Lumicycle LED upgrade help « Singletrack Forum

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Lumicycle LED upgrade help

25 posts & 15 voices | Started 9 months ago by ansdy | Latest reply from 5lab

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ansdy - Member

Hi Guys,

So I've noticed the days are getting shorter and some sections through the trees are getting too dark to ride in the evening.

Unusually for me I have decided to try and get organised for proper night riding in advance.

I have an old set of the Lumicycle Halogens that I would like to do a diy LED upgrade on.

I have looked back on here and there seems that there are some really good guides with pictures so I am happy to do it myself.

The only issue is that I don't have a clue which components to choose.
I think there has been quite a lot of discussion over which LED's and drivers etc.
Please could someone direct me to a either a thread or links to what I should be buying?

Cheers

A

Posted 9 months ago #
trout - Member

I have some heatsinks - triple xpg leds on 20 mm boards and a few optics
you also need a driver of some sort Blackcat`s were the driver of last year he is still on ebay http://stores.ebay.co.uk/blackcattechnology

a three position switch is good two

cant seem to find the threads though

Posted 9 months ago #
Speshpaul - Member

Black cats drivers are good, trouts LED inserts are ok as well. but make sure you get the lower power drivers no more than 830ma (IIRC) otherwise they will cook and die.
Other than that top job

Posted 9 months ago #
mikey-simmo - Member

What sort of Price are the drop in units and optics for the Lumi cans Mr Trout sir?

Posted 9 months ago #
Junkyard - Member

http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/lumicycle-halogen-to-led-conversion-with-piccies-and-a-step-by-step-guide

guide and discussion of parts

Posted 9 months ago #
stumpy01 - Member

I recently converted my 2nd Lumi can using a triple xpg from cutter, my own heatsink & the 830ma driver from Black Cat on eBay.
The can gets A LOT hotter than the 670ma version, but didn't seem to get too hot so long as you keep moving.
As mentioned above, get a 3way switch from Maplin as the latest Black Cat driver has the ability to switch to a reduced power.

Posted 9 months ago #
Sonor - Member

I used that conversion guide to do one of my Lumi cans, including the Traction control gear "heatsink". Triple XPG with a 680ma driver from blackcat.

I've got a 970ma driver which I'm looking to use in my Lumi HID. I bought a heatsink from someone off here, I can't remember who, this fits the HID can. I think this combined with the HID can should provide an effective heatsink, along with heatsink compound of course.

I presume stuffing a 970ma driver into a lumi halogen can is causing them to fail due to heatsink issues?

Posted 9 months ago #
Rusty Mac - Member

Trout,

For the latest conversion do you think adding the RC car 540 motor heatsinks to the lumi can will help with the cooling at all?

I was thinking about trying to fit one then drill through the heatsink and through the can into the heatsink of the LED's, run a tap into it and then a couple of say 2mm screws to secure everything. That way there would be direct contact between everything but it could be a comlete faff for no real gain.

Any thoughs from any of the rest of you greatfully apreciated as well.

Posted 9 months ago #
robdeanhove - Member

Adding 2 screws will make a small, positive, difference, but you'll still have 2 components with, essentially, an air gap between them. You'd be better putting a thermal paste, or thermal adhesive between them across the entire surface area, these products are designed for attaching heatsinks to parts to conduct the maximum amount of heat away:

LIKE THIS ADHESIVE ON EBAY

Posted 9 months ago #
Rusty Mac - Member

rob,

Do you know how the anodising on the case and the heatsink would affect the performance of the thermal paste?

Posted 9 months ago #
robdeanhove - Member

I'd say the effect would be immeasurable, possibly zero. Certainly many orders of magnitude less than the difference between having paste or not, I wouldn't worry about it.

Posted 9 months ago #
messiah - Member

I should have done this last year. Watching with interest.

Another older thread on the subject.

http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/lumicycle-halogen-led-kit-vote/page/4

Posted 9 months ago #
Rusty Mac - Member

messiah

That was the conversion i did last year to convert my 2 Lumi halogens and have put 830mA drivers in them both, one is XPE one is XPG. After some peopls over heating issues i was wondering about a mod to try and increase the bulk of the can to help with heat dissipation hence the stuff above.

Posted 9 months ago #
stumpy01 - Member

Can't remember who, but someone on here posted some pics of their cans after using some 540 motor heatsinks attached to the can to aid heat dissipation.

As I mentioned above, I have a can with the 670mA driver and another with the 830mA driver.
I would liken the difference in heating to the difference between the original 12w & 20w halogens, in that the 12w could remain on while stationary and never get massively hot, whereas the 20w would quickly get very hot when left stationary.
At the 24/12 I used the converted 830 (along with the 670) for the first time and didn't notice any heat issues while moving. #
That was until the LED board failed, as I pulled a track off it while installing it that my other half managed to bridge. I think all the jostling about caused the repair to fail, but I half expected that.

I'll replace the LED board soon & have them going again.

Posted 9 months ago #
Rusty Mac - Member

stumpy01

During use is there any problem with heat build up with the units on half power?

Posted 9 months ago #
stumpy01 - Member

Rusty Mac - Member
stumpy01

During use is there any problem with heat build up with the units on half power?

Nope, don't think so.
The 670mA driver I have is the one that pre-dates built in control on the board, so this is achieved via a resistor (BlackCat recommended 200k, I think).
The newer driver (and the 830mA one I am using) has 1/C/2 switch solder points on the board to dim the output with a 3-way switch.
They do heat up when stationary, but at a far lower rate than when on full power. I haven't left them on for any length of time when stationary, but haven't noticed much in the way of heating.

I had some heatsinks made up, which aim to increase the surface area in contact with the can. They are a bu66er to get in the can, as I had them made as an interference fit & then sanded them down so they just fit with a bit of a shove. That was how I knackered the LED board on the 830mA can; I had to remove the heatsink/led board & wrecked a track doing so.
I think I have a pic saved on Photobucket of the heatsinks.......

I keep planning to draw up my own can with a bit more meat in it to get the heat away, but never find the time.....

Posted 9 months ago #
jdough - Member

Is anybody making (or got stock of) 33mm OD heatsinks for Lumicycle cans???

Posted 9 months ago #
stumpy01 - Member

A lot of people were using a modified nitro rc car flywheel. I can't remember the exact make (I think it might have been an HPI one).

I had the one above made for me, but I don't have any spare, unfortunately.

Main problem with a suitable heatsink is that it can't be too large as the cans are so small, which limits how much heat you can get to the outside, especially with the more powerful drivers. That is why I tried to add surface area in contact with the can via a thin sleeve that sits in the 'dead space' where the lens sits. I have no information to say how effective this method is, compared to just a metal disc.

However you do it, the heatsink needs to make good contact with the can. This is the main problem with my heatsink - I made it oversized & then sanded it down so it was a snug fit. The second one I did was a bit too snug & was impossible to remove without knackering the LED board. It was my fault for not sanding a bit more off it, than I did.

You could probably get a nearby machine shop to rattle you off a couple of 33mm alu discs (5-6mm thick) with 5mm holes in the middle for a few quid each and a packet of hob nobs....

Posted 9 months ago #
pdw - Member

When I converted mine a year ago, the flywheels seemed to be impossible to get hold of - sold out and discontinued.

I had some heatsinks made up, and the surplus ones were spoken for very quickly on this site. Trout's heatsinks weren't available then, so worth taking a look at those.

I'm running old style 670mA drivers with a 3-way switch, and find the heat barely noticeable when moving so am thinking of switching them to more powerful drivers.

Posted 9 months ago #
stumpy01 - Member

pdw, I briefly used the 830mA driver in a Lumi can until I knackered the led board.
It got a lot hotter than the 670 when stationary, but seemed fine when moving.

It's an appreciable increase in light output.

Posted 9 months ago #
Vortexracing - Member

Is anybody making (or got stock of) 33mm OD heatsinks for Lumicycle cans???

I'm looking to do a conversion on my last halogen, but like others have said the flywheel heatsink are impossible to get hold of.

I'm trying to get a few halogen heatsinks turned in the next week or so you I should have a few for you guys if that helps

I have a triple XRE and narrow optic if you want as well. I used the 670ma driver and used the 1/2 power as well.

They have run with no problems to date.

Can't believe you lot are still bringing my old thread up.

Posted 9 months ago #
BadlyWiredDog - Member

I was thinking about trying to fit one then drill through the heatsink and through the can into the heatsink of the LED's, run a tap into it and then a couple of say 2mm screws to secure everything. That way there would be direct contact between everything but it could be a comlete faff for no real gain.

You can buy double-sided sticky heat transfer tape, I used that to fix the heat sink to the outside of the Lumi can, less messy that paste and also holds it in place, though it's a good spring fit anyway.

I reached a point though, where I simply couldn't be arsed with the faffing of making even more lights however. Those Deal Extreme things don't cost any more and are lot less hassle. I still have two Trout-made quads, R5 ones or something, which are brilliant.

Posted 9 months ago #
trout - Member

I have these left over from last year if anyone wants to buy them as a job lot .

the leds are XPE`s so give a narrower beam over the XPGs
the optics are available from Farnells .

Heatsinks cost me £1 each
the led boards are just shy of £8 on cutters now though I paid more than that last year.

Job lot for £140 posted

Posted 8 months ago #
jdough - Member

I've already got the LEDs, optics, and drivers - just need the heatsinks.

Posted 8 months ago #
5lab - Member

as a follow up to this - is there anyone who converts lumicycles (as a service I guess)? Whilst I can solder, and I normally have confidence in my ability to do things, I've never soldered something this small so I'd rather get someone else to do it..?

Posted 8 months ago #