Describe sore?

Sore as in
1. So painfull amputation is required
2. Done something bad to them and they are now knackered.
3. I had to put some effort into it and now they letting me know about it.
4. I want some sympathy
5. Have a nice cup of tea.

Soul and Whyte 19 steel are under 5 lbs, but yes, there is almost always a weight penalty to get the feel of steel.

Whyte 901/905/19 Trail sounds like what you need. All the ability of an XC bike but with a slack head angle which means it’s ace in the more techy terrain.

I demo’d a couple of bikes like that this week; a Bfe with 160mm Wotan forks on and a Blue Pig X with 160mm 36 Vamilla’s. The Bfe was a small frame and it felt fun on the descents like a little dirt-jump/bmx, but with the long fork on it the seat angle was so slack I could not get the thing to do techy climbing at all. The Blue Pig was a larger frame and possibly on the big side for me and felt less playful, but it rode the downhills better than the bFe and it techy climbed like a whippet up a drainpipe in comparison.

Yetiman… when are they getting the new ones in?

Hi. I wrote the review the other day so I guess I can comment… it was also my bike that Yetiman above rode last night 😉

As I posted the other day I think the Deville and VIPr set up is the best I have ridden, but the set up I have now is damn close… and a damn sight cheaper. I run a simple Float R rear shock with Push tune, and an RC2 Float fork. For tuning the shock speak to TFT/LoCo/Mojo/Stendec about what you like and dislike and they will do the rest (with TFT you can ride it for two weeks and if not happy send it back with comments – the others are probably the same).
Same with the forks. Both TFT and Stendec like the Basic Float R front fork as it’s easier to tune than the RC2/FIT versions (that’s what they told me).

I could not get on with the air shock before the tune hence the CCDB. I very rarely run the CCDB now as the Float R is 90% as good.

Money no object or if you “need” new bits I would be tempted to go Bos, but seeing as my kit has life left in it and I love my bike as it is I’m sticking with what i have. When the fork or shock dies I’ll figure what to do then.

I should have said… my fork and shock were both secondhand. The Push tune to the shock cost many times what I paid for the shock but was well worth it.

Oh… good going getting a Patriot to 30#

Nice to see one of them with a short stem on it…

I’ve seen a few cracked and welded frames go on to crack again. But I’ve also seen a frame repaired by a guy that welds helicopters for a living have no further issues. I think much will depend on the quality of the welder involved.

Do the Gore’s outer still have a tendency to crack where they move a lot? I had them last time round and they cracked and split on my full suss bike after a year but lasted 5 years on the hardtail.

XTR only ever did me 6 months as they are not properly sealed. These days I go for cheap full outer if I can.

Nice sugestion of the siberian tiger ear wax, can I use it on my chain? It might be better than the mechanically recovered panda fat I currently use.

Built up the are with liquid metal stuff and left to dry overnight. I’ve got the bead shape pretty good inside and built it up a bit on the inside and outside so it will hopefully be nice and strong. Fit a tyre tonight and hope for the best 😆

The Flow is only a good rim because its so wi-ide and hence makes big tyres wi-ider… and tyres are always the best thing to upgrade as they make the most difference.

If your frame can take some nice balloon like Big Betties, Rubber Queens are Maxxis etc then thats a good AM place to be to ward off the dreaded pinch flats on water bars etc.

I should have added that this is my personal experience and hence YEMV

Kings have lasted me the longest but marked my steerer tubes. 5+ years.
Hope – poor seals so full of mud and crap after a year but stainless bearings so give it a clean and repack ready to do the same next year.
FSA Orbit Extreme – 5years guarantee – went rough after five years… go figure. Allegedly two versions of this – OIM and Aftermarket… OIM not so good?
FSA – MX – two years and they are rough
FSA – XLII – One year and it’s rough
Acros – Rusty in a year. Replaced under warranty. They use stainless bearings now and guarantee five years… time will tell.
Cane Creek – ten years ago the top of the range one rusted on me in two months. Probably better now but I’m bitter.
RaceFace – never stay tight
Crank Brothers – rust in a few months.

I’ll maybe give that putty a go… perhaps it’s not completely written off just yet then… thanks torsoinalake 😉

If I move it to my other bike it well get less of a hard time and the consequences of a failure will be less of a walk out… it’s worth a go. The rim I’ve ordered will be a good spare which I should probably have anyway.

Hindsight is a wonderfull thing. To get it to run tubeless again I only needed to move it a tiny bit, and that I did successfully. It was when I get temped to try and get it a bit better that it cracked completely… dumbass.

I should have left it after the first tweak, there is no way it can be run now as I completely knackered it 🙄

How stiff are the devilles compared to the 36s?

Not a lot of difference. If you use the 36 as a benchmark there is a little more twang; i.e. when really pushing under hard braking into rocks I thought perhaps a slight feeling of the fork tucking under and twanging back. I used to get the same sensation on my 180mm single crown Travis and 170mm Sherman forks, but it doesn’t effect the ride and only happens when your in the soup anyway. I noticed no difference on the steering flex and the bike goes where you point it which is a rather good trait 😀

how do the new settings compare with the old?

Surprisingly little, two whole turns of HSC, and a few clicks of everything else. Made the shock much more taut and controlled which I like a lot, the bike sits higher and pedals much better. Downhill its still super controlled… excellent result from 5 mins on the phone. Cheers Dave at TFTUNED..

Last week I would have sold it. With the new settings I am not so sure… more fiddling required.

I hear you pilot. I did two big rides over the weekend. Saturday was great fun riding with big drops and daftness but all rideable so I ran the CCDB with the new settings to try it. Sunday was a monster 4000+ft Scottish peak with a wad of carrying and a rocky awesome descent… I hummed an haaa’d and eventually went with the Float R. The CCDB would have been much better and with hindsight I wish I had, but the Fox was more than good enough… and I guess thats’ what it comes down to. Is a “good enough” feeling shock good enough or do want “the best” feeling shock?
Had I had the VIPr option I would absolutely have run that as it was better than my tuned Fox… but would I still be wishing for the CCDB??? I’d love to try the CCDB and VIPr (and a Stoy) back to back.

New suggested settings for my CCDB from TFT made a huge difference 8)

I’m now feeling the love for this rear shock, it now feels taut but playful… like the VIPr… but still with the extra smoothness on the stupid.

Captainmainwaring up rather high.[/url]

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Well used.

Both the Deville and the VIPr (and the two Nic’s) came from one of my local pushers – Gravity Sports.

http://www.gravity-sports.co.uk/

Send him a note from his contact page and he’ll get back to you… I think his site needs an update.

Richard said he could them quite quickly… quicker than I can get the money together anyway 😥

When I got my Float RC2 a year ago I was blown away by how good they were, they now badly need a service and do not feel as good as the Deville’s I just tested. The Deville also has a slightly different more damped/controlled feeling which I liked.

I prefered the Float to the Van… I found the Van wallowed more whereas the Float… er… Float-ed.

I quite liked the Marz 55 RC3 Ti I had a shotty of but there was the usual Marz top-out-clunk which bugs me… but I would love a more in-depth play with them.

Lyrik’s I would like to try.

What would I currently buy if I had the cash? Deville’s in 170mm flavour with tapered steerer and a matching VIPr rear shock.

Sounds awesome… why on earth are you even thinking about not taking it?

The only way to save this world from your carbon footprint is to top yourself… and even then there will be a carbon legacy

i’d like to see Vip’r Stoy comparo now

If someone lends me one in the right size with the correct spring I’ll easy test it and write up on it 😀

On a side note I’ve got some new recomendations on settings from TFT for my CCDB so I’ll be having another play with that.

AndyA… I’m about 13-1/2… all muscle 😉
My tuned float is the first air shock I’ve gotten on with, and the VIPr is better. Not sure how that will translate to other riders and bikes, but it sure impressed me.

Look into my eyelets 😈
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BOS VIPr[/url] by thepimpmessiah[/url], on Flickr

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BOS Deville 170[/url] by thepimpmessiah[/url], on Flickr

I have some Fox 2007 36 Van RC2’s which have been ‘tuned’. They are incredible BUT aggressive.

Do they bite or is it all bark? 😉

I was thinking of getting mine tuned but will probably flog them on and get Deville’s now.

Thanks Three Fish – interesting comment about the newer Fox forks… I’ve read that some folk prefer the older ones so perhaps they like the settling… and I agree about the RC2 damper… one click fine, two clicks fine, three clicks OUCH 👿

What Low Speed and High Speed settings did you have on the Fox?

Ones I was happy with… I know from fiddling with them in the past that where I had them is were I like them. Add LSC and they hold up better and are less divey, but they are also less plush. Add HSC and my eyeballs get knocked about too much.

Hi Heihei, I would say that the CCDB is better for all out grip in pure DH terms, it really is amazing when plowing through the silly gnar… but the VIPr handles techy climbing so much better (than CCDB or Float) because it doesn’t sit into the travel. I don’t think I have my CCDB set up as well as I could and perhaps my spring is too soft? There are a few things I want to try with my CCDB to see if I can get better climbing performance to match the doonhall ability.
Straight out of the box the VIPr is stunning wheras the CCDB takes time and effort to set-up. My Float R rear was Push tuned to reduce the blow through and I’d thought it was good because it was better than the coil I used to run (DHX4), but the VIPr is another step above… due to the climbing performance I would say that at the moment I prefered the VIPr to my CCDB. Anyone want to buy a 215 x 63 CCDB

As for the fork comments… you provide the forks and I’ll test them 8) … but yes… I know my forks are old and could do with a service but they have always settled into the travel which the Deville does not do… and I think it’s that part of the performance which makes them feel different/better. The downside of that is not being able to preload the fork in the same way that I do with my Float… which nearly caused me a few wee trips into the bushes but I got used to it quickly… mere foibles 🙄

The Yellow one was on loan for a test ride… I don’t own two Nicolai’s (now!!!).

It’s an off the shelf shock and therefore a one size fits all compromise… i.e it’s crap at everything.

Either get it tuned to your requirements or replace it with something which is.

Something different. Lets see some carbon AM wheels that don’t cost £2000

Nice wide light rims like Stans but not made of cheese. Tubeless compatibility is a MUST HAVE (tape and sealant is fine but it must work).

Stick with decent sealed hubs – make sure they can do the QR/15/20 front and QR/10/12 rear with easy changes.

Fancy staight pull spokes look cool but add little functionality and make getting replacement spokes a pain.

24/28/etc lacing always sounds cool – but you need to make sure spare rims and hubs are available. Mountain bikes get battered about more than road bikes and we do damage our kit so spares availability and price are a high priority (for me anyway).

Sounds like a nice wee niche business… good luck 😀

Soundbites never air well. I have utmost respect for the two of them doing things most of us can never dream of… come on you brits in Le Tour ❗

Snapped the base of one Gobi and snapped a lot of the wing flex bits on another… I’m sure you can guess what I think of them. Bel-air ftw.

i assume he means the huge wide grey horrible thing up to the masts at tyrebagger/elrick

Yep… we lost a fun path when they did that… but who knows what the trail fairies will “find” to replace it

Win some, lose some, it’s all the same to me.

I run either a CCDB or a TFT tuned and Pushed Float R. The Float was hopeless when I first fitted it but now it’s tuned it is a great shock. I used to have a coil DHX4 which I ran almost all the time rather than the poorly performing Float. I fiddled plenty with the Float and DHX before sending the Float to TFT, it took two goes to get the Float how I wanted it and rather then do the same with the DHX I decided to try the CCDB so I can have a right good fiddle myself.

Mostly I run the tuned Float now which I think is amazing and out-performs the non tuned DHX4 Coil… seriously… it is that good!

The CCDB is better again. I’m still setting it up and trying different things but there are times with the CCDB when it feels absolutely amazing like it’s giving you speed on the pedal strokes on climbs, or when riding the back wheel (manualling) at speed through rough stuff it’s like it’s supporting the whole bike holding it up with a big plush hand.
As I mentioned before there are also times when it feels a little dead like it needs a thump to get the oil flowing and work it’s magic… as a general rule the harder I’m working it the better it feels. When going from a flat path to a little rock off the trail to get a little “pop jump” the CCDB feels lethargic and won’t play… it’s like its saying “what the F*&^ is that???”… a similar rock on a rough path at speed the CCDB will lap up and give me all the pop I want in a super controlled way.

But… back out the adjusters too far or get silly with them and bike is nigh on unrideable… shows you just how good most shocks are… very very amusing.

If you want fit and forget great performance get a tuned shock. If you want to take it to another level and are happy to fiddle and consider playing with your suspension part of the fun then the CCDB is a great toy.

Orbit XL-2 or MX. Keep the bearings rammed with grease and they will do a few years.

I’ve never seen a cheap Cane Creek that hasn’t rusted or any RaceFace that will not loosen.

I’m still fiddling with mine. I like it and it feels better than any other shock I have used when going fast and hard, but there is a sort of lifeless feel to it when popping off rocks and generaly playing about… like it needs more “input” to get the oil flowing properly?