The English voted for the Conservatives last GE, including (IIRC) their manifesto pledge to simplify Planning laws in favour of a presumption FOR development.

If your towns and villages are getting “built out” then it is down to the party that the people collectively voted for…

Not entirely sure I would trust all these so called business leaders or CEOs as, for the most part, I suspect their primary motivator is what will keep their company most profitable

Yes – but that profitability is what keeps their employees (UK Joe Public) in jobs…

Again, there is a sense that the EU is a slow and steady march to tighter integration to absorb and consume all of the European nations into a single conglomeration

I’m not sure that this is really the case… 5-10 years ago perhaps, and amongst the core Franco-German membership. UK isn’t the only non-Eurozone country by a long way… the Scandinavians are going to sit there quietly getting on with their own take on EU membership, just as we have.

In some ways the accession of the eastern countries has also made a single European state much less likely. Tensions with Russia along the Eastern border would be come intolerable (to the Russians) long before there was a USoE.

As I said, perhaps a political dream of the core members, but surely a very unlikely outcome irrespective of UK decision

My point being that Dyson is not a major UK employer. Yes, very supportive of R&D and has innovative products…

But manufacturing jobs are all offshore in lower wage economies – claimed to be to serve the Pacific markets and allow UK R&D investment(both fair enough).

But what about the UK economy??? Jobs for UK workers?

Dyson moved manufacturing out of the UK, so he isn’t an “exporter” as far as this country is concerned.

from wiki

Production moves to Malaysia[edit]

Initially, Dyson vacuum cleaners and washing machines were made in Malmesbury, Wiltshire. In 2002, the company transferred vacuum cleaner production to Malaysia. Dyson stated that the company requested planning permission to expand the factory to increase vacuum cleaner production, but that this application failed. However, the local government says that no such permission was ever sought, as the land Dyson planned to use was privately owned and the original owner did not want to sell.[26] The move was also due to the most suppliers being located in the Far East and Dyson wanted to get as close as possible to be cost effective.[27] Also, at the time of the interview, James Dyson mentioned that the market was largest in New Zealand, Australia, Japan and potentially in the Far East market, and therefore the decision to shift production to Far East was driven by the need to get closer to the consumer base. As Dyson was the major manufacturing company in Wiltshire, outside Swindon, this move created some controversy as trade unionists claimed that the move would impact the local economy hard.[28]

In the following year, washing machine production was also moved to Malaysia.[29] The move was driven by production costs in Malaysia which are lower by 30% compared with the UK, however it created a loss of 65 jobs.[30]

In 2004, the Meiban-Dyson Laundry Manufacturing Plant was launched in Johor, Malaysia. The newly opened RM 10 million (approx. $2.63 million) plant is a joint venture between Dyson and the Singapore-based Meiban Group Ltd., which has manufacturing facilities in Singapore, Malaysia and China.[31]

Dyson stated that the cost savings from transferring production to Malaysia enabled investment in research & development at their Malmesbury head office.[32]

In 2007 Dyson formed a partnership with the Malaysian electronics manufacturer VS Industry Bhd (VSI) to take on a major role in Dyson’s supply chain, from raw material sourcing and production to distribution. VSI also undertook an extensive production plan to supply finished product to Dyson’s destination markets around the globe (America, UK, Japan, etc.).[33]

While it is often mentioned that Dyson has nearly 4,000 employees,[34] Dyson has not publicly stated where those employees are actually located, however, it is known that VS Industry Bhd (VSI) currently has around 4,250 employees at their Malaysian facility which manufactures Dyson products,[35] and in 2007 it was reported that Dyson alone was responsible for 80% of VS Industry Bhd (VSI) revenue.[36]
[\quote]

Why would anyone take notice of Dyson?

Just in case it’s not already ^^

My father used to collect swarms and re-home them…

Local council probably the best bet – I know that local bee-keepers used to register with some councils

Our kids have had the occasional small amount of wine etc. Don’t see too much of a problem – certainly more “normal” than the prohibition type stance and more likely to result in normal behaviour as an adult. IME prohibition results in binge indulgence as soon as you look old enough to get away with it…

Talking of age limits though, out on a walk yesterday with teenage son and decided to pop into pub for a mid-walk beer. I was very tempted to order a shandy for my son as I remembered that was fairly normal in the early 80s… He ended up with a coke as I had no idea whether I would get served, laughed at or thrown out 🙁

@rkk01 we need to do what Obama has done and refocus towards Asia. Europe is stagnant and the EU incompetant. We need to look East.

In many ways yes, and this has been in progress for 20+ yrs (Australia and the US have been Pacific focused since the end of WW2)

A focus to the eastern economies may be all very good for investors and the financial markets, but I’m still not sure how that tallies with UK working class wage and employment growth. Our post-industrial woes require mass employment prospects here in the UK

All that happens is they have those options post brexit and here they don’t have access to the EU market as well
It will only speed things up not stop them.

This.

Re the earlier comments about “real world” and Tees side. I work with real clients in the manufacturing sector. Over the last 10-15yrs many have closed UK plants and moved them to E Europe or the Far East. One reason is employment costs (but also skewed UK land values, where a UK site can generate more cash being sold for housing than making “stuff”). My working contacts extend from boardroom to security gate and provide a real insight into how these companies operate and how their staff think at lots of levels in the career structure…

If you Brexiteers want a more competitive UK, outside of the EU, then YOU HAVE TO EXPECT that UK wages are likely to fall (or less people will be employed).

Is that what you are voting leave for?

You complain about the working class competing with cheap Eastern European labour at the moment. That will change post EU – the British working class won’t need to compete with Eastern European or Chinese labour as the employers will have moved there!

Solo – please, please think about this:

Please post back when you have been replaced by a European worker who has agreed to do your job for 50 percent of your salary. That’s what is happening right now to people in the UK and unless you’ve experienced it. You’re just piss’in in the wind.

How do you think British wages / employment prospects will change if we vote leave?

To me, your comment screams stay in…! I don’t understand how we could leave AND have an economy that’s MORE COMPETITIVE

“Vote Leave: take back control” just sounds like being about pushing UK wages DOWN. How else do BJ, Gove, Farage etc envisage that the UK economy will become such a competitive, free trading success story?

I’m not saying it can’t be done – I just struggle to see how we become more competitive globally and improve wages / employment prospects for the British working class

LMFAO at business leaders urging us to remain. Conflict of interest??

I’m getting pretty exasperated at this sort of fatuous comment. Yes, business leaders get a poor wrap – “fat cats” etc, but business is about forecasting future performance and then meeting plan.

That might be very good for fat cat bonuses – BUT ITS FWKING ESSENTIAL for all the employees delivering that plan….

Plans slip – markets change etc, but it’s uncertainty that screws it up… And if it’s looking like the plan’s going to drift then it’s hold on recruitment first, and cut back headcount second…

I don’t give a flying fig if a few Chief Execs “retire early” – what we’re talking about is the livelihoods of very many ordinary employees.

All the shite ^^ about UK being big enough, smart enough etc to adapt to changed markets may well be right, but at what cost???

Sad to sound ageist, but the demographics here have all the hallmarks of a last selfish indulgence of the baby boomer generation, aided and abetted by the wilful right wing idealagogues and the misinformed.

We’ve got a Marshall Stanmore – excellent (to my ear) for the sort of music Marshalls are meant for…!

ipconfig settings are as stated above.

But the 192.168.1.254 won’t get me in to the router home / setup page, even after a full reset 🙁

So, assuming the worst, what would be worth looking at as a possible replacement???

Which is the “home” IP…?

ipconfig is showing the correct router IP under Default Gateway and Windows is showing a local area connection.

Still can’t access the router config screen though.

The other IPs shown by ipconfig are IPv4 and subnet mask

FTTC DSL line into a BT modem box, then EWAN connection to the BiPac. The router is actually showing green status lights for Internet and Wireless WPS, orange for EWAN and the two wired Ethernet ports that are in use…

Full reset uses the recessed rear panel button presumably?

No Default Gateway IP listed in ipconfig…

And the default BiPac IP won’t look up the router either (192.168..1.254 as per scardetpants, but also remembered by my own browser when I started to type)

I’m guessing the router may be borked – full reset, or failing that, what’s good in Routertrackworld…?

From my new phone handset, I gather 802.11n has now been superseded…

Thanks – that’s consistent with online references…

It’s been a very good, rock solid and dependable router – much better than the Netgear one it replaced

2) They know it, we know it, everyone else knows it.

Sadly, no. I hear people daily who

A) believe that we really do send £350M per week to Europe,
B) and that it could / would otherwise be spent on the NHS

Well leave do project their 350m made up number every single second

And Redwood was defending it on R4 earlier this week 😯

Mrs rkk01 has a 500L twinair (what’s MPW? Is that the 7-seater?)

It’s a nice car to drive. Not quick, but ok. Reasonably spacious, comfortable.

Biggest disappointment is fuel economy – which is worse than the Abarth 500 it replaced 😯

Mail, Safari and Facebook biggest mobile data use (1.1, 7 and 5 gb respectively)

Sodding football

THM, I wouldn’t be so sure that they are going to only be mildly mean to us.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jun/10/no-single-market-access-for-uk-after-brexit-wolfgang-schauble-says

“Europe will also work without Britain if necessary,” Schäuble said. “At some point, the British will realise they have taken the wrong decision. And then we will accept them back one day, if that’s what they want.”
I’m right mate, they’re going to pour fuel on the pyre and stand back to watch with glee.

So, putting in terms that the xenophobes and 50s/60s rose tinted brigade would understand:

“We’re going to let the Germans win the war”

Walk away from Europe, leave it to the Germans…

A collective Dunkirk, but without the spirit or intention to return

FFS, GET A GRIP

(NB: not my views – just trying to frame it using the UKIP / VL vernacular, terms of reference)

TBH, I thought the “German thing” and “we won the war” stuff that was still prevalent in my youth (70s-80s) had been all but eradicated over the last 20 yrs (well, since the election of Labour in 1997, which ushered in a more modern, moderate and tolerant tone)

We appear to be going backwards

They are misinformed, but as I said last night, this referendum has exposed the real xenophobia/racism that lies latent just below the surface in our society. VL have tapped into this very successfully as have UKIP and EDL in the past. Its not a pretty sight, despite it apparent success

Sadly very true…

I know many “ordinary” folks who are perfectly decent in every outward way, but after a few beers, or in private, express the most horrific anti “anything other than English” views…

It’s probably[/I] unfair to single out the English working classes in this, similar attitude exist in Wales (and probably elsewhere in the UK), but it does appear to be something quite characteristic of the English psyche

And here’s a thing on lamb…

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36481805

Reckless comes across as a complete numpty – we want more free trade deals, open up our agricultural markets – but more direct support to our farmers???

Wont ever happen – even at the unfounded £350M pw lie level, it’s not going to go far…

Farmers, NHS, no VAT on fuel…

Currently 144mb and fetch set to manual… (So not responsible for the data usage 😕 )

But each manual fetch results in another couple hundred old emails being downloaded.
Newest version of iOS installed

You appear to have completely missed that point.
EU stopped UK importing NZ butter.
Got to fix the market to justify

Utter bobbins
Last I checked, Anchor butter was still one of the most prominent brands in the local supermarket, and always plenty of NZ lamb…

I’d actually prefer my meat and dairy to be Welsh / Cornish / British anyway and tend to make those decisions when purchasing

I’m fed up with the UK being let down by BBC “balance” & the unbridled print media bias.

The extreme views and clear mis-truths need to be challenged and dismissed, not reported in a balanced way. The same happened in the last General Election – broadcasters end up giving same airing to the parties on the fringe as the mainstream. I “get” the argument that it exposes their views to challenge, but the essentially BBC acted as UKIP’s recruiting sergeant . The same is at risk of happening here with the outloons.

To cite the BBC’s recent Douglas Adams quotes:

“All opinions are not equal. Some are a very great deal more robust, sophisticated and well supported in logic and argument than others.”

OT, but that new Giulia looks tasty

Wasn’t sure if I enjoyed or not 😕

Scenery is stunning – especially for the kayaking sections and where he ended up (not a million miles from where I spent 6 weeks in 1986)

On the negative side – deeply flawed individual, IIRC.

Based on how if we leave the EU they’ll be a regional (if not global) recession, can I assume that all those voting out have got stacks of gold stored away, living in fully-owed houses and already retired?
If not, WTF are you going to do when it goes pop?

That’s about the size of it…!

Stay

oldnpastit – Member
Who has the better radar systems?
POSTED 53 MINUTES AGO # REPORT-POST

We do?
RAF Akrotiri

rkk01 – Member
Can we take it back a page or two. I’m still struggling with this bit:

You are witnessing the rise/creation of an ultra elite group of people that will one day dictate terms to nations.
These ultra elites strive for individual personal wealth only by putting themselves above many. Yes, you might think that they are merely administrative but have you encountered administrative power?
During the bad times these people will not be affected as they have all the resources require to move around unlike you the poor that will have languish with your locals. The poor are only their stepping stones to maintain their positions coz they are no different from any others that exploit.
The main issue here is why give them more rights or power to exploit and to mess up lives?
Go think about this.

Good grief – what utter nonsense… And doesn’t answer my question about skills and attainment levels…

Go read this:
Well balanced EU referendum research – environmental professionals[/url]

It’s pretty level headed, with views from individuals who express both Remain and Leave views…

HOWEVER, what is interesting is the views on “how corrupt” etc – massive differences between environmental professionals (who have to work with the EU based beauracratic rules & regulations) and the general populace.

The truth is the EU beauacracy is there to keep Govts, Corporates, Regulators etc on the straight and narrow – and generally works

Can we take it back a page or two. I’m still struggling with this bit:

chewkw – Member
jambalaya – Member
Remain ahead but what really caught my eye was the big lead Leave have with low-skilled, un-skilled and the unemployed 49 vs 36

No surprise there to me because that is exactly how the system works.
This mega bureaucratic EU system exist as a form to maintain those elites in their positions by ensuring those with low-skilled, un-skilled and etc remain in theirs. No difference from other Politburo.

I very much understand that demographic being more anti-EU. The dangerous assumption is that they are just thick and racist. Probably more accurate to say that they have been on the receiving end of 35 years of shit, are perhaps more easily influenced by the brazen bullshit (because it taps into their poor expectations), and yes, possibly because of the level of educational attainment / degree of interest or critical appraisal of current affairs…

What I DON’T UNDERSTAND, is the assertion that it is

mega bureaucratic EU system exist as a form to maintain those elites in their positions by ensuring those with low-skilled, un-skilled and etc remain in theirs.

Are we asking for success and high attainment to be handed out on a plate? I thought Tory ethics were all about success through hard work, discipline and achievement? Surely being low-skilled / unskilled is the primary cause of this segment of the population’s poor life experience…

Are the right wingers on here asking for success to be given out to lower achievers on account of being British rather than immigrants?

The world truly has gone mad

Gove is an odious little toad

But his comments yesterday were fascinating – essentially 5M EU “economic migrants” will sink the NHS.

Sorry, that’s a classic case of logic fail….

Let’s put migrants to one side, for one moment. The UKs “cradle to grave” welfare system, including the NHS either works or doesn’t.

The system is designed to be taxpayer funded. The deal is:
– you’re born
– the state provides an education
– you work, paying tax & NI to fund the system
– the state provides healthcare and pension support
– you die

Yesterday’s NHS deficit figures were clear. The funding crises has two clear causes
1. Reduced budget provision (Govt austerity)
2. Increased demand

BUT. the increased unfunded demand is from pensioners with multiple complex problems. That is where the model breaks. Funding over 30-40 years of working and paying taxes does not match the draw on the kitty made by people who are now living 30-40 years in retirement.

What we NEED are MORE working age taxpayers

In that respect, 5M additional taxpayer will only help the NHs

Gove – Best “Remain” speech of the week 😯

I thought Gove’s intervention regarding the NHS presented a very compelling argument…
Especially with yesterday’s NHS deficit figures and analysis of the causes

Surprised it hasn’t been picked up on here!

black Granite

Keep thinking I’ll try and have a laugh with “black granite”….

Order some and then demand a discount based on trade misdescription. Petrologically granites contain free silica (as quartz), which typically imparts a lighter colouring. What is described as “black granite” is not granite