Could these turns have been made by the autopilot? i.e. I’m thinking crew incapacitated/dead for some reason and autopilot continues on to bogus waypoints (either by user error, system fault or deliberate interference).

Exactly.

Its just energy, heat that is used to cook the food.
Much work has been done to see if microwaves to effect the food nutrionally.

The risk is that people overcook their food in a microwave and that reduces the nutrients.

http://www.health.harvard.edu/fhg/updates/Microwave-cooking-and-nutrition.shtml

Solo, this is my point about the bigotry on here, and in RL. You see fat people tentativly heading to the gym to try and sort their lives out, and people laugh at them, patronise them, or are just plain rude. Arseholes.

Though it’s nice to be able to have a sensible debate on this, and I don’t think there’s actually much difference in our positions

yeah I agree, I think we just place more weight on different things.

Like I am not sure that this is true, it sounds more of an assumption to me

that there is no known aircraft failure mechanism which would result in that.

But I see your point, it would have to be pretty coincidental that through some failure mechanism it navigated itself throuhg a couple of well knwon waypoints. But it is possible.

Wasn’t a criticsim mcmoonter, I love living vicariously through your posts. My comment just an extension of your own observation (ie you estimated £200 a week..)

molgrips, sd253 is just looking for excuses to insult people and get away with it. We would all be better off if we ignore him.

If someone at work announced that they have got some illness and were taking homeopathic remedies for it, then it would be quite normal for at least one person in the room to laugh about them drinking plain water.
If they said they were praying, it would generally be considered offensive to make some joke about their invisible bearded friend in the sky.

This is an excllent illustration of the difference between the internerd and RL.
I wouldn’t laugh at either case for fear of making enemies. On here, I don’t care. It’s a free forum for people to say what they want. (Unless it reduces revenue for Mark and Chipps)

Solo, this is STW. It would all work much better in the pub. Plus people would not find it so easy to resort to being rude.

Homeopathy is no less effective than prayer.
Why is it acceptable to laugh at one, but not the other ?

It is perfectly acceptable to critically examine either.
If you are an opinionated bigoted bastard like me, you would laugh at both.

excuse me? Don’t be rude.

I think I would be perfectly happy being poorer and wasting my life collecting wood and building holzharryhausens..

I agree, I’m not concerned about lack of motive. I also do not think that striking out the idea of pilot suicide because he didn’t do it straight away is valid either. Jumpers spend hours deciding wether to go or not. He/she may well have vaccilated until the fuel ran out.
I guess reading aracers post, his assumptions are the most plausible. BUT they are still assumptions. We know very little. We do not know that they were deliberate turns.
As an avid flying phobic I have read many many NTSB/AAIB reports and can tell you that truth is stranger than fiction.
Given that flight safety is so locked down and there are protections, procedures and redundancy in palce. Whn a plane crashes by accident the causes are often very obscure.
So all I am saying is, whislt Aracer is enjoying his sense of certainty, I am happy to leave my mind open that it might have been aracers theory or some other incredible/black swanish that caused this incident.

More to the point, what else could you be doing and how much could you be earning during all that time related to wood collection?

Well that was included in my mental maths, but I think I would be prefectly happy being poorer and wasting my life collecting wood and building holzharryhausens..

cool, we use Te here too but just checking as we had recent confusion with a client who defined it as something else.

from wikipedia:

Non-approved abbreviations for tonne and “metric ton” include “T”, “mT”, “MT”, and “mt”,[5] and “Te” (particularly in the offshore and nuclear industries).

What are you calling 1te? Is it tonne, metric ton,1000kg?

This looks like the rate at which I burn wood. Its not a cheap way to heat a house. In fact mcmoonter I would say your method of heating is pretty much a lifestyle choice rather than the best/efficient. If you consider the cost of tractors, loggin eqpt and time spent foraging, collecting, splitting, stacking, bringing into the house, cleaning and setting and maintaining the fire, you would probs be way better off installing GCH.
I understand that is not the point, I am envious of your lifestyle. I would happily swap the sport of commuting to work sitting in front of a desk and using the results to pay for gas with spending a decent proportion of my life doing all the wood related activities you do…

You won the world cup in the Southern Hemisphere, you are the only Northern Hemisphere team to even win it. You should cherish it.

I think we could safely say I do cherish it. I rank that day in my life pretty highly, and all I did was watch it on TV at home. (I did go surfing after and that was good). Still have the VHS recording of it, and the next days newspapers. I would just prefer to win the world cup with a prettier style of rugby next time…

down to 33, with a lev. which is marginally lighter and a lighter saddle.
If I put on air forks, tubeless and got rid of the front mech, chain device/bash (ie go 10 speed with thick thin and a clutch mech) then I might see 30lbs.
will dig out the pics.

Personally, I loathe riding noodly, out of their depth, lightweight bikes downhill

Me too. The point of MTB is the downs, and the corners, I try to optimise my bike for that and just put up with the ups..

To quote myself on a previous covert thread:

Covert because mtb is actually about going downhill, the going up is just a means to end, anything else is losing sight of why we are here (on stw). Preferring xc over going downhill to do fast corners and jumping is like quitting sex so that you can spend more time perfecting your chat up techniques.

PS Nice bike.

yeah I reckon if you are suffciently mental enough to take over the plane with a view to ditching it, you might be mental enough to do something unpredictable like fly to australia.

yup, go see jedi.

Well let’s start with the basic concept of “like cures like” which is utter hogwash and has no basis whatsoever. To paraphrase Niels Bohr (I think) “Homeopathy, not even wrong”

or paraphrase mitchell and webb. 2Get a bit of blue ford mondeo, dilute it, shake it, dilute it agian, shake it, if that doesn’t cure him nothing will”

Again…no actual experience

Anecdotes are not science.

exactly, or put another way, anecdotes don’t make science.

reasonable doubt if you think there is some

yes, there is very little evidence either way
Science does not work by proving something did not happen, where is the evidence that it was a deliberate act? Or that it was an accident? There is not any in either case, it is inconclusive. You just cannot draw any conclusions from what we know.
I dunno where you get your beyond reasonalbe doubt from. I previoulsy showed you that they were not sure that the comms were turned off before or after the last radio contact, which you accepted. I think that was what you based your idea that it was defo deliberate. Otherwise it is all conjecture. I see no evidence that it was deliberate or not.

Again, convince me. You are so convinced, what is it that convinces you? What am I missing that you can see?

Beyond reasonable doubt.

Really? Convince me.

Well you suggest a plausible scenario in which the aircraft follows the confirmed radar track and keeps flying for several hours, where the turns (and subsequent return to straight and level) aren’t deliberate.

Of course , it is most likely to be person or persons on baord deliberately crashing the plane.
I’m just trying to point out that outlier occurrences happen on aircraft, that is why we lose them. And the link I referenced above shows how despite the training and the protocols, people forget all that and make big mistakes.

I’m not looking for a row, merely a discussion of pissibolities.

. Well that explains a lot.

What does it explain?

but I doubt that in your case!

What do you doubt? That I would over do it?

no the suppostion part is that

making several controlled turns

implies that they were deliberate, and or nefarious.

I could just ignore all available information on that in the same way you appear to be ignoring the confirmed radar tracks and final location area.

I am not ignoring it, given that they have likely found the black boxes due to the pinger contact, I’m just wondering how it got there. Jeez you are looking for an argument/disagreement when there isn’t one.

making several controlled turns

This is supposition.

interesting report in the guardian today about an unrelated incident, galley fire on a BA 747.

What makes it relavent to our discussion here is that the crew had difficulty putting the fire out with extinguishers, and did not follow correct procedures (ie not wearing oxegen masks, not electrically isolating the area etc) .
Which opens the mind to various scenarios on mh370.

but don’t really have symptoms until I try and exercise.

this could easily be it.

Chaps, I think the Troll moniker on Edukators name tag tells us something. DO NOT FEED HIM.

Meanwhile thanks for a great discussion. When you filter out the crap there is always soemthing to learn here.

Thanks for bringing it back on topic gents, I dunno if I just didn’t have a cold and the exercise made it worse. I went for a hard ride last night and feel fine this morning. Love and kisses to all.

No just clothing I will use for cycling.
Looking at sports direct and decathlon now cheers

EDIT: Spurts direct 2.99-15.99. My dreams have come true thanks.

I have mine for nearly a week, still sitting on my desk. Look fab though.

full length unpadded simple black lycra, pref with elastic/silicon around the ankle, otherwise as simple and basic as it gets.

weeksy, arrived at lunchtime, box was fine all seems good. Assembly tomorrow will tell if its bent or not..

someone should tell team sky chef this.

Trai_ rat, molgrips said it, but I wanted to reiterate, I expect none of team sky have insulin resistance issues, therefore no issue, but obese people tend to have it.

There is only one way to break insulin resistance, **** hard intense exercise.

Different engines use different types of fuel yes, they are still bound the laws of thermodynamics.

It is not a straw man, my point is that the calories in food only count as fuel if the body recognises them as fuel.
Insulin restance makes the body refuse to treat carbs as fuel. People eat them carbs, but the body does not turn them into glycogen, so it is not available for them to burn. Soon after eating carbs the body starts asking for more fuel, because the glycogen stores have not been replenished. It is similar to putting croissants in your fuel tank, whilst they do have a high calorific value, the car cannot recognise croissants as fuel so cannot use them.

Of course it subject to the laws of thermodynamics, but understanding what energy the body can burn or not will drive the thermodynamics. Simplistic statements such as calories in=calories out are frankly bollocks.

trail_rat if you ask me DD had it last week on the fattist thread when he asked which would make you fatter, 2000calories of cruciferous veg or 2000 calories of ice cream.