Exactly what we’ve been saying all day Ambrose 😉

I have to say though, I can boil half a litre of water on a can stove faster than a Trangia burner. In my mind a can stove is just a cheap Trangia, granted you don’t have the wool to act as a wick and there’s no sealing lid but otherwise I can’t really see much difference.

When those stoves were first released (under a different, high end name) they were £60 😉

Only issue I’ve ever had was the threads been a little tight when used with certain gas canisters … but if someone was going to get a dodgy one it’d be me!

I shall make one with tiny jets and compare boil times. I’d be interested to see if it has a negative effect on output (smaller flames) or will the (hopefully) increase in pressure produce a hotter/more intense flame?

EDIT: Supersessions, I haven’t played around with solid fuel since I was a kid (smaller kid) but I’ve got an idea for a duel fuel burner so I’ll give it another go … I’m expecting it to be very slow though 😉

I don’t think altering the number or size of the feed holes will have much effect, I’m pretty sure the pressure between the inner and outer chambers will equal itself out. Saying that though … I can see that smaller feed holes could be a benefit as you get towards the end of the fuel, as a smaller hole will be below the fuel level for longer which might help maintain a higher internal pressure in the outer chamber towards the end of the burn. 😯

I suppose the obvious way to increase internal pressure would be to reduce the internal size of the stove and/ or use more fuel (which would reduce the internal size) … obviously the pressure would start to drop as the fuel was used. The other option as you say, is smaller jets … restrict the gas getting out and the internal pressure must increase.

Look again Ian … they have an internal sleeve. The first picture in part 2 shows the sleeve marked out for cutting 😉

General guide lines are.

Pitch late/leave early
Camp above the wall/fence line
No fires
50m from paths, tracks or roads
Leave nothing behind
Use common sense

I think the last one is possibly the most important 😉

I like the LT version.

I think we can safely say that combustion takes place outside the stove.

The air grooves act as secondry jets when the pan is directly on top of the stove. It would seem that the deciding factor in whether your stove goes out with a pan directly on top, is more to do with the angle and location of the jets.

Well that’s most of a morning wasted, so I’ll go and do something more productive now 😀

Right then, just knocked a stove up but used a can bottom and a can top rather than 2 bottoms. Once bloomed you can sit a pan on top and it doesn’t go out, however the flames do die down a little. I’ll file some small air grooves in the top edge (that’s why I used a top, so I’d have a solid edge to work with) and see if that makes a difference … back to the kettle, sorry I mean workshop.

Just back in from the workshop to make a brew. So we’re thinking that any combustion is taking place outside the stove once the pan goes on top and it’s the physical heat of the stove which keeps the vapourised meths alight (a kind of glowplug effect). There also seems to be a direct link between how long the flames are (from jet to pan bottom) and how well the thing will stay lit, a sort of optimum flame length. Ok, back to the workshop 😉

Vaude were one of the few companies I could find that made a quality ‘rectangle’ bag with full zip. GF has a Navajo 900 … recall I got it through outdoorsgb, had to wait for it to come from Germany though.

I’ve been having a think about stoves (as I do and you do … all of you) and if the pan forms a seal on top of the stove where does the stove then take its air from. The Vargo I played with has 3 raised bumps to support the pan, they hold it 2-3mm above the stoves top surface. As I’ve said before, they can be a sod to keep lit and burn better if you raise the pan a little … I half wonder if this is down to a restriction in air flow into the centre part of the burner.

I’m going to the workshop, I may be some time!

I use a Hydrapack 1.5L thing. Fits very well, has internal baffles and a QR hose. Got mine from CRC.

Mark have a look on the WRT blog … I tested one of the Vargo stoves. It’s a nice bit of kit but a little slow to bloom. Pop can stove is far quicker to get going and less likely to go out.

EDIT: Beaten to it.

Mines running 130 (so not much help to you) but I think either 120 or 140 would work well … such a fantastic frame.

I’ve got a Haro running 2.2 Race Kings, you could go a touch bigger but not a vast amount. No rack or guard mounts.

I know it doesn’t sound like it’ll quite fit the bill but it is a cracking frame. It’d make a nice 1/2 fat project.

That’s the spirit Eccles 😀

Gourdon 20 … can’t fault them, love mine.

Be patient, I’ll let you know what to do with your cans later … up to my eyes in plaster just now 😉

I see your point … could all take a turn for the worse yet though. Remember last March? We had snow under the hammocks.

First part of how to make a pop can stove went on the WRT blog last night. Second/final part up tonight, fingers crossed.

http://welshridething.blogspot.com/

Now, I think that’s where the problems stem from … Brant designed the thing to work and behave in a certain way. Now Brant’s no longer there they just get ‘packaged’ and sold as a more hardcore 456 … the original concept has been forgotton about … shame really because it worked very well.

MussEd … 456 SS were designed with a very slack HA so you could run short forks and still benefit from the said slack HA. The Summer Season and normal 456 are pretty different beasts.

I’m not sure if you were talking to David or me regarding high horses, etc but I’m sure we were only trying to help. Look at Chainslapps pic and then Kens … one of those bikes looks and sits right and one doesn’t due to the forks (no offence Ken).

David you beat me to it … why do folk keep insisting on long forks on SS, buy a 456 instead.

Don’t wait till spring, you’ll miss half the fun 😉

Pete if you suscribe to Trail you’ll get a Pacific Outdoor mat free … just like mine.

Slugwash … that looks quite a bit like this.

http://www.outdoorgear.co.uk/eshop.asp?wci=product&wce=51140102&utm_source=Froogle&utm_medium=Google-shopping&utm_campaign=Froogle-datafeed&CameFrom=froogle

If you fancy something along the same lines but cheaper, there’s this.

http://www.outdoormegastore.co.uk/acatalog/Jamet_Shelter_Single_Hoop_Touring_Tent.html

Aye, the lockrings are normal right hand threads.

Must agree about the tools, always bothered about not been able to tighten the chain on multi day rides … tools are much too heavy to carry about. I’m considering getting some aluminium ones knocked up. I reckon you could cut about 20 degrees from the tool and it’d still work, don’t know if that’d give you enough clearance.

Nope, no snugpack in there.

Don’t know if it’s of any interest but this months Trail magazine has a one man tent test … be warned they’re not cheap though, my Helium gets top budget tent and they’re £200!

For the more hardcore they’re testing tarps next month 😉

Tiger what are your plans at weekend? It’s looking like I might be free … but not in a Mr Humphries type way.

Tiger is that your map in the picture? … ’tis very nice. If it is yours, what date is it – 1780ish?

Sorry you don’t get to find out map numbers until April 28th 😉 … ’tis the law. You can always get discount maps if you join the Backpackers club, I’ve saved a fortune over the years.

Bigface, I reckon the one thing I wouldn’t do is load up the GPS and let it take me between the grid references without me having worked out a route on paper first.

Bigface I never use a GPS to navigate (always seems harder than using a map imo) but I do have a cheap one that I sometimes use for checking GR … you know what it’s like, sometimes the map and the ground don’t tally in the way your mind thought they would, so it’s just nice to double check … there’s a couple of examples on a post on the WRT blog.

EDIT just looked, the one I have is a Garmin etrex … I imagine they don’t make it anymore 😉

I’ve used Superstar wheels and can’t fault them. MT15s seem to get a good press too.

How about a night in a bothy? … can you tell I’m tight?

As has been said, panniers alter the bikes C of G more than the frame bag option. It’s a bit of an aside but panniers also encourage you to take more stuff than you really need 😉

There was an interesting article in an issue of Adventure Cycling mag last year about the best way to carry weight. They concluded that if you are using panniers you’re better with them on the front rather than the rear.

I’ve also seen panniers ‘ripped’ off on technical trails … small gaps and panniers don’t always mix.

I shall be giving the M stove its first test later … once I finish plastering my kitchen wall. I’ll put my findings on the WRT blog. Reckon we could do with the winding dropping a touch though, will it count if I do it inside?

I find that sometimes tents can make the weather outside seem so much worse than it really is. As Ian says, when you can see what’s happening it doesn’t seem quite so bad … somehow you feel part of it.

Is that your RAB jacket?

Hammocks good with me, I’ll have a look on the map for trees. If the hammocks rockin’ don’t come knockin’ …. as I’m obviously just about to tip it over and fall out!