I have a 65L backpack and I need it to be this size to get groceries, so I’m looking for a way to upgrade it. This is primarily for protection commuting/riding street.

The Scott one looks like a great deal though at 40 pound, just not suitable for my use.

Why no visor? seems like a great way to keep bugs and sun out whilst having a great fov, better than sunglasses. plus aero

I am a tit so it’s no problem

34 pound

Guess some changes are happening, but some prefer the T3+

I would check whether your handlebar is designed to take an attachment where you want to place it. It is unlikely that the bar has been designed to take clamping in the position required or be structurally engineered to take the weight where you are placing it.

Running Sam Hill alu bars, probably not designed for TT bars specifically, but should be fairly sturdy?

I want them for comfort and commuting speed, not competing so comfort is more important than marginal aero gains. Currently running cheapo S bars, but want to be able to move the armrests further back hence looking at a profile design bar. Comfort hasn’t been an issue but only done short commutes so far and it’d be nice to be able to do longer ones.

Some say L or J bars are better for sprinting, some say they’re worse and S bars are better. Leaning towards a T4 or T3 as you can see below.

Garry, I could do 40:11 with a BB spacer perhaps. Cheaper than a 10t cassette! Yeah problem is that I spin out ww tailwind.

Overall i think it’s cool how fast and goofy looking an mtb with tt bars can be, I’m a fan of one bike to do everything as it offers me more playtime (road bikes arent fun for tricks) whilst still letting me get from a to b quickly.

If onto a MTB definitely ones that let you move the elbow pads backwards – you’ll likely need to. That’s not possible with the planetx ones.

You might be interested in this thread https://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/mtb-with-slicks-and-aero-bars-as-fast-as-a-road-bike-on-flat-ground/

Though wait until the roadie wants to drop you next time 

Hehe. well If I’m 10% fitter it seems he couldn’t if he wanted to! I did overtake him and he thanked me after i turned onto a side road. Either for letting him ride on my wheel or for getting the heck out of his way ;)

My alloy 10.5kg cx bike with 35mm slicks is about 10% slower than my 7.5kg carbon race bike with 25mm slicks according to strava if that helps

Cool, now add aero bars to your cx bike and how much is the difference? According to this

up to 6.25:% (going at 50 km/h..) So it’s possible you could get get pretty close to your carbon bike.

@mattyfez think the helmet gains are a bit too marginal at around 2% (at 50 km/h.. again)..

I run the panaracer gravel slicks btw, seems pretty fast and light at 330g each.

Can you reach the brakes from the aero position though? Reckon I could be stopped before you got back to the brakes

Absolutely can’t. I guess where the roadbike would be a bit faster would be in the city with a lot of starts and stops.

I’ll take some pics this week. My bike is smallish for my height, so it mimics a road bike and the aero position I get seems decent (ideally I’d have aero clip ons that allow you to move the pads back).

@CaptainFlashheart looks comfy lol

Just wondering if people have benchmarked this setup against a roadbike. For braking the MTB would have the advantage I reckon with dialed 180mm BB7s and more tire traction. Not many corners.

Pining for both! Particularly the ranger after having give up on the idea of soulless Chinese ti.

Zeems like it can work, want those as they have a proven track record in trials where you want tons of power plus im 90 kg. Also they might work well with my HS1 rotors I have lying around.

Ended up ordering this 125x90x60 cm table for 123 gbp delivered!

A light duty one, mounting a small vice could still be useful. Last time I needed one was trying to unscrew the chainring lockring on the raceface aeffect yikes.

Thanks a lot for the suggestions! Heartwarming. I have done some DIY in the past, built a self designed loft bed and a modular sound proof enclosure for an electron microscope that worked ok (struggled a bit with the door) but I was really looking for something fast to build that also can be taken apart and reassembled easily since I’m still moving around a lot – sorry that I forgot to specify this.

Maybe a wire rack with a solid wood top would be a good compromise. You can get these:

Or do this

Should be doable for around 100 and you get a lot of adjustability plus option for wheels. Looks a bit better than sheet metal ones IMO

Might shorten the effective top tube 5mm to 620 mm which is what I have ATM, there are extra long 24.5″ DJ bikes btw, here one close to what I’ve designed with 27.5″ wheels.

@geex yeah because it’s primarily a bike to get around town and I’m 6’3″, never DJd although I’d love to try. Mostly do manuals, bunny hops, small drops, pedal hops etc nothing too gymnastic I don’t have time for injuries or the budget to buy new frames lol. Just want a fun, rigid, can do a bit of everything bike. It will also get fender mounts :D

I’d also be happy with a Santa Cruz Chameleon in Medium, but if I can get a custom Ti for about the same price..

$800 is an optimistic price everything included, once the design is final I’ll get quotes from the main players. I read some people dodge VAT but doubt that’s possible in Germany hah!

Thanks! Already got that one. Reckon I might do a 15 mm BB drop, don’t think it matters a lot, but that puts it at the same BB height as the Chameleon and e.g. Transition PBJ (a 26″ dj frame).

@stevet I mainly use it to get around, I have no other bike hence it needs to be fast. It should be street and trials able, but I’m not looking to compete in either discipline exactly – only for fun! 27.5 wheels are what I have.

I don’t see how 30 mm less BB drop than normal will affect day to day riding ? Bit more wind resistance perhaps? Center of gravity is still quite low.

3 more questions:

1. Is 1.2 mm tubes all round the way to go? Perhaps you can keep the steel look this way..;)

2. Does it need any extra reinforcements for trials?

3. What disc brake mounts? See inspired use is.

@scotroutes 450 mm with 125 mm of insertion I reckon. Trouble with longer seat tube is not being able to lower the seat as much when messing about.

@IvanDobski the only thing is that I’m terrified of creaking. Perhaps dropouts like the ones stanton use could be a good middle ground, use fixed ones for now, with the option of using sliding ones later? Awesome resource! Thanks :)

Why EBB instead? There are also 5 mm dropouts used for trials bikes, albeit then you lose some flexibility to run larger tires etc.

44×0.9 mm downtubes seem standard normal so my design def needs beefing up, contacting Walty is a good idea, I’m new to the chinese custom Ti market so didn’t even know they existed heeeh

More like 18mm actually

For a long DJ bike check out the transition PBJ.

Spot on geo but I think the seat tube is too short unfortunately, would dj bikes aren’t really made for pedaling seated. Or could a mega long seat tube work?

JIVE: Marinobike is a really interesting option! Custom frame delivered in Germany for about 470 dollars incl vat. Asked what the build I want would weigh approx.

Fwiw the Chameleon frame is very errr, supple probably not the right word but its certainly not a harsh frame. Feels more muted/forgiving in the rear than a Swarf steel frame I had previously so I wouldn’t rule it out on that basis. Looks are clearly up to you.

Also isn’t the stack height and overall bar height going to be a bit out with a 100mm corrected fork, particularly for your ‘street’ stuff? They have pretty short headtubes on them, particularly given your height and choice of frame size. I’m 6ft 3 and rode mine with a 130mm fox 34 and still needed a 35mm rise bar with 5mm of spacers, albeit appreciating we all want different things.

Thanks for the info, yeah the Chameleon is tempting especially given this info, I like the looks, only downside is that everyone will want to steal it. Might have to find a medium to try out. As for bar height I run at 40 mm riser bar and 80 mm stem with a few spacers on my brand X, works fine or me. A frame designed around ~120 mm forks would be best.

Contrary to what was said earlier, it is perfectly possible to make short chainstay 29ers without a heavy yoke. I’ve done 405mm with tubes and clearance for 2.4 tyres. But it takes effort and creative design.

Good to know, as for seat angle I want max 74 degrees. Ain’t got the equipment or time to make my own, plus I wouldn’t trust it hah!

Here’s a contender, although alu, the 2017 Kona Shonky

TT 623 mm (longer than my large Brandx)
CS 400 mm (should fit small 27.5″ tires)
ST 347 mm (concerned this is too short!)
Weight ?
Cost 450 dollars.

Pjay I’ve written them :)

Mate of mine had a full custom steel ht from a guy callling himself smalltown boy designs, was 450 quid, 2 years ago.

Thanks! Will contact, my only gripe is that custom bikes don’t have a history of durability the same way a factory frame can have.

I’m only 5ft 7″ and ride a medium Chameleon in 29er mode and it fits perfectly. At 6ft 3″ it would like like a kids bike for you.

My current rame is a Brand X HT01 in Large, which is the same size as a Chameleon Medium, so should be fine.

If you’ve got deep pockets Curtis might be able to sort you out with something

Too short im afraid at 583 mm eff top tube. That’s usually the problem with 4x frames, I need a XL for it to work (like the BTR Ignitor in XL which is perfect except for the weight and cost). An older XL 4x or DJ 26″ frame could work here.

This might work as hits some of your criteria

http://sickbicycleco.bigcartel.com/product/h-a-c-k-s-a-w-s-u-r-g-e-o-n-4130-preorder

It could! Although I’m a bit in between sizes, medium being just a tiny bit short, large being a tiny bit tall. I will ask em about weight.

Kona made the Explosif in Ti

Unfortunately the 17″ is too short and the 19″ too tall.

Honzo ST is 3 kg or so?  Something like this!

Gravel King slicks are very smooth on road and I like them better then the Maxxis Refuse on gravel, also super light..

Is having one made going to go over budget?

Yeah a bit over budget, although BTR does offer down payments. Ti is about the same price as a custom steel rame. Ideally I’d find a suitable 26″ frame I could pick up for a couple hundred used! Cotic soul is nearly it, but a bit to tall to be ideal for my use.

Timberwolf from Richey

Too long st at 480 mm for the large i’m afraid! Medium is too small.

What happened to the Stanton 4×4? Apart from the possibly a bit too short seattube it’s nearly perf.

Some 4X frames might get you close!

Yeah! Not easy to find at least, might have to consider a heavier frame or alu. I was talking to BTR about customizing their 4x frame, would be quite expensive and also around 2.5 kg. At that price I could get a Ti frame instead so there’s that.

NS Clash, rather get a Chameleon! Dartmoor Hornet is too small unfortunately.

Dunno ’bout the numbers, but, Stif Morph?

Qwery, just looked back into the Morph, a bit slack, but otherwise nearly spot on in medium. I just can’t find its weight anywhere, guessing it’s around 2.5 kg? At that point I’d have to weigh it up against the Stanton Switchback.

NS bikes eccentric cromo 29 would be pretty close I think?

Close, a bit small in Medium, Large too tall, medium is 2.59 kg.

I’ll be buying the Chameleon, but my search came up with the Pipedream Sirius 4G

Nice, unfortunately the medium is a bit too short (eff top tube). I really need something that’s “medium/long”.

BFe

Lovely, but too long CS.

As soon as you try to get the chainstay length down to 415mm with steel you fail the weight criteria, because it’s only possible with a yoke, which adds weight vs tubes – and 2kg is about the minimum for a CEN compliant steel hardtail.

Good point, slightly heavier than the soul is fine, just ideally not a pound heavier. Thinking there probably are some eligible 26″ frames with that length CS as I don’t need a lof ot tyre clearance. Kinesis has a SL steel DJ frame, but like most DJ specific frames it’s too short.

The aluminium chameleon is over 2kg, so I don’t think that is a realistic target with steel.

That’s a large, medium at or under 2kg I believe.

Too long CS, too high seat tube in Large! NS bikes steel HTs are all about 2.5 kg. Doesn’t need to be under 2 kg, but ideally not much over.

Assume we’re talking current gen Chameleon (29er) In which case:

> Stanton Sherpa ticks some of the boxes

> Cotic SolarisMax (probably current gen, not upcoming Longshot)

Thanks! Stanton Sherpa is a bit too tall again 483 mm seat tube, Slackline is heavier than I need for my riding although lovely. Solarismax also too tall. Basically I’m looking for something resembling a stretched out DJ bike (kinda what the current 27.5 chameleon is).

17.2 mm !

Thanks vincienup and good point about cold performance.  For commuting only I wouldn’t worry much about pad choice, whatever is silent and durable really, but I’ve also been learning some trials, where a strong rear brake is crucial. So looking for a pad with great bite.

I’ve also ordered two disco brakes steel rotors as they’re 17.2 mm wide compared to my 14 mm HS1 rotor, should work better with 16 mm pads.

Wonder if there are actually any real difference between some of these 3rd party brand pads.