Sorry, can’t be much help with the specifics of the Five, as I’ve no direct experience of them. I can tell you the difference in radius between a standard 32T middle ring and a 36T is only 8mm. So hopefully you’ll be able to find a way of spacing the BB out a little to give you enough clearance. Will set the chainline off a bit, but just have to avoid using big/big if that becomes an issue.

Until someone just told me I can’t run a 36 on the front of the bike – it’s a Five

Don’t know about the Five. Is that a chainstay/suspension clearance issue when running a 36T ring in the ‘middle’ position? If so, is it possible to space the BB out a little on the driveside to get enough clearance?

Cheers. I already got a 10-speed SLX ‘dyna system’ front mech to stick on, so I’m hoping that will be ok. Fingers crossed!

Yeah, it’ll be fine. Just be aware you can’t mount it 1/2mm above the big ring teeth like the instructions say, it needs to be a little higher than that to clear the bash. Only issue this might cause is a little chain rub on the bottom of the FD cage when in 22 front and the smaller sprockets in the rear. If you don’t intend using these combinations much, and/or its a FS bike so has some rear suspension sag, then it shouldn’t be a problem while actually riding :D

Perthmtb – what’s this you mentioned “I would suggest also getting the M665/7 double FD to go with it though, as this will match better than the new M675 FD”

Well its not a big deal, any FD will work Ok with it – 9sp/10sp, double/triple, Shimano/SRAM. Front shifting isn’t rocket science, you’re basically just yanking the chain off one chainwheel and sending it in the general direction of the other :D

However, the M665/7 FD was specifically designed to match the M665 cranks, so has a slight advantage in a couple of areas.

1. The curve of the outer plate exactly matches the curve of the bash, whereas the M675 has to accommodate up to a 40T outer ring, so has a different curve on it. Mostly cosmetic, but it means the M665 FD looks better with the M665 bash.

2. The M665 FD is designed to mount a little higher up the seat tube than the M675 as it has to clear the bash, but still have clearance for the chain when its in the 22 ring. The M675 FD when mounted as designed can foul a bash. You can of course lift it up a few mm to clear the bash, but then the chain can rub on the bottom of the cage when in the 22 ring.

perthmtb – do you still use a 10 spd front shifter with the ‘9 speed’ front mechs quoted ?

Yes, I use the 10sp M670 shifters cos I like front & rear shifter to match, and the I-spec function so I can mate them to my SLX brakes.

Shimano 9sp and 10sp front shifters both pull 11mm of cable on the first shift and 7mm on the second, so they are interchangeable. Only thing you gotta watch out for is that the 10sp double FD (M675) uses the second shift (7mm pull) whereas the 9sp double FD (M665) uses the first shift (11mm pull). If you set the mode selector switch on the 10sp shifter to 2x it forces you to use the second shift, so if using a 10sp shifter with the 9sp FD you leave the mode selector switch in 3x and use the first shift. Sounds complicated, but it isn’t really :D

Your options are:-

1. Buy the new 10sp SLX double cranks – M675. Comes in 24/38, 26/38 or 28/40 combinations. However, there’s no place to fit a bash so if you really must have one then you either need a BB/frame mounted one or the Blackspire Defender which is specially made for Shimano doubles.

2. Buy the new 10sp SLX triple cranks – M670. Discard the big ring and fit any 104 BCD bash in its place. But then you’re left with 24/32 or 26/36 rings, so you’ll need to replace one of the rings to get a decent spread of gears.

3. Buy an old 9sp SLX double – M665. This has 22/36 rings and a bash, and will work perfectly well with an otherwise 10sp drive train (as others have said above, and I’m also running one in just this way). I would suggest also getting the M665/7 double FD to go with it though, as this will match better than the new M675 FD.

What about direct mount?

Attaches directly to bolts on the frame, or to a plate held on by the bottom bracket.

Is it worth just doing the lowers, and do you let your LBS do a full service or do you prefer a suspension specialist like Mojo?

IMHO if you’re going to change the oil in the lowers, while you’ve got the things in bits might as well put some new float fluid in the air chamber and change the wiper seals/foam rings (if they need it) – then you have effectively done a “full service”.

However, both my forks are open bath, so I’m changing the damper oil at the same time as the lowers oil. If it was a FIT cartridge then I’d probably be asking a professional to do it.

I think people recommending all sorts of bash guards on this thread should realise the OP is talking about an M785 which does not have the mounts for a big ring/bash. Only specially designed bashguards like the Blackspire defender will fit the M785!

perthmtb – where did you hear about the 40t snagging the front mech?

Read it on one of the fora. Just had a quick Google but couldn’t find it, sorry. IIRC, the issue was the outer plate of the FD cage hitting the bash when in the ‘big’ ring. No need to have a bash larger than your big ring IMHO, you reduce clearance and are more likely to hit things…

On my race bike I run the M785 without bash, as I’m less likely to hit stuff. On my ‘fun’ bike I fitted an SLX M665 because it has a built in bash. Yes its 9sp, but I’ve had absolutely no issues running it with the rest of the drivetrain being 10sp, and I’m anal about my shifting :D

Good question, cos most people assume they need to lower the FD when they take the big ring off, then wonder why they get cr@p shifting.

Fact is, todays FDs have a quite sophisticated shape on the inside of the cage, with wider bits where the chain runs on each chainwheel so you can get the use of the whole cassette at the back, and narrower bits inbetween to aid with fast shifts between chainwheels.

If you then lower it, your remaining chainwheels are out of sync with the narrow/wide bits in the mech cage, and shifting suffers.

If you could lower it enough so that the middle is running where the big was and the granny where the middle was, then OK, but before it gets that low the cage would interfere with the chainstays.

So, sorry for the long answer, but the quick version is to leave it exactly where it was when you had three chainwheels, or if your new double ‘big’ ring is larger than your old middle, then you should actually raise it a bit for best shifting performance.

Does it look good sticking up there – well no, but shifting is best. If you’re worried about looks, then get a double specific mech…

Ooops double post… :oops:

I’ve heard/read of people having problems with the defender fouling the front mech, so 38 might be better than 40.

Can’t vouch for that personally, as on my M785 I run a “bash of last resort” ie just change up into the big ring so the chain itself protects the teeth when I roll over logs :D

Ha ha, me too, it’s the morning ritual – cup of coffee and check STW!

Hope to see you out on the new Gunjin trails again soon…

I’ve just had to look into the road BB’s and it seems to get even worse, my FSA BB has given up aftre about 900Kms and even they do different standards for their chainsets!

Luckily it’s a warranty job so teh shop can scratch their heads over it next week

Hey Rich, hows it going? Quiet day in the office? :D

Yep, they will both disintegrate far to quick…

Yeah, maybe right there. I seem to be averaging about six-twelve months on my Shimano BBs at the moment, which is why I decided to go for the XTR this time in the hope it will last a bit longer than the SLX/XT level I’ve been using up until now (read the XTR is sealed a bit better).

Anyway, at twenty Euros for an XTR BB I’m not too fussed about treating them as a consumable, just like chains, brake pads, tyres etc.

So I emailed the retailer selling the A and B, and got this reply…

these articles are similar, A and B are just from other productions

Guess they don’t know either :lol:

Ah you may well be correct, I was assuming the numbering convention would be the same for press-fit, which is what I bought, (and I’m sure that’s right, A = mountain, B = road).

Yes, you’re right, in press-fit the BB91-41A is 89.5/92mm width for MTB, and the BB91-41B is 86.5mm width for road (and as far as I can see the only difference is in the width of the sleeve, and the cups are identical!).

But unfortunately, the external BBs seem to be classified differently… :-(

IIRC, when I bought one a few months ago, one was for mountain, the other one for road. Though that second picture up there says mountain on the cups, the part number isn’t shown in that angle, so it may not be the ‘B’ version.

Hmm, not so sure about that. If you look in the product descriptions linked to above they are both definitely for XTR mountain cranks, and Shimano MTB BBs tend to be labelled BB50, BB70, BB90, whereas the road BBs are labelled BB4500, BB5700, BB6700, BB7900 etc. Like this…

And just to add to my confusion, I’ve now found this one which is simply labelled BB90, without any added ‘A’ or free ‘B’…

Aaaaarg! How can it be so complicated?

Does anyone ever turn the clutch off on the Shimano system?

Only to take the back wheel out or take chain off to clean. Rode once with it off by mistake and I dropped the chain, which I never usually do even with a non-clutch. So, I’ve concluded that if you have a clutch mech, always ride with the clutch on.

the “A” is at a nicer angle but doesn’t come with spacers ?

Well I was expecting some smart@ss to say “one euro”, but your answer was pretty good too :-)

But, taking your answer more seriously than it was meant, although not shown in the photo, the ‘A’ description does say “3 x Spacer 2,5mm”, so it can’t be the spacers!

Ah good, another convert to the Shimano camp – winning them over one by one! You’ll be needing an SM-MA-F180P/P2 then :wink:

My adapters are Avid (but that shouldn’t matter, Postmount +20mm is the same for everyone I’d assume).

Well, no. Avid uses cup washers between adapter and calliper, so depth of their adapter accounts for that, whereas Shimano don’t – so ignore diagram I put up above as its for Shimano adapter only.

Never used ANY conical washers on my 3 Shimano setups.
If the fork is PM and the Caliper also PM, no washers are needed anywhere.

You’ll notice that on the new-style Shimano 180 adapter (as in diagram above) there is a wider bit on the top than on the bottom. This makes the calliper at a slant to the horizontal plane of the original post mounts, and means the bolts don’t go in perpendicular to the callipers. The cup washers are there purely to compensate for this and should be used with this particular adapter.

Trouble is, that can also happen by pushing them back in crooked, even with a plastic tyre lever. So, yes – you’re about to find out how good the after-sales service at your LBS is, by whether they argue the toss, or just give you a new one :-)

Bloody right Bruce, don’t mind if we call you Bruce do you, saves confusion?

Don’t mind at all, but that’s clearly a Pom (don’t mind if I call you that do you?) trying to impersonate Bruce as he’s so pasty white…

the most expensive place in the world to live

nothing is waiting to terminally bite, sting, eat or generally kill us

pretty dull by all accounts, and virtually everyone under 25 wants to move to the UK

Everyone I met who wants to emigrate to Aus seems to be a constant whinger

He he, forget about the Indian head wobble, now we’re getting some really good generalisations and stereotypes coming out …

I could address each of your gross misconceptions individually, but it’s easier to just leave it to the UN who I’d hope you’d believe more than me anyway, and who’ve consistently rated Australia as number two in their Human Development Index, which the tabloids like to call the “where’s the best place in the world to live” table…

Now, let me see, where’s the UK in this…

Oh, there you are, at number 27, right above the Czech Republic :D

Well most of them would have seen the rest of us doing it towards them from the docks as they were being transported.

And we’re doing it back to you now as you Poms all try to emigrate here to get away from the shite weather and recession :D

no, but I would get a Lezyne Pressure Drive instead.

Nah – won’t use another screw-on head, it’s gotta be clamp-on for me now – see above…

So this thread’s got me interested in getting a new pump, and I like the idea of the mountain morph. Only thing is my favourite online store doesn’t have’em, but does have the turbo morph, which looks identical but with a small gauge, which I think would be kinda useful.

So, any experiences of the turbo morph?

I’m two years into a PhD and have just jacked it in to get a job – luckily in a related field so what I’ve done so far hasn’t been totally wasted.

As others have said above, it’s not a lot of use in getting a job, in fact one of the things that made me jack it in was that in job interviews it was coming over as a negative. I found myself having to defend why I was becoming an out of touch, over qualified but then not qualified to really do anything practical, academic!

Yes, all PhDs go thru bad patches and a bit of self doubt, but if you really aren’t interested in becoming an academic, you have no motivation for your subject, and don’t like the industry you’d go into at the end of it – then why put yourself thru three years of torture?

But, and its a big but – if you don’t have a coherent alternative plan at the moment, its probably better to be doing something than nothing. But, like me, use your spare time to plot a good escape into something you do want to do, and go riding :D

Only niggle with the screw on hose is that it can remove valve cores on the way off…

Had a puncture today and when pumping up my spare tube, every time I unscrewed the pump it took the valve core with it letting all the air out again – four times! Topeak race rocket by the way. It’s a clamp-on head for me in future…

CharlieMungus, you’ve managed to hound the OP off his own thread, when he asked a perfectly reasonable question phrased in a completely inoffensive way. Get a sense of perspective man!

Its actually quite easy to take a Shimano calliper apart and re-assemble – my thread here may help (and yes, you’ll need a T30). Trouble is, if you find you need to do more than clean, spare parts aren’t available. Grittiness could just be grit between piston and bore, or could be more serious in that the ceramic piston itself is damaged. They’re quite fragile and I’ve seen ones disintegrate if you use something sharp to push them back in, or don’t put even pressure on them. (note: Internally, the M785 calliper is identical to M666 shown in my thread)

By the way M675 and M666 calipers are identical, new ones are just painted a slightly darker shade of grey and the “SLX” logo is in the new style.

but has anyone had any success in stripping down and rebuilding

Yes, see my thread here. Shimano callipers can be serviced as easily as any others, the problem though is if the seals or pistons are borked you can’t buy spares.

However, with a new SLX calliper only 30 Euro from here you might as well buy a new one…

sorry, giant own brand shock

Will undoubtedly be made for them by one of the big boys, so you need to find out who (LoCo will probably know), and buy the appropriate air can service kit…

Will a 2x front mech work properly with 3x shifter

Yes, in fact Shimano don’t make 2x shifters (unlike SRAM) so that’s your only choice. Although the newer 10sp shifters do have a 2x/3x mode switch.

But, the cable pull is different on the first shift versus the second, you have to pick the right one to operate your 2x FD.

All Shimano shifters, 9sp and 10sp, pull 11mm on the first shift (granny to middle) and 7mm on the second shift (middle to big).

If your FD is a 2x 9sp like the SLX M665/7 then its designed for an 11mm pull, so you need to use the first shift of your shifter. The newer 10sp 2x FDs like the SLX M675/6 and XT M785/6 are designed for a cable pull of 7mm so you need to use the second shift of your shifter. If fact, that’s all the 2x/3x mode switch does on the 10sp shifters, it forces you to use the second shift position, which has the right cable pull for the 10sp 2x FD. But – if you’re mixing a 9sp 2x FD with a 10sp shifter, which is fine, you have to set the 2x/3x mode switch to 3x and use the first shift position to get the right cable pull.

Will a saint front mech work?

Nothing to do with the shifter and cable pull, which is all fine, but IIRC the Saint had a different chainline and the FD was further outboard as a result, so you may find lining it up with your SLX double a problem!?!

Might have been me who suggested the Schrader vale, can’t remember, but anyway the aircan on a shock is a pretty simple beast, and if there’s air escaping there’s only two ways it can go – out a leaky valve, or past the seals.

So, if its not the valve, then next thing I’d suggest is replace the seals – if this hasn’t been done in six months then probably about time to do it anyway. Air can seal kit only costs about twenty quid and has everything you’ll need…

Then just follow these[/url] instructions, or if you don’t feel confident to do it yourself get it done professionally. Probably no need to buy a whole new shock…

Edit: All the above assumes a Fox shock, you didn’t say, but RS would be similar, just need to Google the right parts and service guide…