I’ve got an original Gravity Dropper. Seriously ugly piece of kit and the first one I had snapped off at the seat mount after a couple of years, but I noticed the replacement part had been beefed up and has since lasted 5+ years of hard riding. It’s not pretty or particularly well engineered, BUT it does work well.

I like the sound of the Specialized post with 3 position drop. Makes a lot of sense to have a best pedalling, cruising and full on DH position. I think I’d prefer that to an infinite position dropper. 125 mm drop sounds perfect too.

My 10 year old high end “Enduro” rig weighs about 34 lbs and that was considered pretty light back then – for a bike that could actually take a proper beating. All the sub-30 lb options back then were made out of cheese.

So I think 29 lbs today for an alloy framed bike that can charge on properly tough trails is pretty good. Carbon framed equivalents I’m looking at right now are coming in at about 27-28 lbs.

Budget is pretty flexible, but don’t want to go North of £5K if I can help it. Most of the bikes I’ve been shortlisting are in the £4-4.5K bracket.

I tried 2; both 29. Unsure of exact models. Both were steep and twitchy, like sitting on a road bike. Cheap though I suppose. I felt immediately at odds with it and just couldn’t bear to ride it. It is absolutely personal preference, so don’t let my opinion sway you. I do suggest that you try others though. As I said, the Trance and Anthem felt lots better to me. More neutral, surefooted, confidence inspiring. Then again, you might love the Camber!

Thanks for coming back on this. I’d be very surprised if the Evo version with a 120 mm Pike would feel steep and twitchy, but I guess I’ll find out for myself soon enough. On paper The Trance looks slacker and the Anthem steeper. I’m finding demos of anything difficult to come by at the moment.

If you look around there are still a few bargains to be found. But I’ve noticed that manufacturers seem to be getting more savvy at limiting supply to match demand. Less new stock on the shop floor and less discounted old stock at end of season. The days are gone when shops would have racks of bikes standing in the showroom.

Same thing has happened in the ski world too. Less stock and therefore less discounting.

The trick is to effectively damp any “designer” flex you might decide to build in. I’ve been involved at a distance with Moto GP swingarms of varying torsional rigidity, but that’s a world away from removing chassis bolts!

Anyway back to reality, a lighter/stiffer carbon mtb frame would still be my choice over a relatively flexy alloy equivalent on a full suss trail bike. Is it worth £1K more? Probably not if you are on a tight budget and the rest of the bike spec (especially wheels) would have to be severely compromised to get there.

For me road biking is a very piss poor relation to mountain biking. I can understand why people would take up riding road bikes or why they might do both on/off road riding, but I really don’t get why people would move from mountain biking to road biking? For me you lose 99% of the attraction of mountain biking by converting to a roadie. This coming from a road biking background, before I discovered how much more fun mountain biking was. I’m actually surprised mountain biking isn’t becoming more popular with all the great trail centres, natural trails v increasingly busy roads and lunatic drivers.

Well I must be the odd one out, because I’m about to buy a new high-end trail bike shortly 🙂

No idea on sales trends, but having been out of the game for a good few years I’ve noticed that top end offerings from the mainstream brands are a hell of a lot better quality than they were 10 years ago. Suspensions now seem to work efficiently with decent pivot bearings and frames are actually stiff enough to cope. Prices are obviously up too, but I’d rather pay more for a better bike.

Depends if it’s good stiffness, though, not all bikes benefit from added Stiffs.

I think it’s safe to say increased frame stiffness is all good with a full susser. Obviously a bit different with a hardtail where you might want a degree of controlled flex in the frame at certain points.

With carbon it’s just easier for designers to make the optimum stiffness/weight trade-off. Carbon done badly is a disaster of course!

Just been in the LBS to throw a leg over a few frames and discuss options:-

They had a 2014 Camber Expert Evo in the shop in my size (L), but unfortunately sold a few days ago. But was good to try for size and it felt pretty good. Nice and low compared to my old bike and a fair bit longer. Makes me a bit nervous when thinking about the twisty woodland single track, but otherwise it seemed like a great in-the-bike kind of position. Wide bars felt nice too. Wheels looked massive!

There was a 2015 Stumpjumper Expert Evo 650b in medium, which though I’m sure would be too small for me, it actually seemed quite comfortable. Probably because my current bike has a short cockpit for it’s size. I felt more at home with the 650b wheels, but that’s familiarity I guess having only ridden 26ers. They didn’t seem obviously bigger to me, unlike the wagon wheel 29ers.

Also looked at a Trek Remedy, which the shop guy suggested as an alternative. This was the 650b version and the cockpit felt short compared to the Camber. Seemed like a nice bike, but just looked at the geo numbers and the 29er version has a very high BB, so that’s a no from me. However the 650b version has a much lower BB, so a possible contender if I bottle out of the wagon wheels. I quite liked the no-nonsense frame design and adjustable geometry.

Asked about demos and no chance this year, so will have to take a leap of faith or sit out the winter on my old bike. Not sure I’ve got the will power for the latter! While chatting away I was starting to talk myself toward the Stumpy again (29er version) for a more comfortable ride over the Camber. I’m not racing anyone and have always appreciated a plush ride.

So I’m none the wiser really, but I think whatever I end up buying will be a massive step forward so not too worried.

Weight is only one of the advantages of carbon, stiffness etc is worth a lot.

This ^
As a mech engineer working with carbon bits I would say that increased stiffness is worth a fair bit more than the weight saving. Think of the weight saving as an extra bonus.

Don’t bother. They’re shit. Properly shit.

Don’t sit on the fence, is it any good or not? 😉
Seriously, that’s the first negative vibe I’ve heard about the Camber. Just shows that personal preference is King.

What attributes made it shit for you and was this the Evo version or standard geo? I’m interested since the Camber Evo is right at the top of my shortlist for a do everything except DH and jumps trail bike. I can imagine it’s quite a different bike with or without the Pike up front.

Also what makes the Trance a million times better? If it is then I should be getting one of those, because a million times is a lot. Sorry, please ignore the sarcasm, I am genuinely interested in your reasoning as the Trance is a serious option for sure and any info would be welcome.

Another one from Ventana. Solves the long chainstay issues with pure 29ers I guess.

Fair point. If you like Spesh I’d stick with them.

Funnily enough, this would be my first Spesh bike so not chosen from brand loyalty. I just happen to like the look and spec of their current trail bike offerings and most importantly the price is in budget.

2014 models of these bikes are going cheap(er) now as well. Have a look on the Bikescene website.

Very tempted at £3,600 now for a 2014 Carbon Camber v £4275 for a 2015 (plus a wait until late October for supply). But would probably have to swap out the crap brakes and 32T chain wheel which would eat into the difference. I know I could claw some of that cost back on ebay, but I’m a lazy git! Still might go for this route though as otherwise the spec appears to be identical. Actually does anyone know if the dropper post was improved for 2015? I think I’ve read somewhere that the switch might have been improved, which could make all the difference for me as I’m a big dropper post fan. I was an early adopter of the original Gravity Dropper when they were very much a novelty out on the trails. Fugly as hell compared to a nice fixed Thomson, but one of the best investments I ever made in the last ten years. It made me smile when I saw that dropper posts are now pretty much standard issue on trail bikes and the aesthetics have improved massively too.

If you are going for a carbon 29er you could also consider the Pivot Mach 429 Carbon or the Turner Czar. Both take a 120mm form and the numbers are pretty similar to the Camber (chainstays a bit shorter, but not much, head angle about the same).

Thanks for the alternative suggestions, but on the whole I like the Spesh package better than anything else I’ve looked at and believe me I’ve looked at everything! I know a lot of people like to knock Spesh, but I think for an RRP of £4,500 (and would get 5% minimum off that) the Carbon Expert builds are actually pretty decent value and it looks like they’ve got the component spec spot on for 2015 with the move to XT brakes. So no need to swap anything out from the outset, which is nice. Other contenders were SC Tallboy LTc (another grand at least) and Yeti SB95c (also another grand or so over the Spesh). Got to stop somewhere with the budget and I thought £4,500 was enough! Not sure either of the others are really worth another grand of spend.

you could consider the non-evo stumpy if you want something a bit quicker handling? sort of a middle ground?

Interesting thought, but it’s Evo across the range on the new bikes. But I’m okay with that as I like the sound of the Evo tweaks on both bikes.

I’ve never ridden either, so don’t pay too much attention to this, but I was surprised by the chainstay length of both these bikes.

Yeah, I’d noticed that too thanks. I thought it was just a limitation of the larger wheel size (seems to add about 20 mm on average), but I do see some other 29ers around with slightly shorter chainstays eg Yeti SB95 is 445 mm. So yes, I guess there must be a trade off between nimble and stable.

I’m hoping the considerably lower weight of these carbon beauties will help even things out on that front. My last trail bike was up to around 34 lbs I think (although built like a tank), which is pretty lardy by today’s standards. Chainstay on my last bike was 431 mm for comparison.

Are your previous bikes also 29ers or 26?

Good question! All 26, so this would be my first 29er (apart from all my road bikes of course). I’ve always thought mtb wheels were a bit small (started as a roadie and I’m quite tall) so happy to get on the 29er bandwagon. Also be doing a lot of fire road ploughing in my local woods, so a faster roll will be nice. I did briefly think about the 650b option on the Stumpy, but the geo looks like a bit of a bodge job for 2015 and the Camber of course is 29er only. Reading between the lines Spesh seem to favour the 29er standard and 650b is really just something they were forced into offering. I see 650b as the new 26 rather than something different, but 29 is a definite step up in size for better or worse.

Many thanks guys and especially to JCL for taking the trouble to write a detailed response. This is really useful info and much appreciated.

Looks like I’m on the right track with my shortlist and I’m sure I would be very happy with either bike, but I think I’m still slightly favouring the Camber Evo. The Pike up front gives me confidence it will be plenty stiff and plush enough for UK trail duties and it sounds like the FSR rear end is nice and supple.

@JCL – interesting point about the long Wheelbase and low BB – complete opposite of my last bike, which was short and v. high! I’m fairly tall (6’1″) with long legs and so would appreciate a low BB. In hindsight my last bike was too tall. It was great for pedal clearance over rocks and roots, but sometimes I felt like a monkey up a stick! Only saving grace was a gravity dropper post, which went some way to compensate on faster trails. But a low BB was high on my priority list this time around to keep my mass down lower while still having a decent pedalling position. I do have a slight concern about the longer wheelbase as I do encounter a fair bit of tight singletrack, which again favours the Camber as it’s about an inch shorter than the stumpy, but still a fair bit longer than my previous steeds.

While I agree there is not much tech riding near Didcot, the Chilterns is still a good spot for natural trail riding. Certainly kill a good couple of hours and some of the climbs and descents are interesting. Suggest starting out from Watlington, climb straight up to the top of the ridgeway and then start exploring from there.

Aston Hill is not that far away for a more gnarly experience. Swinley is good too for more dedicated singletrack – one of my favourites actually.