So in a nutshell then G. All men are looking at women as potential sex all the time, even if they're not?

Well, if we're being honest, I don't. Sorry if that upsets your clearly lovingly nurtured but clearly bollards theory, but they you go. Women are just people, you know? I'm not afraid of them, or of talking to them, or whatever, I can look at them as people not as sex objects. That's not so say there's a grain of truth behind your assertions, I'll glance a look at a nice pair if they're "in my face" like the next man, but my first, second or third thought is not "I want to F&*k that girl…"

But it's OK, I think I probably fall into one your categories up there somewhere according to you, the one about "trying to sleep with women by pretending we're not" or some such other guff, so don't worry.

Feel sorry for you really… 😉

Women dress up and worry about how they look because from the day they are born their parents fuss over them telling them how beautiful they are. I've never done that with my daughter, she gets other praise.

How she looks isn't important to me and hopefully will be of minimal importance to her, mum agrees..

Nickc, I’m sure you are a great bloke an all, but if you don’t mind me saying so you do seem a tad uptight. Chill out buddy, I don’t need your sorrow. If you reread your post, I think you will find deep down there much as you hate to admit it you are agreeing with me.

So what is it that irks you about that? The notion that despite all protestations you are more dishonest than I, given that I openly embrace my male fallability or is it the concept that you might actually agree with me. C’mon come out of the closet.

sq225917 – Much as it might surprise you ditto. I have never treated either of my kids in any way other than that which you describe. However, I now have a 24 year old daughter who dresses very well, and looks, even if I say so myself, absolutely stunning. My concern and it is a genuine one, is that she does not understand what is going on when she is out and about. Personally, I’m acutely aware of the looks and the stares when we are out together. My Grrrrrrr response is legend actually. In fact in some ways it would worry me more if she did, given that she has an excellent young man in tow whom she adores. In essence that is really my point. The fact is that blokes do see women at first instance as a potential partner. They calculate the possibilities, and either pass up or proceed dependant on the variables that need considering. That being the case, surely it makes more sense and is safer for all concerned to be honest about that.

The fact is that blokes do see women at first instance as a potential partner.

Funny, I thought the defintion of "fact" was something that could be proved. 🙂

You do realise that your "all men are dripping sacks of man fat and testosterone" viewpoint is not widely accepted, except by Social Darwinists and militant feminists? 😉

Is that a fact?

G, I think TBH chap, I'm considerable more chilled that you. 😀

My Grrrrrrr response is legend actually

Case in point? I don't have a "Grrrrr response"

I agree to the point that men look at women and that women look at men, but as for the notion that blokes only look at women in terms of sex? Nah, sorry don't go for it…

Is that a fact?

Yes, my mates down the pub all agree with me. 🙂

Chastened 😯 Fair enough then.

nickc: Do you have a daughter? I reckon Grrrr is very relaxed and chilled in the circumstances.

Yep I do.

She's 8, maybe as she gets older my views will change, who knows?

Mine did, and I have had this conversation openly with my daughter. She wouldn't have any of it, then discussed it with boyfriend who rather red faced agreed with me.

I agree to the point that men look at women and that women look at men, but as for the notion that blokes only look at women in terms of sex? Nah, sorry don't go for it…

Out of interest, what are the reasons that you think men do look at women?

I'll glance a look at a nice pair if they're "in my face" like the next man, but my first, second or third thought is not "I want to F&*k that girl…"

Like I said really, deep down he's agreeing with me, but hes struggling with his G-Spot at the moment so don't hastle him.

Incidentally, nick I never said it was conscious or overt, I am however suggesting that it is pretty much an automatic and instinctive thing.

If you're making out that the urge to reproduce is "automatic" and "instinctive", how do you explain people who never have a relationship or get married? Or gay people? Do they go through their days in a twisted hell of self-denial, or do they just get on with their lives? 🙂

All weirdos…. 😉

I'm happily not married to the mother of my children. We've been together for more than 20 years, we spend most days together, as we work together. In all of those years I've never once been even tempted to "be" with another woman. My assertion that men look at women still holds, I can admire a good looking woman in the same way I can admire art or a beautiful landscape, but sex? Nope, not interested. It's nice, I've got no pressure, I'm not trying to impress any-one, I've not got an agenda, hidden or otherwise.

It's not instinctive, it's learned.

In denial …..

A quote from RoadBikeReview;

"Women have the uncanny ability to appreciate beauty without needing to **** it."

A quote from Hormones and Behaviour Journal;

"Men spent more time, and had a higher probability of, looking at female faces. NC Women had more first looks towards, spent more time, and had a higher probability of, looking at genitals."

Stop it… 😀

IanMunro –

The study may 'say' genitals but what they were looking at could perhaps be labelled a 'complete d!ck' 😆

Muffintops?

I have also heard this called a gunt, a gut that runs down to a c…. you get my drift………..