jammer – Member
Nice bike, a possible replacement for my 575.

1.1 degrees slacker for an extra 10mm of travel does seem a bit off.

read my post above, only 10mm difference in travel but 20mm difference in the a to c

Rickos – Member
Massively long in the top tube for a given size. And how do they get a 1.1 degree slackening with just an extra 10mm of fork? I thought the rule of thumb was 1 degree per 20mm/1 inch of fork travel.

typically a 150 fork is 525 a to c (rev) and a 160 fork 545 a to c (fox, bos)

jedi – Member
lol@grf

+1

Junkyard – Member
[ quote] text [/ quote]
remove the gaps in the brackets

cheers

cynic-al – Member
Pastcaring.

The Jurors of STW find thee guilty of bullshitting and hereby sentence thee to be locked in an internet forum with PaddedFred for the rest of thine days

nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!

i enjoyed the fun of the debate tbh and I have learnt a lot today.
I am only lawyer on the Internet

me two! i evan agree with al that it is a very grey area. (but don’t tell him :D )

now i just need to learn how to quote and change my spell check to english, not american english?

oh and do some work today…

sorry junkyard, i read elfs post wrong. i thought he said he got out of the car (maybe for a preemptive
strike ?) :oops:
also i’ve never condoned giving someone a good kicking, just self defense.
i see the law one way others see it a different way. i can only go on what i have read.
thankfully if i ever get arrested for defending myself i will judged by a jury 12 honest men/women.
hopefully you, al and yunki wont be on jury. :D (edit i’m not calling any of you dishonest)

sorry to quote the same ish stuff again, but i read this as i don’t have to run away and i don’t have to wait to be struck.

from the cps web page, the last line is interesting.
http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/s_to_u/self_defence/

Preemptive strikes
There is no rule in law to say that a person must wait to be struck first before they may defend themselves: R v Deana, 2 Cr.App.R. 75.

Retreating
Failure to retreat when attacked and when it is possible and safe to do so, is not conclusive evidence that a person was not acting in self defence. . It is simply a factor to be taken into account. It is not necessary that the defendant demonstrates by walking away that he does not want to engage in physical violence: R v Bird 81 Cr App R 110.

In English law the focus of the test is whether the defendant is acting reasonably in the particular situation. There is no specific requirement that a person must retreat in anticipation of an attack. Although some withdrawal would be useful evidence to prove that the defendant did not want to fight

Now please explain why it would have been reasonable to approach a car then hit the seated driver whilst they were still in the car on grounds of self defence.

i don’t think i did?

wwaswas – Member
for someone called ‘pastcaring’ you seem to care quite a lot?

just defending myself and my veiws :D

i see the law one way others see it a different way…

Junkyard – Member
you selectivey quoted the bit about not having to wait to be hit again and ignored this bit again
If there is an opportunity to retreat or to obtain protection from the police, the defendant should do so, thereby demonstrating an intention to avoid being involved in the use of violence

English law

In English law the focus of the test is whether the defendant is acting reasonably in the particular situation. There is no specific requirement that a person must retreat in anticipation of an attack. Although some withdrawal would be useful evidence to prove that the defendant did not want to fight, not every defendant is able to escape. In R v Bird (1985) 1 WLR 816 the defendant was physically attacked, and reacted instinctively and immediately without having the opportunity to retreat. Had there been a delay in the response, the reaction might have appeared more revenge than self-defence. It might be different if the defendant sees an enemy approaching and decides to stand his ground. The answer may depend on where the threat is recognised. In a public place, where there are many other people present, a judgment must be made on whether an attack is imminent. As a matter of policy, no-one should be forced out of the streets because of fear, but prudence might dictate a different answer at night when the streets are empty.

yunki, why would you damn me?

i’m far from “an agressive psycopath” but i’ll give you the “poor literacy skills” :D

Junkyard – Member
no cynic-al i’ve already proved i’m right “in the eyes of the law”

You have not you have shown how you can selectively read a quote and contradict yourself

me and al both :D

i wont be a victim.

We know your preemptive strike without fleeing ensures the other person is the victim
I am not saying your approach is wrong [ it depends I suppose] it is just not legal

“To gain an acquittal, the defendant must fulfil a number of conditions. The defendant must believe, rightly or wrongly, that the attack is imminent.”

it might be difficult to prove but i’d leave that to the jury.
as we’re constantly on cctv, id hope that it would prove i wasn’t the aggressor.

bigyinn

yes, i should know better…

no cynic-al i’ve already proved i’m right “in the eyes of the law”

if you want to argue around in circles, just keep reading the thread over and over and over….

cynic-al – Member
pastcaring you’ve conveniently ignored “retreat” – have you been taking BATTLE lessons from Fred? Anyway no one’s backing you up so I’d juct leave the thread quietly now (like our little friend wood)

Juries do not get rid of greyness – I’d wager judges are better and more impartial deciders of facts.

FWIW, I’d convict anyone for chinning a racist.

and you’ve conveniently ignored “i would prefer to walk away”

the jury decide guilt, not the judge! that’s 12 peoples opinions based on the facts not just one.
why? because 12 people are better ‘impartial deciders of facts’ than one!

junkyard

Your threshold may be set a little low but it would seem that ONLY if you cannot retreat would you be justified in apremptive blow. As you are in the open you could so would /could be charged

you may be correct about my threshhold being on the low setting. but i wont be a victim.

i don’t want to sound like a thug. i like to think i always do the right thing. if this means having to defend myself and i’m convicted, so be it. as i said above i’d rather walk away, but thats not always an option.

of coarse it’s a grey area, most laws are! thats why we have jury’s. but if you read my two examples above, there’s would be little opportunity to “retreat or to obtain protection from the police”

protection from the police? that’s funny, not in my experience!

also in the same post “i would prefer to walk away”

face it you are wrong! whether you choose to except it or not, is up to you…

edit

i really couldn’t give a toss if i was nicked for assault, if i thought what i did was morally correct!

of coarse you don’t :roll:

cynic-al – Member
At least I can admit when I am wrong.

no you can’t!

Junkyard
I assume walking towards the person and hitting them whilst they are seated in a car negates this defence.

yes junkyard you are correct. but i thought i read that the fella was getting out of the car… i maybe wrong?

i wasn’t trying to defend elf, only the right to defend myself or others to defend their selves

and to prove cynic-al wrong :D which i enjoyed :twisted:

cynic-al – Member
I still say Fred’s guilty.

ANyway I was incorrectly assuming your law was as good as ours, but it’s crap.

cynic-al – Member
Yup, that’s “pwned” right there.

you don’t like loosing an argument do you…
:lol: :lol: :lol:

The Southern Yeti – Member
I was gonna put SPD’s on it as well

that explains the ketchup bottle :lol:

i will ad that i don’t have much respect for the law. it appear that the more money you have, the less laws apply!

cynic-al – Member
In your book, whatever, we are talking about the law.

the law states i can defend myself

The modern law on belief is stated in R v Owino (1996) 2 Cr. App. R. 128 at 134:
A person may use such force as is [objectively] reasonable in the circumstances as he [subjectively] believes them to be.
To gain an acquittal, the defendant must fulfil a number of conditions. The defendant must believe, rightly or wrongly, that the attack is imminent. Lord Griffith said in Beckford v R:
“A man about to be attacked does not have to wait for his assailant to strike the first blow or fire the first shot; circumstances may justify a pre-emptive strike.”

the axe story is true! the kids weren’t trying to brake into the house, they were just making the fellas life shit cos they thought they could get away wit it. like i said earlier the old bill new about it and did nothing to protect the fella or his family…

if i’m arguing with a car driver and he gets out of the car, i presume he’s gonna hit me.
if i’m arguing with someone on the street and they step towards me, i presume he;s gonna hit me.

both examples i would get the first hit in. self defense in my book!

i’m pretty reserved, i don’t look for trouble, and i would prefer to walk away, but will defend friends, family and myself.

yes

you are as much an expert on the law as you are at making a disc mount from a spoon!

depends on the situation, sometimes necessary to do more than just one punch to the face.

a few kids on my estate were giving someone a hard time on a regular basis. the guy had had enough stepped out of his house and hit the first one that came for him, with a small axe twice in the head (the kid lived but was a little slow for awhile) the cps never brought charges against the fella with the axe because they saw it that he had no option but to defend himself and his family. the old bill did **** all to defend him!

would i have done the same thing? yes without hesitation!

sometimes in life you need to stand and be counted!

cynic-al – Member
pastcaring-not in the eyes of the law it’s not.

you don’t have to wait to be attacked first, for it to be self defense. you just have to fill threatened in the eyes of the law….

so your all abusing elf for defending his self?

@fathead

stop reading the daily mail, it isn’t doing you any favours!

@cynic-al

not assault, self defense …

yes, stiff when new. the bushes need a little time to brake in.
you wont notice when riding.

trickydisco – Member
http://www.velominati.com/blog/the-rules/
Rule 4:
Legs shall be SHAVED year-round. ABSOLUTELY NO EXCEPTIONS. Certain hair removal creams are endorsed only on a case-by-case basis. One shall never show up to a race (be it large or small) with ANY amount of stubble visible on one’s legs.

Rule 33:
Legs are to be carefully shaved at all times. If, for some reason, your legs are to be left hairy, make sure you can dish out plenty of hurt to shaved riders, or be considered a hippie douche on their way

roadie rules? = shite

tazzymtb – Member
furry legs and lycra look awful so I shave my legs and it does make it easier when I stitch myself back up following the odd owie as well.

(I can’t see the point of bothering A&E when I can do a passable a job myself and chicks dig scars)

super glue, works for me and my hairy legs.

freecaster.com

this is the first year since 2005 i’m not there, gutted.

don’t think it’s available to watch anywhere. :cry:

elf any idea how much soda blasting costs to do a frame?

this

theotherjonv – Member
once you have the technique right for a drop off a kerb, then you have the technique right for a drop off anything. Match the energy of your push to the speed you’re going, not the size of the drop. And then it’s about waiting, you’ll reach the ground eventually.

and this

looks like a good one to progress on though. Start on the rollable bit (I assume just left out of shot) then just keep edging 6″ left, if you get to the tree in one piece then good on yer

ampthill – Member
Have you been to PORC in kent

my cousin does the downhill races there. The photos look gnarr to me

hope your taking the piss?

@ psychle train to stockport tun right. i’m sure you could find a friendly local to show you around?

Shirley all you have to do is do the string up?

puppy