree, but you don't wanna know what the "plus paint" part I referred to above cost on top of that….

the Altitude frame is designed to fit a chain between ring and stay at 50mm chainline and still offer good tyre clearance, so bad chainsuck may scrape some paint if the chain twists but it won't wreck the frame. A chain can be pulled up between outer ring and stay by the inner or middle ring and then drop back out again, but tbh if it's really filthy and you push hard on the pedals, chainsuck can damage any frame. chain-checkers and steel inner rings are the best prevention!

The 853 Inbred and chainstuck just seems to be a crappy design issue. Shame really

The 853 Inbred and chainstuck just seems to be a crappy design issue. Shame really

Oh yes, without a doubt. You try getting On-One to admit to it though…..

Well, I've got steel rings and a chain checker and keep things nice and clean, maybe it was just bad luck.

The Altitude does seem a good bet but I don't see any online retailers with frames.

The newer 456s have a dint in the driveside chainstay but to be honest I'm not sure that will be enough. I liked the old Inbred stays, plenty of clearance on a 47.5mm chainline.

pjay, we're out of stock at the moment but have 2010 colours in mid-oct. yeah there's no way to avoid it completely – grit and mud make a mockery of the best set-up bikes eventually.

mail me at enquiries@genesisbikes.co.uk if you want me to ask an account manager about any dealers with stock.

Didn't Crud products used to do a polyprop "Third hand" that fitted to the seat tube below the front mech to stop the chain actually dropping off into the gap? From all the posts it strikes me that they should re-launch it for the somewhat large UK steel hard tail brigade.

If you've got ISCG tabs on your b/b then the chain can get stuck between them and the spider when your chain goes into suck mode. That is a real pain to sort out. Anyone know a way of stopping that happening?

never had a problem with chainsuck on my Sanderson or the Alpine.

Sanderson is similar to Inbred, i believe.

Sanderson is similar to Inbred, i believe.

Only in that it is a steel hardtail. Having had both I can tell you they are VERY different animals.

Hi James, YGM

I'd be really interested in finding someone with a 19" frame, I do like the 2009 green but the 2010 cherry red look great too. Are there any differences between the 2009 and 2010 models worth waiting for and will the 2010 still work with just a 100mm fork?

Another frame I rather like the look of (and have for a long time) is the Orange P7. The Orange site gives a fork travel range of 100mm – 140mm, would it be dreadful with a 100mm fork?

Back in the day, as they say, it wasn't uncommon for chainsuck to happen, and there were more than a few frames produced that had a bolt-on anti chain-suck plate fitted, and there were a number of add-ons available as well. I suffer it on my 567 Inbred, with RF Turbine cranks on an ISIS BB. the same set-up caused the same problem with the Hummer it was fitted to previously. I'm sure an external bearing BB would solve the problem, but the expense rules that out. At the moment I've got a couple of jubilee clips around the chainstay, but I'm thinking about getting a chainsuck plate brazed on, and that might be a solution worth looking at that's cheaper than a whole chainstay. Mine won't even need a respray 'cos it's just clear matt laquer over bare steel, so it's a wire brush then a quick squirt with a spray can.