You wrote to the police expecting them to put on record that they would not enforce the law? Of course they're going to say they'll enforce it. That's a long way from it happening in reality.

Higgo you clearly know an awful lot about these things, but before I stand aside to your greater wisdom my work involves traffic orders often requested by local councils and pressure groups and they often fail at the outset because the police immediately object against the making of the order on the grounds they have insufficient resources to monitor or enforce it and the scale of wrong doing is not sufficient of a nuisance or constant that they should be expected to enforce. There is no point making an order where there is no intention or ability to enforce. If the Police do object to an order it almost always kills it.

Snowdon is one of the most popular outdoor destinations in Britain and has very high visitor numbers compared to other peaks because of it's ranking and the fact fat bloaters can get a train up. Just to make it clear the reasons for the order were almost singly because of incidents and behaviour of some riders on the track between Llanberis and the summit which is populated not just be keen mountain climbers but very many badly prepared people with little outdoor adventure experience often on coach trips stumbling down after a ride up in the train. Many of these people have no idea of any etiquette to anyone they meet but by number are an important part of the local visitor economy which is why the locals led the demand for the order. The reason the ranger bridleway was included in the agreement was to avoid the risk of riders going up Rangers to the summit then in ignorance or cheek riding down to Llanberis during the embargo hours.

Although some of the wardens can be quite miserable this is often as a result of having to deal with some equally uncomfortable members of the public who can jaundice their views of people who appear similar on subsequent meetings.. i think it's called predjudice. I do know many local riders who have reported getting onto the Ranger Path by error, but with innocent intentions (no one has watches in Wales), slightly on the wrong side of the time embargo and on meeting Wardens have stopped and had quite cordial friendly chats with them. It's probably a matter of respect, because if all goes wrong you might be hoping a Warden to help haul the half dead carcass, off the mountain, of you or a friend, as comfortably as he can. If you find yourself coming on the mountain after 10 check your riding stile and if stopped suggest you have had to deal with a serious mechanical problem making you late, if it's less than half an hour before 5 just push your bike till 5

And to be fair all world cup race courses are pretty groomed after two days so there is little detritus strewn across the course and they ride tyres with minimal tread which smoothly compact the ride line into something more akin to a luge piste, it was interesting to note how rotovated the course became after the Dalby Dare after two days of pro elite practice and the junior race

basically weight, even a few years ago you would still see them riding v brakes when most 'civilian' riders were on disk many only going disk if their sponsors required it. The fact you think you need suspension is driven by the marketing strategy of the companies that make suspension bikes, even when they tried to make 4x world cup tracks more brutal most riders stuck with hard tails only changing to full sus if their sponsors made it worth their while. top level racers are not that short of power that they need the assistance of technology to go faster, often the deciding factor of who wins can be down to the weight of the bike to the point that the feed zone at Dalby at the bottom of the hill was considered to be wrongly placed as many riders would not want to carry a half full water bottle up the hill because of the amount of extra power needed.

I ran two aiport expresses in a WDS config feeding from an ethernet adsl modem and that worked fine for more years than I care to remember. With 3 desktop macs 2 laptops an iphone and an ipod touch as well as the odd visitor i upgraded to a Time Capsule which backs up the laptops and with the airport expresses gives me a considerable coverage into the garend and every room, with regular and strong signal for all wanting to use it

A complete ban would be unenforceable.

I think not, you would be in breach of a traffic regulation order not trespassing making it a traffic offence, we originally spoke to North Wales Police hoping to get them to admit they would be unwilling to police the TRO therefore making it pointless but I still have the letter from the Police ( Pre Brundstrom era) where they indicated that if the order was made they would support it with policing if needed.

yes originally the ban was intended to cover all three bridleways which is why we were able to prove the idea to be a ridiculous solution to what was not a very evident problem, but it was agreed that the bridleway known by locals as 'Telegraph' running between Rhyd Du and Llanberis would be exempted as it served a normal link avoiding a long road ride and needed be open during the day and helped the businesses in Llanberis and Beddgelert

Glad to be of help amplebrew

Having been involved at the coalface back in 1990-91 when the original ban was being put in place. It was the Community Council in Llanberis who wanted the ban, and was fully supported by the head national park warden for the north of the Park who hated mountain bikes more than anyone else on the park who all disliked them at least a bit. Initially the matter came to a head when a biker crashed, out of control it was said into a train, and lead to the the fear / anguish of a train de-railment caused the whole thing to blow up along with a couple of mtb mags who published stories that some thought unreasonable at the time.

Those arguing against bikes also quoted erosion as much an issue as the danger from bikes coming down too fast as reasons to seek a ban. it should be noted the very high rainfall rates on the mountain would support research that lines such as those created by spinning or skidding bikes cause attract and enable water flow causing gulleying and is a far worse form of erosion to manage than that caused by the puddling the feet of walkers and sheep cause.

Originally the highway authority voted to make an order, however lobbying from a climber I knew who sat on the national park committee and had sons who raced MTB's in North Wales caused some loss of support for the order. The Countryside Council for Wales whose job is to protect access, rubbed their hands with glee and supported it, but it was the Sports Council who really kicked up enough shit to make the County Council stand back and call a meeting where it was agreed to delay the order whilst voluntary restraint was tried. A bike hire businesses in Llanberis objected to the proposal and indicated they would ignore the agreement. The Head Warden left the meeting pledging to start a campaign with allies at walking magazines to get readers to write in complaining about the danger of bikes demanding they be banned.

The first year of the agreement worked, all park wardens and train staff were required to record all sightings of bikes in a log book at their office and these figures were reported at monitoring meetings, later on some kind of automatic counting device was installed that still exists and gives numbers and times that bikes pass it.
Mostly the agreement has worked to reduce the excesses but it has not stopped people riding when they should not, up to 2 riders a day in the summer blatantly breach the ban but the NP are no longer so trigger happy and do not consider that level of misuse per day to be of great issue, however on a number of years the total number of riders breaking the agreement over the period has risen as high as 300+ and that appears to be the threshold that causes the NP want to reconsider introducing a more formal approach. I am not really sure if they tried to get a closure now whether they would find they were supported by such a blinkered narrow minded council but it probably is not worth the risk of testing them. Pushing the bike up just before the daytime restrictions list is probably no worse than the odd bike arriving slightly late in the morning, which given the possibility of mechanicals or punctures is hardly avoidable for the most dedicated saint on a bike.

bit of a bump until ST get Pat's press release up

Elbry Sandland
he never failed to live up to expectation….

Cant beat this for open source soundtrack music for youtube videos .. Chemical brothers .. and it's official ish
flip the switch Chems remixed

It's a shame though that Specialized cant go the full distance and mount the bike over a picture of JMC in action.

Glory Box.. Don't I get a sticker or something for "Ike's Rap" without it there would be no Glory Box or Hell is just around the Corner :)

cheers for clearing that up Mark, so as long as I have a song and I've played it more than a few times and euphoria was the outcome of the experience, you will welcome it. 'Yat Kha – Love will tear us apart' coming up very soon

Votchy there is no period of which no use of a public right can count to it's ceasing to exist, that only applies with private easements and is the reason why landowners confuse themselves over the issue. Once a highway always a highway, is the maxim and a path can only be lost through the undertaking of a legal act or an act of god that might remove the land on which it runs.

The fact is much to the chagrin of most landowners the Highways Authority of your council has a quasi judicial function and is the one first faced with determining if whether the conditions that give rise to a highway coming into existence under Highways Act 1980 S31 – 20 years use, or will consider an application made under the Wildlife & Countryside Act 1981 to have a highway added to or amended onto the definitive map. Unless an order made by the council is objected to then whatever decision it's officer came to, takes effect. Even if objected to it is decided by a planning inspector the decision goes nowhere near any courts until after the event has occurred.
The NFU and Country Landowners continually bang on about it and say Rights of Way Officers are biased towards rights users and a quick google on Marlene Masters should turn up the kind of rubbish they spout on about impartiality. Most Rights of Way officers do not sail to catch the wind of public opinion they deliver considered actions based on all the evidence and material facts and if they do not do so they will leave the authority open to public challenge,. They are so boxed in by Law, Government Circular and Case law that random decisions are rare.

Breakneckspeed makes a most relevant observations on why this process is failing off road cyclists. If Grittyshaker was a rambler there would be a whole local footpath committee out on the warpath now wanting to defend his rights. Cyclists seem to be increasingly content when this happens to all go and suck their thumbs on a forum cajoling each other into acts of disobediance rather than tackling the problems. One of these is most cyclists prefer to do their own thing and not belong to any organisation either because they cant be bothered or they cant find one they agree with, the other problem is we have too many bodies. In the last few years I have been asked by IMBA to investigate rights of way issues that were negative to cyclists interests in parts of Wales. Colin Palmer did an excellent job then to take on the council by challenging the orders they made however, he is only able to do this where they are legally obliged to consult with him and his resources to do it are very limited. Day after day cyclists are having problems unlawfully restricting their access and they come to nothing when the riders don't know what to do or they don't or can't be bothered to belong to any group that might help them. If any Rambler from anywhere in the UK has a problem, such as that reported, whether they be a member of the RA or not they can report the problem to the local, Welsh or London office any one of three local ramblers will be in touch with the local rights of way office and until they accept that no action can be taken, which is rare, they will not let the matter rest until it is resolved. This process is uniform across every county in England and Wales. The BHS are not that far different nor are the motorcycle trail riders or 4×4 users the only group absent from having such a network are cyclists. I believe in some counties you might find IMBA or the CTC active but they are so diluted and underfunded they have difficulty doing anything and since most cyclists with problems belong to neither they only represent a small group of riders. I believe all cyclists should belong or be willing to fund a cyling body to protect their rights and that there should to maximise effectiveness be only one body. The current BC, CTC, RSF, RTTC simply sees to much members money going to support duplicated organisation overheads that could be better spent on a single UK wide cycling body the most forceful lobbying group securing better outcomes for cyclists than we are getting now and that could still represent the individual interests that exist.

er because original poster asked

RoW question – is pushing or carrying your bike on a footpath legal?

did you read much or just jump to your conclusion?

if, however, a landowner met a walker using the path carrying …. property that might be wheeled and even be capable of propulsion then as long as it does not touch the surface of the right of way then the landowner should have no reason to consider challenging the walkers rights.

I would think his business is his business usually, do you tell bike mechanics to mind their own business when answering a question about mechanical issues..I never adjudicated, and you must have never come across landowners getting injunctive relief to get people off their land they don't want there.. it happens even if you don't want to hear about it.

Thanks for the cv Zulu-eleven some pedigree agreed, AK has been a close personal friend for a long long time and I am sure you are well versed with his own views on the wisdom of cyclists simply pushing their luck on access by relying on the weakness of trespass laws which he also believes will all end in tears when the lawyers and law draftsmen turn up.

I am not convinced you have come up across enough of a depth of rights of way officers to be able to get away with that statement 3 swallows dont make a summer. AK does seems to indicate the there are large variations in capability east of the Pennines but it certainly does not replicate across the rest of England and Wales.

Having handled more than a few DMMO's PPDOs, two House of Lords Appeals and a number of injunctions in order to either keeping paths open or the map correct, I have never lost one outright and if we're betting about DPP vs Jones is good enough to allow higher rights users to occupy public highway for which they fundamentally have no lawful right to be it is a lot different to a rabble of protesters using a footpath to protest about a nuclear base or animal testing labs, I do not think as a defence it would even start get you out of the shit if you find yourself pushing a bike across one of Madonna's fields or up the driveway of the O'Keefes and they are home when you do it.

If you want to encourage riders to take self action thinking the council will be forced to turn on the landowner, the danger is more real that the landowner could slap an injunction on those who turn up, cost them a small fortune and stop the rest, unless you can find evidence of forgotten historic rights on the path I would do as the Rights of Way officer advises and use the other permissive route.

Zulu-eleven you argue your point well but I find if you can say this I have to question your capacity to take make such a sweeping statement

Because very, very few PROW officers actually understand ROW law,

you are presumably inferring your own knowledge is greater than the majority of us, could you indicate what credentials might lead me to believe you could have a professionaly superior view of rights of way law.

Are you in chambers with Stephen Sauvain, George Laurence or Edwin Simpson who is a clear fan of DPP,, how many rights of way officers do you know or how much do you deal with them?

Fundamentals here are that grittyshaker is not claiming knowledge awareness of the existence of higher rights on the path so cannot be saying he in fact has a right, bit more the case he does not feel the landowner has the right to heave him off when he is walking with a bike. His photo shows a path with features not incompatible with the way having higher rights so I am not going to say it has no higher rights.

DPP v Jones is more of help in dealing with users exceeding the right to only pass and repass, such as stop to take a picnic particularly where in the past a landowner might object, it was always in principle incorrect that a person who suddenly taken ill or feint when walking a path could not lay down to rest until they got to the nearest road which some landowners would make you believe. It does not justify a trail rider pushing a motorbike on a bridleway anymore than pushing a bike on a footpath or a farmer droving cattle on a bridleway across another farmers land where the right is not recorded in the definitive map statement.

I can say from experience most rights of way officers have a considerable understanding of the law with very few relying on the walkers blue bible and are more inclined to refer to the RWLR or Sweet and Maxwell when dealing with the complexities of law the blue book is only a handy place to find relevant circulars and statutory instruments listed in one small book, They indeed often know substantially more than the solicitors and counsel that landowners wheel out to challenge authorities when they exercise their duties.

It is clearly difficult without the kind of knowledge that either Grittyshaker or the rights of way officer to adequately comment on this matter. The letter posted seems a fair statement of fact, indicating what options and courses of action are open to the council. If the route has always been a footpath and only a recent recreational need has caused use to happen then what he is saying is largely correct. The only area of hope would be in identifying evidence to show that when the path was first recorded as a footpath a mistake was made and higher rights had existed but were not known about or had been disregarded.

The issue of natural accompaniment is one that will take years to solve, it is unlikely any government will try to establish the matter through drafting legislation. The current case law is of low standing and there is contradictory case law. In order to get better case law will require two opposing parties willing to enter a legal dispute and who ever looses to have the nerve and money to take the matter to an appeal. Traditionally with appeal cases such as Rubenstein, Trevelyan and Godmanchester the appeal has been of such an important nature to walkers that the Ramblers Association are pushy enough and can see enough benefit to be willing to invest their limited funds in pursuing an appeal even knowing it could be lost.

For now the Ramblers seem willing to tolerate the uncertainty the meaning of natural accompaniment allows them and until walkers rights are seriously threatened by a restriction they will not be looking for a court fight for fear of loosing and getting a hostile decision setting them back. Cycling Organisations are notoriously absent from access based caselaw, which is unlikely to change given the increased costs of pursuing and particularly loosing appeals.

I think the most obvious thing threads like this continue to prove to me is that simply to ensure that riders have even a fundamental understanding of rights of way law above that needed by SFB, all the MTB magazines like ST should run more in depth serial features raising awareness of not only the law but also looking at how strategies for riders lobbying for better access could be more effectively managed and encouraging cyclists that spending to fund organisations that can help them get access laws favourably changed is as important as the thought of shelling out 3 times the amount you need to on a bottom bracket or headset with a sexy name on it.

Smart thinking Batman, a quick study of a history of the countryside access movement will show that before the ramblers formed a movement in the early 1930's organisations like the Peaks Footpath Society had been campaigning for 50 or more years for access to no avail, and it was not the ramblers themselves but a quasi communist group that organised the process so dont expect Captain Flasheart to come along if you do the same.. It took nearly another 20 -30 years for the eventual change required in law to take place and it was no doubt part because of the labour victory after the WW2, had the Tories got in they would have chummied along with their landowning chums.. trundle off up to Kinder Scout today they wil lhave some neat law to lock up you all up under the Tory laws aimed at eradicating travellers, road protestors and raves.. we'll come and visit al lthe martyrs in what ever gaol you find yourself

If you read the Sheffield link it is just explaining the law as it is, they have no additional legal powers.

they should upgrade all footpaths except certain honey pot etc ones (ie create restricted footpaths, disallow bikes on them, allow bikes on footpaths – most footpaths not being restricted).

Problem is that to add rights to a right of way it is not simply a matter of posting a notice in a newspaper and telling everyone to get out and use them. The EU Human Rights legislation is quite specific on what private property owners can expect from the threat of authorities imposing actions reducing their enjoyment of their property. In order to utilise legal powers the council would have to show an actual public benefit would arise for a large segment of society before it could raise a paths status. Having made the order the Council would be obliged to compensate the landowners for any loss the act causes them. Most often this is the loss in value land suffers from when additional public rights are created that means more access by the public results in less privacy.

Experience shows that where a landowner is not in agreement with increase of rights they will fight to the death for the highest level of compensation. Figures of £5000 per path are not usual but at the IMBA conferance a few years ago the Pennine Bridleway Project Officer was showing up to £20k was being given to landowners just to secure a hundred yards of bridleway.

The Scottish situation arose because its land ownership system had developed from historical Scottish practises and was not based on the feudal system introduced in England and imposed on Wales by William the Bastard and his Norman invaders. Without a large scale compensatory payment to all owners of land Scottish Access rights will be restricted to Scotland. Writing to MP's or Councils is just a waste of stamps and does little, you would be better stumping up some cash joining IMBA and let them use the money to get the rights mess sorted south of the scottish border

Not quite so sure what most played song we are supposed to be posting here each week, if it's all time plays then you're going to keep getting Ike's Rap a lot from me as it seems to be in quite a clear lead with Supervielle and next in line would be Chaka Khan. My last.fm charts give a more fluctuating choice over more recent periods, this weeks song is Dennis Wilson's Holy Man as sung by Taylor Hawkins… given the amount of play information in music libraries you could choose other ways to discover listening habits , selecting the song last played closest to a random time set every week by yourselves might add a wierd spin to music choice

I'm with tombthumb somewhat, the correct definition of Enduro lieshere an event where there are traditionally four elements of a riders ability on test, cross country riding skills, reliability of the bike and mechanic skills, maintaining a scheduled time to progress around the course with the aim to neither ride to fast or slow, and finally one or two specific sections timed to see who can be the quickest and penalise everyone else by how much slower they were than the winner.

The American name was churned up in the mid 70's by Jack Penton, Malcolm Smith and a few others who wanted to rename a traditional European Motorcycle sport of Timed, Reliability and Observation Trials for US Consumption. The American enduro rules used only by the yanks make for a far more challenging event than the international FIM based ones used in Europe which allows the rider to ride as quick as they can and to slow up and stop as they approach the check and only needing the skills required to ride a bike with a nailed open throttle. In the US riders have to maintain an average pace, secret checks are placed in hidden locations and any riders who have picked up too much speed and gained time will loose points if they ride into the check ahead of their scheduled arrival

Specialized purloined the name for an illustrious range of bikes and ever since opportunist event promoters have misused the name to mostly associate an event that is little more than a long distance XC race (Marathon) or a non competitive XC hack and to draw in fools to be parted from their money. I think the Original definition of enduro is ideal and anyone wanting to run anything different should call it by some other name to avoid confusing those who do know the difference, I would suspect the word Endurothon might well be unused at present.

I hope one day somebody out there will bring to mountain biking the joy of check cards, burning the check and special tests. Indeed someone may be organising something along this line very shortly and might be letting you know very soon. ;)

RKK01 sorry yes you are right you could meet a horse on a footpath but in my reply I was not referring to a chance encounter with a ridden horse tractor or mx bike on the same land that the path ran through that was there with the landowners consent. I referred to the likely hood / expectation of one walking member of the public not encountering another member of the public on horseback.

In AH Whiles case the walker has no right to point out to anyone exercising other use without rights it is a matter for the landowner, who in fact maybe, unknown to the walker, completely happy to see other users on the path although neither broadcasts the fact nor realises if they take no effort to control it a public right may possibly be created. This is fundamentally how the 20 year principle in the Highways act is triggered. I get regular complaints from walkers ringing up to complain that their walk on a footpath was ruined by the appearance of another user who should have been there. With as much tact as possible I try to explain that the decision as to applying tolerance or control over who uses land that is crossed by a public path rests with the landowner not the council or other users.

I do not condone anybody riding on what are clearly designated and intended to be only footpaths other than as an emergency exit from hostile conditions in the mountains, however we all know there are many tracks crossing the mountains that old records and physical appearance tells you it is more than a footpath, in that situation where you sincerely believe your right exists, you have a right to exercise it irrespective of what the definitive map says although you should be able to offer some proof to support your contention, the only problem is whether anyone will intervene on your behalf if that use is challenged by the landowner until the mistake is corrected on the definitive map.

People like Byways and Bridleways Trust I find is usually a far better source for highway law for higher rights users than mtb or 4×4 forums,

Nope that's not a Council Sign and if a council erected one it would be meaningless as it is for the landowner not the council (or another users) to say who cant use a right of way, to be fair track looks sunken.. field edge and fitted with gates and evidence horseriders are trying to use it…, if someone told me that was an old road I'd not be looking too shocked. If there is no stile and that gate is padlocked he's probably blocking the footpath too

Trust me I'm a Rights of Way Officer….. and have been for over 20 years…

If I was the man in the street I'd probably be happy taking up NBT's advice although it's not necessarily particularly correct advice. I would also like to commend Scaredypant's contribution.

The bottom line of what is allowed or not on a right of way is defined in the Highways Act.. it's available as is all current legislation online at http://www.uk.gov.com.uk or something like that, on that basis the only lawful way to cycle on is a Byway Open to All Traffic, or RuPP (now Restricted Byway) and public roads. Cycling was introduced on bridleways by the Countryside Act 1968 by removal of the offence they committed by doing so, prior to that all highways legislation lumped cycles in with carriages, so Cyclists could only expect to go anywhere you could go with a Pony & Trap.

The Countryside Act acted not by extending cyclists rights but simply removed the offence of taking a cycle onto a bridleway from statute, in doing so ensured no landowner or highway authority had any obligation to ensure the bridleway was fit and suitable for cycling which had a right to cycle been created would have been the case had it been amended in the Highways act definitions.

So what about walking / carrying bikes? most times I encounter this is when someone chooses to seek a defence for when being caught cycling on a path by swiftly dismounting to become a pedestrian I have no doubt the law as currently drafted and case law could create any defence.

if, however, a landowner met a walker using the path carrying goods or property that might be wheeled and even be capable of propulsion then as long as it does not touch the surface of the right of way then the landowner should have no reason to consider challenging the walkers rights.

I can't see how the law would ever be changed to restrict those cutting through from one bridleway to the other who do so carrying a bike on their shoulder or back, however it is clear that footpaths were designated to be free of cyclists and as a legal principle this is common across much of europe and america where such designation usually excludes non pedestrians with sanctionable penalties for breaches.

If riders try pushing bikes to extend their riding opportunities when caught they will also be pushing the boundary on this one and doing so I think it is more likely that the government might choose to introduce the kind of restrictive legislation needed that firmly keeps cyclists off footpaths rather than extending the designation to enable paths to be used by cyclists. There are more groups than the landowners and ramblers who would push for legal action and example being the disabled who have made strong representation on the dangers to disabled pedestrians from cyclists that has already the government listening.

Getting Apple to build the macbook of your desire with a big drive makes life easy, however hardrives are classified as a user upgradeable item and it does not void the warranty. Ever since my first mac in 1991 the world of mac users have been unified in that Apple ship macs with enough ram to run the operating system and Claris Works and for anyone want itng to do more you need at least to double the amount they give you.. shoving more of the stuff in is essential not advisable and before Billy G's boot boys turn up it's not just Apple doing this all pc manufacturers do the same or run with lots of low grade ram, lets them keep the rrp down. One of the benefits of dealing with an apple reseller rather than apple is often they give a rebate to cover the cost of the ram they take out…

I recently bought the new full throttle MBP 13 with 320gb HD as I tend to keep a mac for years and years.. something saps with windows never get to enjoy. I discovered years ago buying the fastest processor you can afford will usually get you an extra year or more of life after 5 or 6 years when new apple software is all being written for the latest models with much faster processors than you have, that said my old 2004 12"PB G4 is still going well as is this 2005 2ghz dual G5 PowerMac. Drive wise i bought a lacie rugged and note that apple techs in the geek area use them. I could not live without firewire the sd slot is very useful as I do a lot of video and photo work. Firewire drives are a whole lot more versatile then usb, I dont miss the pcmcia slot i wish the 13 was the same dimensions as my 12

no 4 is sick upwards.. really sick you will be at the top realising how you are suffering and you could have ridden down it.. er and it was better before they repaired it. Really though there is a good car park at penmachno use it these old tracks leading back to Pentrefoelas are worthless, you would not catch us locals using them when riding over to Penmachno.. oh no sirree we always use the car park

you're making it sound like some sort of niche ss event!

with in excess of 6,000 ft of climbing I would welcome any rider and encourage them to use which ever bike they feel would best get them around other than with a motor. Myself, knowing the route, I will be wanting a light hardtail with as many gears as I can get on it to pre ride the course. I would however not recommend the event if you want to ride a V10.

Once we can announce the details you can see it will not be niche but will be a very unique experience that is the culmination of 20 years understanding of running mtb events in all disciplines.

Thanks Tiger deed done much appreciated

Coming from one of those dull impoverished areas of the UK where nature contrived to convince the inhabitants to carve some of the nicest rides ever built, can I suggest trail centres were one of the best things I ever invented as it has kept so many of your badass riding techniques from tearing up our local mountain turfs ;) Trail Centre riding is as good as it gets, believe me most of you will never need to look further than the next numbered waymark post for a good days entertainment.. relax and ignore these heratics. .they are just baiting you.

blimey you stalking my posts Mr C let's just say it is the weekend after the 20th anniversary on the first MTB xc race held in North Wales at Foel Gasnach in the Clocaenog Forest.. the Mellor man helped us lap score it and Dafydd and Sian won it , Jim should have an idea and sorry to have to be so cryptic but I'll drop you a hint it's just after your own outfits annual anniversary

tiger if you still have invites to send .. acmeplc (at) hotmail d0t c()m

Tiger or anyone with invites left… curiosity is killing this cat, thanks

I've bought a few helmet cameras over the years and find ragecams on ebay to eb a very reliable supplier. They specialise in all kinds of stuff including CCTV police and surveillance cameras and offer very good packages and are very competative. I got a Contour HD with full mounts, spare battery and external charger and sd card upgrade delivered to the uk for about £180 (Auction not buy it now)

Is he the kind of guy who also has one of those hammers that can't hit nails in straight, and a saw that cuts wobbly lines… the problem might not be the tool at all… I'm sure there are many out there who would be willing to help take it off his hands and make it do what it was built for.

La Massana has 4 or 5 long xc trails and you should be able to find details on Vallnord Bike Park web site, one of them uses a lot of the Avalanche Enduro Course. You could of course cal lat the bike shop at the base of the La Massana Gondola, there is a bar there too, both the home base of one Cedric Garcia,,,,

South east of Andorra in Spain is la Molina which is a ski station that has been showered with eu grants to build a bike park….

What's up Hora, is the short winky syndrome playing up again, slip a banana down your shorts might save you a few burning a few quid trying to compensate for the inadequacy. ;)

depends how he built it I would not say it is not that light when you start at a frame. I have a Stiffee and a G Spot both of which can be relied on to do as your handlebars when it gets steep unless you are on very slow sharp corners, I would doubt the bike that lies in between them is the exception to the rule.