Yeah good point – all that positive exposure has to be worth something, right?

yeh likely worth shirt buttons and we all know what they are worth.

Free pithes doesn’t surprise me. Clients know agencies want / need work so will get away with it if they can. I left agency life about 5/6 years ago i got fed up with clients, pm, account mangers and working very late for even less reward. Im a product designer these days so very UX focused so totally get when your coming from. Clients see a few screens in a powerpoint and think thats it, some don’t get the hours spent working on stuff thats ended up the bin or archive folder.

They don’t just do it to be nice to Sharon & Dave who quite fancied getting an extension done for nowt.

But the positive exposure can go a long way to balance that out… When we go to Sharon and Dave’s house and see the fancy free extension they will say bob did it for free then we phone bob for a free extension too. And thats all good because bobs also paying his bills with “positive exposure…”  SMH.

You’d be wrong. I’ve lost count of the number of freebies that my various employers have done over the years just to get a picture in the local paper.

For me the difference in this hypothetical builder putting up these hypothetical shelves is the shelves wont be used to make money. Also im assuming in the local paper it would say work done by bob the builder. And also whats the ROI on getting these hypothetical shelves in a hypothetical magazine. The logo will be used to promote the business and make said business money and unless they tell everyone who interacts with their brand who designed it you can’t compare the two. It could end up on tshirt for example which im sure would be sold…. or maybe the shop could give them away in return for “positive exposure” after all it goes a long way.

Designers working for free is a real bug of mine and its deep rooted in this industry from agencies getting interns to people wanting a free logo or website. At the end of the day if designers work for free everyone expect free work from a designer. It devalues my craft something i have spent 10+ years doing. To be honest most of the people who ask for free design work are often more hassle than they are worth (which is very little) and have a very limited understand of how long it takes to make a logo or website.

Sorry to rant it just drives me mad when people expect a designer to work for free. The question these people need to ask themselves is would they also work for free, if the answer is no don’t ask someone else to do it.

Exposure is payment, right?

haha yeh, thats exactly what i tell my bank when its time to pay the mortgage.

Following with interest to see if Joepud’s question is answered.

me too. it always amazes me when people expect designers to work for free. no one would think of getting a builder in and being like look i need a few shelves putting up but can you do it for free it will be good experience and you will get “exposure.”

Simply put if you refuse to pay someone that shows exactly how little you value their service.

im a designer, this may sound blunt but is it a paid job?

When I first got my Solairs felt exactly the same wondering if I should keep the bike or swap it for a flare max thinking had I been sold the dream of steel HT rather than actually wanting one. My problem was trying to ride it like my rocket which was a bad idea. After a few weeks I dropped the tyre pressure (A LOT) and started to pick different lines to smooth out the trail and now I love it the bonus of this was I now pick better lines on my rocket meaning I can go faster.

disproportionate cost / hassle ratio to amount of time actually spent riding is turning into a bit of a brain worm.

I hope this doesn’t come across rude but if you are finding issues / time to get out on a bike maybe you just don’t like it that much any more. Which is totally cool people change.

For me personally I love riding bikes even though it takes me over an hour to get out to Surrey on a weekend. Its my passion so I make the time for it. Granted I don’t have kids yet but a few in my group do and they still get out on a regular basis its all about what you prioritise i think. Skipping the friday night drinks so you can be up early for a ride for example. Swapping between bikes / type of riding makes it fun too. Basically not riding the smae places all the time.

To reduce faff my top tip is little gym bags with all the kit in so loading the car is just a matter of slinging it in

This is solid advice. 100% its about packing the night before. Typically on a friday evening I will pack all my kit into a bag and layout my clothes. Then all I do in the morning is eat breakfast, fill up a bladder and put it all in the car.

As for a bag I use to go the ikea route which is fine but got a fox transition duffle bag as a treat last week its its super handy. Its got a main compartment for all the big bits the smaller pockets for stuff like gloves, garmin, sunglasses and all that. Also comes with a handy changing mat so no more standing on wet floor post ride.

I would say the average bike I normally see is a 3-4k 150mm+ travel full sus on my local rides. But as a caveat majority of my cycling is in Surrey lots of Yeti and Santa Cruz bikes.

Assuming the average rider focus is E E focused – e-bike or enduro

Assuming n+1 I’m going to guess the average collection as:

Full sus geometry du jour – may or may not be E-bike

Full sus circa mid last decade

Millennium hard tail – covers Souls etc

I think this is pretty spot on. Well for me any way I see myself as your average rider and I have a full sus, ht and gravel bike / commute because london roads are awful and I actually enjoy gravel rides.

Just for balance, I live in central Bristol and house prices round here have gone mental in the last few months. If commuters are going to WFH in the country then it solves the one thing I don’t like about living in the city – traffic and air pollution.

I think this is really true and it seems the same where I live. Prices in London don’t seem to be going down talking to friends who are currently looking.

I think what Nikc said is 100% true. People are looking at this summer thinking yep rural Surrey or North Wales looks nice with those beaches. Talk to me in the winter when its freezing cold pitch black by 3 and you got no where to go (i spent my teens / early 20s living in wales). Major cities will still be major cities with loads of stuff to see, eat and do. Personally despite no office until 2021 and likely a wfh option for as many days as I wont I wont be leaving London I like what it offers the culinary diversity, sights and a decent(ish) transport infrastructure. I don’t want to go back to the days of standing on a rural train platform or bus stop wondering is the things gonna turn up.

I have last years winter fox trousers in fact i have 2 pairs because they are so good. A little short in the leg if you’re plus 6ft, but all winter they kept me perfectly warm and dry. Realistically very little will keep you 100% dry if you’re out on the hill for a few hours in the winter. The biggest plus for me is post ride just pull them off and your are clean no more moving mud about with a towel or sitting on a towel for the drive home

I found my house insurance people wouldn’t cover my bike due to its value. Personally when it comes to bike insurance I feel like Laka is the only option. https://laka.co/gb

E: pastrami, sun-dried tomatoes and swiss cheese. (because i love a fancy deli on a friday)

D: Dark Arts filter coffee

L: P Money – while you wait ep

in pretty much the same situation as you. Work offer it via our private healthcare. The way i see it my health care provider have likely brought X jabs for Y people and if less people take the jab i can’t see them giving it back to the nhs unless its mandated by the gov. Basically you taking the jab wont be taking it from anyone that really needs it… i think.

thats good to know. i try and limit my facebook usage (its a time suck for me)  but i will check it out. cheers for the heads up.

For people saying DiCaprio yes hes become an outstanding actor but for me Titanic and man in the iron mas were truly awful. As already said its best to look at whos done the least worst movies.

DezB:

It was more about the “being ashamed” bit as far as I recall when I posted it. Don’t care enough to read back, I’m afraid.

I fail to see how recent comments about inclusivity from here and the wider bike community cannot make you feel ashamed. Just read peoples comments about DK stopping production of the general lee frame, recent Wideopen article about our sport being inclusive or even the flack Cotic got for a post Cy made… Hell even go back a few weeks when Singletrack made their stance public. I don’t want people with those view in a sport I love so much. For me its like accepting racist people in football. These views are not acceptable… but then again maybe im just “thick.”

DEzB:
**** hell, people think I actually meant “take up golf”. Can’t be that thick surely?

As the person both your golf comment and the “can’t be that thick” one was aimed at… well it seems like i took what you said literally I mean how else can I take 3 or 4 words with no further justification? Am I thick or did you say something ill timed and poorly thought out? I simply said some of the views here (and within wider biking recently) make me ashamed to be associated with riding bikes, your response was well go do something else. I made a comment about being inclusive and you took that as an opportunity to be uninclusive.

If were we talking face to face I would expect an apology after those comments.

Take up golf?

Yeh because that’s the answer rather than challenge people whos views are just wrong for 2020.

joepud what you on about?

Well I don’t know if the op was a joke but some of the views here haven’t exactly (in my opinion anyway) been the most inclusive. And the trans post which got closed was hardly a glowing reference for how inclusive mountain bikers are. On a phone with a broken hand can’t be bothered to track through this lot. But just my opinion.

One thing which I think needs pointing out is a few weeks ago some bike brands took a rightful stand against racism and social justice and most recently wideopen magazine. What it lead to was a bunch of morons claiming this was a welcoming sport and no one is racist and it’s all rosy – the last few posts on this site clearly say the opposite. It makes me ashamed to think there are people with views like this in something I love so much

I seem to recall the OP is a LibDem, certainly very pro EU.

Just because you’re lib dem, pro eu and maybe left leaning doesn’t mean you cant / don’t have prejudices. which imo seem to be on display here.

My point is that religious people of whatever flavour choose the bits they like and are total hypocrites about the rest.

i mean its almost like people have choice when it comes to how they want to follow their religious beliefs. Its like saying you can never have one drink you gotta get blind drunk all the time. Do yourself a favour and take this up with your edl mates im sure they care a lot.

wow, 2020 and people still think like this.

Are those areas where you will be spending several hours in close proximity to these third parties and breathing recycled air?

Dunno about you but even in the Buttfuck Nowhere that I live I can fill my tank without setting foot in a shop and even if I did I don’t have to deal with Bazza and the boys on tour getting pissed up and making a nuisance of themselves up and down the aisle.

I don’t know how many times I have said this but here goes.

1. Im not saying everything has the same risk some stuff has higher risk than others.

2. You are still coming into contact with people so there is A RISK. (basically a risk every time you leave the house)

3. Suggesting someone is negligent or selfish for going on holiday is wrong. People could pass the same judgment onto someone who spends a weekend racing / riding around trails risking injury and impacting the NHS.

4. You can’t begrudge someone for doing something they are allowed to do if you’re doing the same. (i.e them going on holiday you travelling to ride a bike)

I just don’t understand why people cant reflect on their own actions and realise how others could also view them as negligent… but hey that requires people to also take some blame and realise they could be asymptomatic infecting everyone they meet.

But you seem to have equated all risk as equal and that cutting out the highest risk activities means cutting out all activities to try and add weight to your arguement

<span style=”font-size: 0.8rem;”>I don’t think I have said that. There is risk in everything its up to people to decide for themselves and do what they think not for others to pass judgement. Is that hard to understand.</span>

What I have said countless times is others will value some activities more than others (like going on holiday) and assume some stuff is more risky than others (like going as fast as you can over jumps down a hill). My partner thinks it’s more dangerous for me to cycle to work than get on a plane… I disagree. Only difference between me and others here is I’m not saying she’s selfish or negligent. Btw she works for the NHS so I’m pretty sure she deserves a relaxing holiday on a beach wouldn’t you agree?

Why don’t we start with Johnson and work our way down.

Agree. He leads the party his gov’ are dealing with the pandemic just like losing is the managers fault in football this is all Johnson’s fault.

Non essential is non essential – how are we choosing which non essential things we do?

100% agree with this. If a holiday is non essential so is riding a bike from anywhere other than your house if we are totally being black and white about it.

Biking in open air, low risk.
Sitting in a plane breathing recycled air, high risk.

Some people will travel by car to a location to ride that means coming into contact with other people, shops, petrol station and so on. biking maybe low risk but the bits before not.

It seems to me like they are changing goal posts Willey niley and it’s those that follow the guidance that it’s ok to go because gov said so …..that are being made to pay.

Can’t blame them not everyone has the ability to see a bigger picture.

While I do agree with this in some sense, i do think there comes a point when we have to get busy living rather than busy dying. We can’t just sit inside for the next 12/18 months in the hope a vaccine solves all our problem by then the damage to the economy would likely terminal everyone would be on food stamps and not a single shop would survive. Its about a balance and thats what we are in now.

IF the decision was lets shut everything and sit inside essential the gov’ need to go fully socialist support those who can’t support themselves (which would basically be everyone by the end of it and likely set up universal basic income) as without people out and about spending unemployment will rocket even more. Its such tough balance keep people a live vs keep the country ticking over so the recession doesn’t get even worse… best it yet to come to a double covid / brexit recession.

I think we are in tough and stressful time and its causing people to react to stuff they wouldn’t normally react to. To say people are stupid, selfish or negligent because they want a holiday is a massive over reaction. And like i have said countless partaking in a dangerous sport such as mountain biking could also be seen as selfish or negligent, but you know people don’t want to look at their own actions.

Careful Chrismac, with comments like that you risk being called negligent and selfish. There are groups of people who seem to expect us to just sit at home with the lights off until this thing blows over totally ironing the mental health implications that will have.

The bit I really struggle with is that healthcare workers are exempt from doing quarantine! I even have a letter informing me that I am exempt.

I really thought this was over now? Partner works for the NHS too and was told if she goes on holiday she would still have to isolate.

Yes I’m already doing all that. So what you’re saying is that some people are better citizens/less selfish than others? I agree.

To be honest i didn’t expect a different response thats easy to say over the internet. But, its not about being selfish its about doing what you think is best and not passing judgement on others.

Getting on a plane and breathing the same air as another 100-300 people for several hours isn’t grey at all, its a high risk environment.

Going for a ride on your own in the countryside isn’t grey either, its a very low risk environment.

I really don’t see how you can equate the two.

two words. Up. Lift. Many are not riding on their own, myself included.

Im not equating the two as the same at all. Everything has higher risk than others thats all im saying. As i sit here with a broken hand after a weekend out on bikes potentially riding bikes wasn’t the wisest decision i could make during a pandemic.

Im simply saying you and anyone else may be partaking in activities that others deem negligent and its not for you to pass judgment on what others do. Is riding a bike in a pandemic doing a dangerous sport negligent? Try looking at it that way.

Can you really not see that being outside in the fresh air where it’s easy to social distance is completely different to sitting on a plane with air con circulating round?

But thats not my point. For some people travel is their thing much like riding a bike for the majority here. You can’t bemoan people for going on holiday when they could likely do the same for something you yourself are doing. Is going on holiday essential no, is travelling to ride a mountain bike essential no… you can just ride a bike from your front door.

The risks maybe less (outdoors and such) but the risk is still there (stopping for petrol, touching the parking meter, visiting the trail shop) and if zero covid is the plan and we all must bee good citizens all we should be doing is going to the shops for food as little as possible and exercising as little as possible from home. There is a lot of grey area and everyones is different.

Only if you share transport with a couple of hundred other people on the way there

No, but you’re still doing something that isnt essential and you will be with a few hundred people when you get there none from your own house hold. i feel like you missed my point but oh well. have a nice day.

Correct, we do have to live with it. But that phrase inherently means making compromises, not expecting to continue as normal. Otherwise you’d just be “living”, no? I expect the government, who after all have the best data on the highest risks, to choose actions designed to minimise these risks. Sadly, it’s clear they have failed repeatedly and thus I trust myself to mitigate the risks to me and my family.
Look at Australia and the actions they’ve taken in the past few months. Aren’t you envious of that?

For some a compromise will be not riding a bike with friends or travelling X distance for a bike ride. Its all relative some people live for a holiday others live to ride their bike. Its easy to point fingers but, we need to reflect on our own actions and maybe wonder how those would be viewed by others before pointing fingers. Whats it they say about pointing the finger 3 point back at you.

No, he’s suggesting travelling abroad on holiday increases the risk of the infection spreading.

The same could be said to those travelling to a local trail centre or going to wales for a weekend of riding. People need to relax and realise everyone is different and will do and want to do different stuff.

Seeing the infection rates rise across Europe and just about all of these rising figures being blamed on holiday makers.

Are theses holiday makers not massively negligent and incredibly selfish?

Why do they need to jaunt across Europe for their two weeks on the beach?

Pisses me off….

To the OP, what do you suggest we all just sit inside until there is a vaccine? The reality is this virus isn’t going anywhere anytime soon and we have to live with it. For reference 2 weeks ago they think they finally got rid of polio. Its scary and stressful and making people act irrationally. People could also point the finger at yourself and say going for bike rides either in a group or solo is selfish. You don’t “need” to do it just like people don’t “need” to go on holiday.

I have a box one derailleur and shifter on my big bike (11sp) and to be honest haven’t notice any difference from the slx I got on my other bike. As Stayhigh said zero complaints it works the bike changes gear when i want can you ask for more. Only plus is its nice to run something different. Would i get another one yep 100% but likely would go 12sp just to try the trp thing next.

Getting the wheel out can be a bit of a pain at first (on a cotic rocket) as it doesn’t have the same system as shimano but to be honest now im used to it its fine, i never the derailleur off to get the back wheel off.

Time to abolish bank holidays?

you can have your bank holiday just don’t even think about the street you live on for fear going into someone elses area.

If you’re fed up living in London then don’t.

granted the attitude of I pay more to live in london doesn’t hold up (i also live in london) but the whole dont live there then also goes for people who live in tourist traps, if you dont like tourist go live in a place that doesn’t get any. Tourist annoy me on a weekend sometimes too standing on the escalators, walking super slow but thats london we need them to support a lot of the shops and services.

People moaning about “their areas” being busy need to just reflect on how other parts of the world are also impacted by this year on year. People are also extra stressed due to general life and covid so maybe people leaving “their area” to visit yours is a much needed break for them. I left london a few weeks ago to see some family in Swanage and it was the first time i went outside of the m25 in about 4+ months. Should I have stayed at home just because it was going to be busy?? How do you decide who can and cannot come and go.

Team sport fandom is pretty much founded on the notion that what you support is so much better than everything else

Is this not the same for all sports? Its like arguing whos better Vouilloz or Minnaar. Discussing the intricacies is something I personally enjoy trying to understand why a player made a the right or wrong decision or what lines riders are taking at a race weekend. But, just for the record Boston Celtics are the best basketball team ever the banners prove it.

On the flip side. For those moaning about their local areas being rammed the past few weeks im assuming you never go on holiday or visit somewhere else where you could be causing the exact same problem for local residents? Also, what about someone like myself who lives in London and contends with tourist all year? Its all swings and roundabouts

I think for most blokes its just a go to for conversation who do you support and so on. For years it sorta been drummed into guys to like football. Perfect example a bloke came to install our broadband / tv yesterday after he was done he tried to up sell me on skysports so I could watch the football, he was left dissipated when I said all I cared about was basketball and cycling.

Baffled by its popularity but probably down to the fact that it’s a simple game for the masses of simple people

This is more your ignorance and lack of understanding of the game by claiming its for “simple people.” Also, to be totally honest makes you sound rather rude and extremely condescending. All sport is simple until you understand it all Gwin does is ride a bike down a hill nothing complicated, all Ronaldo does it put a ball in a goal. I could tell you how complex basketball is and talk about point forwards, match ups, 2/3 zones v man to man, but you main claim im overcomplicating a simple game.