I did write to Gretna Services indicating it was due to the driver falling asleep and got a long winded break down of why they and others manage their car parks for 2 hours stays and that I would need to make an appeal if I wanted to go further. They did not really give a moneys and the contractor was entitled to claim its charges

Simply relying on the notion that where the legal network falls short there will be a natural levelling supplied by cheeky trails does not compute in the real world and some agreement / tolerance of landowners will be needed if legal access is not established. Like Ninfan points out it is necessary to increase and develop the population of riders which, despite some groans from those preferring the exclusivity, is necessary to show the economic value multipliers that both the Cycle trade and Tourism industry to invest in growth by creating more to consume.

its not just the timid and uncertain riders and guidebook writers who need certainty of rights I was recently approached by a small landowner in an area of exceedingly poor rights of way access who, with the down turn in faming was developing buildings for holiday lets across the land and whilst able to increase access for renters was not so keen to make the extra access public. However they were more concerned that their future clients, who would mostly be horse and cycle riders, would not end up simply tramping all over their neighbours land where there was no right or agreement for them to do so because of the ill feeling it would cause.

A nearby shooting estate have already singled out an increase in illegal riding has arisen following the development of a promoted legal MTB route through the area, short of access, as being the main reasons why they claim to be an overload of illegal riding occurring on their land. At a terse meeting with their Farming Union rep and and arsey country practise solicitor they demanded we immediately provided an armful of ‘no cycling allowed’ signs on these routes to compensate them. This request was declined as the responsibility to define the extent of access falls to the landowner in case law. That led the solicitor to remind me should his client to accidentally leave a box of tacks, open on his quad as he rode up these routes which might accidentally spill that might have the same effect just as another of his clients, faced with a similar situation, now accidentally dunks the spinning head of a hedge cutter in hawthorn, blackthorn and gorse alongside paths that suffered un-consented use by mtb riders, and which had a fairly immediate desired effect. Many Country Solicitors and their Land Agent chums even today think protection of land from the public is an over-riding priority for their profession and there are probably some here who would pat them on the backs for saying so if it keeps the hordes out but not them.

This kind of nonsense if going on all the time, The Countryside Alliance in Wales has provided a lot of lobbying not just to stop increased access but to secure more effective powers for landowners to stop unauthorised access irrespective of what benefits it may bring to wider society or local economy.

Without some legal certainty there will be significant areas of land in some areas of this country where any informal access suitable for a wide range of users has the permanence of tumbleweed other than for a handful of riders prepared to square up to a landowner when challenged

Esme.. no problem and whilst you obviously love to quote you Acts.. you might want to note the the more recent, Highways Act 1980 S329 – Further Provisions as to interpretation.
““bridleway” means a highway over which the public have the following, but no other, rights of way, that is to say, a right of way on foot and a right of way on horseback or leading a horse, with or without a right to drive animals of any description along the highway;
“
To fully understand the difference between as of right in the context of the Countryside Act 1968 and the later Highways Act 1980 I’d recommend browsing Sweet and Maxwells Highway Law by Stephen Sauvain. but fundamentally under the Countryside Act the right given ensures the pesky farmer is unable to clear you off his bridleway but for the purpose of maintenance the Highway Authority view the users with a right or expectation for maintenance of the way as being those defined in the definition in S329

Like your spell checker smartay Cant really be confident which path you were using but I know a bit about these routes. The bridleway between Moel Arthur and Pont Llundain at the base of Llangwyfan Forest, if thats what you are on about the land recently came into the control of a new tenant farmer who has indicated the need to access his land to farm it means using the bridleway which by law he is perfectly entitled to do. He initially mentioned cutting trees back which he can do and is now talking about stoning up the bridleway to be able to take his traffic without it becoming a mud bath.. something else he can not be stopped from doing. The shame of course is that instead of being an old dirt track its been for decades it will end up resembling another dull forest road something the council has been trying to avoid given the common complaints of mountain bikers at gentrification of those routes.

However as the law, which was changed in 1968, stands cyclists don’t have a right to use a bridleway they simply are not committing an offence if they do, the Councils therefore have no duty to maintain these ways to be suitable for cyclists. This means that they get no money from Government to cover the costs of maintaining routes for cyclists and with a 20% budget cut in 2015 nothing is likely to improve. Better news as far as the route from Pont Llundain to Moel y Parc – the byway skirting Pen y Cloddiau is due to have some historic drainage problems solved and some minor resurfacing with stone and ruts filling over this Spring. It may mean for a while it will look more like a stone road in places but experience shows that after a few winters and vehicles spread a bit of mud about it quickly will return to look like an old part earth road.

If you are still unhappy after reading this and live in Denbighshire feel free to write a letter of complaint to your County Councillor outlining the nuisance this causes you. I rode (or slid) around Moel Famau today and it was that icey I find it hard to believe you found any mud and quite envy you if you did. If you don’t live in Denbighshire write to the Chief Exec or the cabinet member for the environment who are the only people likely to be able to find more money for this work if they think its enough of a public issue. This goes for any Council at present as they are all looking for soft targets to cut heavily and rights of way services across England and Wales are one of the most popular target for budget cuts. There is no longer a rights of way service in Conwy for example.

er I did not read this thread I recently did similar sums working out its probably cheaper on ferries, insurance road tax and fuel and probably second hand will attract a wealthier 7 seat family car buyers than a transporter kombi. I saw a trio at Llandegla with a C10 Maxi 7 seat window van who i saw managed the bikes ok so a 140 dsg arrives on friday. As far as leather seats go I just stopped by a local motability dealer who have the exact same car on their forecourt so popped my head in out of curiosity to see it had front and middle seats in a creamy leather so the customer must have specced leather. I also bought the vw rear 3 bike rack (my golf vw 2 bike rack has been bomb proof) so either if its really muddy the bikes can stay outside on the drive home or possibly take advantage of the 140ps to lug 5 riders out on a ride

a great custom build with a lot of time and passion gone into it and will be sad to see it go but i cant warrant keeping it anymore

would infer that the bike is something a bit more than being a sales opportunity.. .there again only if you want to believe him.

I had two Coves stolen 2 years ago I look every day on eBay for them but alas no sign but as a result i get to see a lot of Coves being put up for sale .. such adverts like this stick out like sore thumbs from those that real owners post…..

nice bit of dry cynicism their Rorschach… even Northwind should know llandegla use almost the same economic model as the Forestry Commission in Wales the good old tax payer pays for it all….. if it means the government has less money to tip into propping up the moribund windfarm industry.. keep doling our money out boys….

Rorschach don’t worry it won’t be long before Trek or Specialized choose to jump onto a 29er BMX niche bandwagon

In the end the world would be so much better, BC is good at pulling in sponsorship and sports council money on back or racing excellence, no reason that should not also have some benefit on recreational and commuting cyclists , if one body spoke for all cyclists you’d suddenly discover the likes of Clarkson might well head keeping a lowered head profile than shouting of discriminatory insults at cycling

Not far from Llandegla, there is a Llandegla connection to the matter but nothing to do with anyone following the bikes home, they were not taken from Home but temporary storage whilst I try to sort out a new secure shed as no longer have room for them in the house, this spot was broken into by somebody looking for other bikes kept there.

Now got some photos to show and would be grateful if anyone here can help me locate anyone trying to dispose of these bikes. I have created a number of searches on ebay for the bike make model and key parts on the off chance anyone tries to sell it as a whole or broken bike.

If anyone else has any ideas or links where it may be worthwhile to raise riders attention to these bikes and an Orange Crush that was also stolen belonging to somebody else please feel free to drop me a hint here or give me a prod if you want to exchange anything confidentially by email. There is an outside chance if it turns out the thief was local the bike could be in the Wrexham, Deeside area

Web sites sucked for ages facebook group looks OK though

Probably not the best place to come looking for a shed load of BMX riders along the North Wales Coast

Just had reply back from my MP (D Davies, Monmouthshire) and we don’t need to worry as the Crow Act will safeguard access. (Yeah right).

And he can’t tell the ‘English’ how to vote on their woods. (This is from an opponent of devolution btw).

fantastic.. my welsh tory MP voted with the pack.. not being an english mp did not stop Danny Ginger Rodent from grabbing the chance to get his hands on Englands Purse strings all the way from up there in scottyland. Even the BHS representing all those nice tory horseriding county class folks have got the message and good old crow aint gonna let them trot neddy down a forest road if the new owner says no

But the problem MSP is that not everyone writing to the Government and MP’s are the kind of pen fodder that 38 degrees inspire. and its a generalising insult of the minister to write all the objection off as being irrational driven by media misrepresentation.

To add to the insult the Minister is now saying they are going to ignore all letters sent before the consultation opened as being responses to the proposals.

IGM it was interesting to hear in the debate Anne McIntosh did take the stand and made points against the sell off as proposed and doubts about the plan which should mean a few marginals should also be sweating a bit. Keep writing to your tory mp’s they need a big mail bag so they know we are thinking about them

Just been reading the Zappa thread and retreated here for comfort

More on lefty construction methods

pretty good picture of a flyover in Cuba over its only motorway. One day they hope to get the train onto it.

which might be about the time they are able to afford mechanical mowing of the roadside verges

Boy could Fidel do with a swift dose of Cameron and Osborne to get that country kicking

Most of the Money for Glentress will be from Economic Regeneration and European Regional Development Fund which they could not have used for anything else and had they not have spent it it might have been used to build more business parks to stand empty and a new bypass to serve them. Staf costs are an inevitable fatality caused by the Tories head count for budget cuts

It does not matter how hard line your local tory mp is, even the wettestt tory against the sell off will have a hard time voting against the bill because cameron is not going to want to loose face by being unable to call for a majority. Last nights vote on the debate proved that, however I think it’s clear some tories MPs will be working hard to get the terms of the bill made more palatable and most of those will be the marginals with large mail bags from forest supporters rather than any moral notion what they are doing is wrong.

The safe seat tories need the marginals to retain seats at the next election if they wish to stay in power and continue to cream tax payers money off to give to their private sector companies.

Itt’s equally important that Welsh and Scottish Mp’s are contacted although there will not be many Tories amongst them, theire are libdems and anyone able to bomb danny alexander the ginger rodent with mail please do. Given the unpopular state of the forest service in Northern Ireland talking to mountain bikers over there I think its unlikely any NI MP’s will bother to vote to save in England what they never had, however the loss of the FC in England will have a debilitating effect on the FC in Wales and Scotland even taking into account the tory biker chorus here.

Please do your bit….

The big Petition http://www.38degrees.org.uk/page/s/save-our-forests#petition

Email your mp http://38degrees.org.uk/page/speakout/MP-forests

Woodland trust petition http://www.woodlandtrust.org.uk/en/Pages/default.aspx

DEFRA consultation http://www.forestry.gov.uk/england-pfeconsultation

Having just read the Hansard report on the debate firstly the gov had the cheek to amend the debate and won it arguing the past performance of forest policy by labour in power was shabby. they managed to get enough mp’s to roll in at the end to ensure the tory amendment won by 40 odd but a number of tory mps were making very strong noises about significant desent against the proposed bill .. my own tory MP shabbily supported his party which I will be discussing with him face to face on the 21st.

Tory’s main defence to the criticism were that all those opposed were idiots incapable of making their own judgement having been influenced by proven labour lies such as the forests would be bulldozed to become housing estates which clearly even they knew was not possible. The could not really get to square the circle of cost, the charities cant afford them and even if they could they would be bled dry maintaining them unless the government bailed them out with big grants that somehow seems to defeat the object which is to cut the 17 million annual costs of the Forestry Commissions management fees.

Even some of the Tories recognised loosing forestry staff in rural areas would have a cataclysmic effect on rural economies and that the FC love them or loath them provide a capacity to develop esoteric controls of forests that enable others to use them for recreation or sporting events that the commercial sector has yet to deliver in any similar quantity unless very well reimbursed and only at high profile sites.

A newer notion the tories seemed to biting is the psyche of being British and how we are forest peoples in reality and our love of forests and old oaks are more continuous than our respect of the king. The state ownership of the forest since WWi has meant irrespective of its limited benefits for public access until recently that many brits walking in a state forests gains a stakeholder benefit and wants to protect the forest environment he will not get when walking as a tolerated guest of the chip board, roll off loo paper, forest company plc who will be driven by financial measures.

most interesting is the number of tory mp’s commenting on the 4 or 500 emails each is getting on the subject so get writing to yours if you have not and tell your mp you are fully satisfied with the forests the way they are run now then fill in the governments consultation

Cant fail to see the left wing in this photo but it’s the right wing getting all the attention but it’s not News International its a stringbag

Elfinsafety. .what a lovely bit of concrete box section and lovely formed curving wing walls pity its got such a piffling accommodation road constructed over the top…

There is an ibis by Euston Station that I would not decline to use again

Fantastic thread ah the Henry Royce, PSV, Russell club, and of course the Nile / Reno Clubs now replaced by the fugging letter M got some great photos of the old Belle Vue Speedway stadium in Action.

Back to the original thread wrong with Lefties nothing at all bit long in the tooth though I started with Mag 21’s and moved to a head shock that was a revelation in stability the lefty was also my first experience of disk brakes but by then ‘Dale was loosing the quality build plot I jumped ship changed bike and went back to Rockshox however I miss my old lefty. . I still get to see it though a guy in the village bought it who stil lgets good use out of it

I don’t disagree with that sentiment however I don’t see why I am restricted to riding on designated MTB trails when in forest that are suitable for safe cycling on. I quite enjoy a long winter ride linking forests mostly on forest road avoiding singletrack. I don’t see why because I do it on a MTB I have to rely on the benevolence of the Forestry Commission policy that also requires Horse Riders to pay a permit fee when walkers can wander where they choose as of right.

Of course in Scotland this issue is a waste of breath as you are on an equal legal footing with ramblers and horseriders when accessing land and if the SA decide to flog the forests that legal facility cannot be undone. In Wales we have a token gesture in Wales we can rely on till the WAG sell forests off. In England unless the Govt write the facility into legislation then the likelihood new forest owners can stop cycling on forest roads and apply a charge on any cyclist wishing to do so.

If you really think there is a point to argue against the principle of the same kind of access powers in force in Scotland should be applied to all English FC freehold estate then I think you’re either trolling or you really have little of any value to add to this debate other than bitter vitriol since you do not appear to ride in England so why should you be commenting on the actions of those who do who wish to retain that facility after the sell off has happened if it cannot be stopped

When did you last elect to choose to go for a ride in England against going for a ride north of the border?

Er shocked.. Time standing STW forum serial blogger suggests its times- MTB riders pay to ride… . blimey this forum has changed there was a time I was sure you’d be struck off. If the car park price even goes up 50p the nearby lanes and lay-bys become chocker with dudes unloading £2k trail god steeds to ride into avoid parking charges. all counter data I have seen is charges usually see a reduction at the paypoint and an increase in freeloading.

You’d be better sticking to IT skills for a living than writing business plans on setting up a trail centre

Never said that DruidH but the fact is you are in Scotland so what ever the tories do in England means you are no worse off and its clearly to Wales and Scotlands gain if access to MTB’s becomes restricted in England, When they sold off the last lot of forests the two or three hectare blocks actually had a far bigger impact to the residents of rural communities than to the expected visitors who were not affected by the sales of larger forests.

In any case the issue of selling off is not that important to the matter and you of course missed another private sector trail centre at Llandegla that has only been possible because of the government funding via the Forestry Commission without which the owners could never have had the confidence to invest their own money.

The current facts in paper in front of me is that the private forestry sector is retracting from recreation development because the real returns compared to the resources needed to maintain and manage are not as big as they anticipated, EU money is not being claimed as they will not release even small amounts of match fund as their capital is locked up ( possibly because they are planning on buying more timber forests when they come up).

Not sure if DuidH is trolling as I thought he dwells in Scotland, and Flash well based on years of abuse here, if the Tories made him redundant threw him out in the street and handed his house to Gypsies I’d be surprised if he did not turn up here standing up for them. The CLA have also come out in support of the proposals.. but only if it is managed to restrict immediate deforestation so as to not to cause a glut and de-stabilise the value of standing timber sales on their existing members woodland.

I think what Ton says is how it might well pass and other than the occasional punch up with a new landowners bailiff or game keeper riding will continue. However that’s not much good for newcomers and families looking to enter the sport if access is restricted and they don’t have the ability to uncover STW cheeky trails. The action will be disproportionate on the population of Britain and who it impacts on.

Most FC land is away from urban areas where often in rural areas no longer supported by civic facilities such as schools, sports centres and libraries This facility will then remain as they were prior to the May election in Wales and Scotland with much greater rights enshrined in Scotland If I was an English voter myself that in itself would really piss me off if I lost access to a nearby forest which if you currently enjoy Eastridge Hopton or south Shropshire is more likely to be the case. When they say existing rights will be protected they will find it almost impossible were they to close bridleways however at present cyclists use is restricted outside of dedicated to trails to a toleration of the use of forest roads. This a new owner could very easily decide not to continue and many will be very unlikely to open up access to natural land in forests and they will be probably blame 3rd party liability for why.

Just incase anyone says the bridleways are enough for anyone in case of one of the largest FC plantations in Wales it has two bridleways and one byway with a forest road network in excess of 150 miles.

All I can say is thank god Britain has no ownership interest in the Polar Icecaps, if they are so desperate for money and need sell land why doesn’t Osborne ring up his mates at Strutt and Parker and ask them to sell off Thatchers favourite Holiday Resort.. the Falklands….

Z11 despite many years experience of under whelming performance from the FC I can say I’ve also experienced negotiating with Fountains and Land agents both of whom made squeezing blood out of a stone simple in comparison. No access in English Forests is not as good as Scottish forests nor is that as good as Swedish Forests and indeed the wood itself.. not fit much for anything in particular it grows too fast and is not dense enough than american timber however I think doing even a bit to try to save something out of the charcoal of Tory Forest policy is better than watching events through a pair of binoculars the wrong way around.

Jon you may indeed describe your attire but failed to mention you had also been eating cow dung. Cheeky trails in mountain biking thrive on secrecy. If MTB was to remain a niche activity based aroudn unlawful acts of trespass it simply would attract no interest or funds for trail development. The avg man in the street tends to like nice sensible advice about where to go that does not expose him to dispute, publishers can only promote routes in guides that will not lead them to an injunction, you may thrive on it but reliance on cheeky trails is not something to be marketed or measured. You think you can trespass with impunity and well you might but who is to say the tories will not apply some tightening of the law to enable new landowners of private forest to secure their boundaries from unauthorised users which nobody can doubt will surely happen given how unpopular the whole thing is with the masses.. bit blinkered in a kind of King Canute style of philosophy. Most land is Freehold and in Wales what is Leasehold tends to have little use as they are most often retained shoots and shoot owners tend to have a bad disposition to any kind of poaching bird or trail.

You do realise that the vast majority of FC land was obtained under duress from farmers under threat of compulsory purchase? Yet more land was requisitioned to the dept of agriculture and placed under forestry?

er I think you’ll find that’s the mindset the man has given us.. originally it was all our land in a fashion, then William the Conqueror stole it off us in 1066, gave it to his mates who then proceeeded to split it up for sale. All that happened in the 20th centry was a perverse form of sequestration of public property back to the public. Just as happened to the land acquired for water collection that was then gifted back to the private sector.

The immediate threat is to English Forests, although I’m not holding my breath here in Wales. I am sure in the ministers mind it’s all a done deal she believes they can sell forests off and force big society to step in and pick up a few to stop it becoming a ‘told you so’ mess. However for every smug Tory MP in a safe seat there are a few in marginals. The sector of the population most pissed off / disadvantaged by this action will be very much the very people who voted them into power and make up the margin in a marginal seat. Even if you have a Tory MP you should not be convinced by the done deal to not write to him.Dont jsut sign the petition although please do and please pay towards the advert.. I did

There is no doubt in my mind that when most of the smaller blocks come for sale neighbouring owners or shooting syndicates will buy them up. The communities failed to find money to buy them in Majors term in office and things are tighter now few will be relishing stumping up for the on going management costs. The effect of this is riding around unfamiliar countryside will be less certain of riding into plantations, new owners will be more robust to protect their investment and this will become confusing handicapping not only cyclists and horseriders but also local tourism businesses. However, over Offa’s Dyke and Hadrian’s Wall things will be like normal, the English situation possibly giving the tourist sector an advantage at the expense of English rural areas. For example those used to riding around the shropshire hereford powys borders will have to learn to locate and adjust to the changes in England but can carry on like normal in Wales.

If there is any opportunity in the current situation, it is that it makes it time to ask the government to extend the scope of voluntarily applied open access for walkers in its plantations. It should now consider doing the same as has happened in the Scottish Forests be they private or public. That is to adopt the scottish standard for open access in all state forests to include horseriders and cyclists right of access. They cannot argue doing so will handicap sales and impose burden on management since Scottish Forests still work as well as English ones do, nor will there be compensation complications if they grant whilst they are the owner.

If they do this even if we cannot stop the sales then we know that a fundemental right remains and the lottery of picking a forest you wont be chased out of riding along a forest track is back to the pre sell of days

Chances are once Campoon opens Campoons box and out come the silenced freaks like Redwood and other trough snouters Clegg is going to look back at his wilting troops trying to work out who will be the first one of them will realise they never got involved with politics to mix with that lot at cabinet cheese and wine parties and hop it off to sit on good old middle of the road labour benches, unable to stop the rot Campoon's going to have a high noon with Cleggs dwindling band of mercenaries and before November 5th has arrived they will have lost a crucial vote and will have to hand the towel in and call a re-election, why do you think Broon looked so happy when he pushed the ejector seat button.

stayed here before no problem
http://www.criffel-inn.co.uk/%5B/url%5D

He's on in Rhyl North Wales this week

I have had a lot of dealings with the Forestry Commission in Wales and England since the beginnings at Coed y Brenin, and much else in North Wales as well as in the Shropshire Borders and those who think these guys will just draw a line on a map and it will be built are not going to find that is the case.

First thing for those who simply see money being tipped into Forestry Land to make recreation facilities on demand, you need note is the FC do not appear these days to have much capital money to develop these facilities and usually are dependant on finding partners with funds to set this stuff out. Those with funds could be the Economic Development Agencies or County Councils or for low level developments a group of users offering free labour may be sufficient.

The FC most often is able to offer the value of it's technical expertise and land to enable other groups to use that as match funding to get grants that may be available to non government projects from Europe or Westminster or even charities. The problem is these grants which were rolling around for the begging 10 years ago when you needed to build the likes of Penmachno are not so readily available without a considerable amount of work so much so the grant raising process can consume more work than the trail creation.

I would suggest as much as you talk to the FC find out if they are going to find the money or expect you to help in which case you need making early contact with the new Cheshire CC, which being split may have only half the funds it had before and the regional tourism, health, sports and economic development agencies to ask if they know of funding that may be available you could access would be a benefit. The worse danger when working in groups relying on volunteers is that you get the designs but the fund raising takes far too long and the volunteers lose focus and drift away. The language you will have to learn to use when engaged with funding culture is a whole new world of buzzspeak and cliche that can be quite distressing once you realise you have picked it up.

You will also need to be aware as alluded to here by others that building a trail in a small and busy forest surrounded by areas of significant population, there will be many other users who currently find cyclists a nuisance will when the trails are built will not think it unreasonable to put pressure on the forestry to restrict cyclists to those trails. It depends very much on the make up of the local FC staff whether they stand up or capitulate against such pressure, I have seen examples of both. You will need to establish at an early stage that your own involvement is dependant on the remaining access to a wider informal network of trails if you are not going to get drawn into being party to it's restriction at the end.

Hang on, hang on.. to those high horses..

In cross-country mountain biking, there will be a maximum of three male riders and two female riders per nation.

you clearly never read to the bottom because if you did maybe you would have seen that on the mtb ( which is of course the purpose of the forums existence) we have been given more saddle space than we currently have podium capable bums of sitting on. If cutting back the number of tack saddles causes BC to work now to get better representation across the board in other disciplines inc MTB, which for mountain biking means dropping the science lab stuff and getting some old fashion coaching schemes going and nurturing new talent to stay on mtb's rather than sucking them into the velodrome then for mountain biking then this is a great move by the UCI.

The UCI would appear to be the vassels of the IOC on formulating the cycling discipline so I doubt anything they are doing falls outside of forthcoming edicts from the IOC. I for one will conceed the UCI are likely more often than me or most riders I know to be in a better position to place the sport to gain greater exposure and increase opportunity for cyclists to excel and be giants in the world of sport.

If anyone is debating doing a full 100 miler but fancies doing it in two halves check out the event being organised by Pat Adams 21 / 22 April Hiraethog 50:50 Based at the Llyn Brenig Visitor Centre in North Wales day 1 will be a 50 mile course in Clocaenog Forest a mere 5000' of climbing a day, no early start and we reckon at a 10mph average you'll be back at the campsite for tea time, then day two you start at a not indecent hour and ride the course +- a few changes and should be back mid afternoon and if you live in the North West of the UK might well be home refreshed by late tea time.

That shot of Hughey Grant is taken on the downhill course at Moelfre… fact, infact the uplift road was partly funded by money from the film that needed to get the faux summit on the shoulder of the hill built for filming.

Mt Ventoux an Alp, Mt Tam will be in the Andes next.

love these threads that loose the plOT and fray at the edges.

So if you see a big, fat, beardy bloke going nowhere near as fast as you would expect for someone in team kit on a custom built boutique frame, that'll be me

you were quite right Graham that steady plod got you over the line last well done..

Can you repeat that for the benefit of those who were swamped out at Gorrick

You are welcome Higgo.

It was a well known in BHS circles that until the last 5 years, that if you found a stile in Snowdonia you might well be on a bridleway, the park wardens were often known to collude with farmers and place stiles on bridleways as farmers believed ramblers left gates open and in an effort to keep the farmers onside with conservation the national park facilitated the supply of stiles rather than gates.