22kW isn’t a fast charger

According to how these things are classified (as opposed to the ordinary language meaning, which moves with the times) 22kW is “fast”, anything above that being “rapid” or “ultra rapid”.

The period after the vote but before the s. 51 letter was the one time UK had the advantage.  It should have been exploited.

Indeed, but possibly a modest open protocol for establishing a secure link over the wire and  another one for agreeing on a charging plan, which would require some exchange of data.  There isn’t a lot of stuff that needs to be shared, I would have thought there would have been some arm twisting from governments to get industry bodies to work this out.

AFAIK no charger supports this.

Yes it is not a direct conversation (which surprises me a little).  The car talks to its server and the charger (or perhaps the charger manufacturer’s server) talks to the car manufacturer’s server (presumably via a published API).  A bit like the way your Garmin talks to your computer via Strava.

[By Google Drive I guess you mean Android Auto – GD is their cloud storage]

Ooops yes.  Same combination of meanings,, somewhat different different things!

Well our EV experience has now started in full.  Not only did we finally get our Ohme Home Pro installed, but we also got Renault (not so) Easy Link connected services re-connected.

Our car is an early 2021 Zoe, so its 3 years’ free connected services expired. Not the data connection, that was still there, but the services from Renault.  The My Renault app and web page indicate that these can be renewed, but they can’t.  So I rang up the Renault UK helpline suggested by the app and they took some details and said they would get back to me.  A week later I was surprised to get an emaiil from someone called Paula at the multimedia services team saying that as the online store for services renewals was not up and running yet, they would set us up with 6 months’ free in-car connectivity stuff and 12 months free map updates.  Which have now all come through (though I had to re-install the My Renault app to see that).  As luck would have it, that was just in time to enable our shiny new Ohme to speak to the car. So we can tell the Ohme to “get the car charged to 80% by 9am tomorrow”, also tell the car to get warmed up for us (via the Renault App).  As far as I can see, without the Renault connectivity, we would only have been able to tell the Ohme (or the car) to charge for a certain period overnight.  But maybe we could have asked Ohme to deliver a certain amount of juice, not sure.

Interestingly, this issue with Renault and services renewals has been around for at least a year according to some posts on ev forums, I have no idea whether they actually intend to do anything about it, or what makes it difficult.  Perhpas it is just a demand/pricing issue.  As far as I can see the advantages are:

– monitor charge status from app;

– link car to ohme for more detailed programming of charges (eg by % fullness);

– tell car to warm up via app (I think car may need to be plugged in to do this, or to do it much?);

– update maps automatically (we could have updated them manually via a phone and a usb stick it is claimed).

Since they are free it is nice to have this stuff.  But not a deal-breaker, and as pointed out on the “what SIM for a car” thread, Google Drive and plugging your phone in* will get you up to date mapping, and arguably a better mapping app, though the native mapping on the Zoe appears OK (I think it is Tom Tom).  It also suits Mrs g who likes to leave her phone in her handbag.  How much we would have been willing to pay as a monthly/yearly subscription to it is moot for the time being.

The faff *appears* to be finally over!

*Our car does not support doing all the Google Drive stuff wirelessly, though more modern ones do apparently.

Ah, I remember taking them home,  carefully removing the skin and filling with plastic padding…

Now of course I would choose something less hard, perhaps pyurethane or a hard silicone, maybe with some fibres in it.  Bit the problem of hiding the join would remain

@wbo – it is you who have raised the issue of off-ripping and “hiking” in this discussion.  Observing that prices vary does not imply that.  I think that on the electric car charging thread the question of why rapid charging costs more was discussed and I don’t recall cries of “rip-off!”.

But, if long slow charging is convenient and does not cost your time (because you are asleep, working etc.) then why pay more?  Or to put it another way, why waste money on a product that is overkill for your requirements at a particular time?

That is fine in principle, but atm rapid charging is more expensive than normal charging.  Do lamppost chargers require much new wire to be laid?  Also, we are currently (sic) advised that slow charge rates are better for our batteries, so using high currents for each charge should be avoided.

Eta also more no lamp lampposts aka slow charging posts could be installed if there was demand.  Of course there may be implications for the capacity of the supply in the road, but similar issues might arise for a battery of rapid chargers.

250kW DC now were talkin ! and I think they’re the future rather than 3.5-7kW from a lampost

Two different customers surely.  The lampposts are for local residents who park on the street overnight, the fast chargers are for folk on long journeys who are don’t have enough juice to make it back to their home charger/lamppost.

I was very honest with the online questions for our beaten up but perfectly running 17 yr old 120k miles Fabia (full service history).  Got offered very little more than scrap/trade-in value.  So I sold it to a friend of a friend for a bit more.  They pestered me with emails claiming to offer more, though I didn’t read them.

So maybe not good for bangers, and try playing hard to get with them.

The common cormorant (or shag)
Lays eggs inside a paper bag,
You follow the idea, no doubt?
It’s to keep the lightning out.

But what these unobservant birds
Have never thought of, is that herds
Of wandering bears might come with buns
And steal the bags to hold the crumbs.

I only just discovered that this is by Christopher Isherwood

It also contains the gear shift linkage, which is part of the transmission I guess.  On some fwd designs it held the gearbox.  The front end of it anyway.

The naming thing is historic, stuff originally collected by Customs and Excise is often called duty.  But Customs and Excise got rolled into Inland Revenue to form Revenue and Customs.  This may have been to do with Customs and Excise being shambolic and naughty.

More use specific taxes tend to be branded duty eg booze tax, airport tax, insurance premium tax, arse scratching stick tax and so on.  None of them are hypothecated,  that is the money is earmarked for a specific use, so tax is an appropriate way to describe them whatever the branding.

Of course the specific taxes can be adjusted to achieve specific social objectives more easily than the more general ones, for example public health  the environment etc, with a dose of wealth redistribution thrown in if you wish.

If it looks like a tax and quacks like a tax…

Well I am 65 and running would definitely do my left knee in.

High intensity bike stuff is easier done on a turbo trainer.  It doesn’t have to last very long, then you can keep the real life cycling for steadier efforts.  If you can call getting up any decent hill at 65 as “steady”.

There are times when you want a bit of stiction between pan and food to get the bits to turn over when you shake it.

Well we went on our first longer journey in the Zoe yesterday, Cardiff to the Botanical Gardens (near Carmarthen) and back.  Home charger is still to be installed, though we now have a date next week, so we topped up to 80% at Cardiff Gate, from about 40%, took about the time to have a leisurely coffee.  Was down to 18% when we got home.  All very uneventful really.

Might I suggest a spot of Gershwin?  For some reason I have always associated him with weekend mornings.

What I am doing now, relaxing in bed with a cup of tea and a cat on my lap.

That is impressive @uponthedowns!

Judging by what the electricians who came to give us quotes said, if there is a spare space in the fuse box for it, it will be wired from there.  It needs it’s own dedicated fused supply.

Your blinded test will come nowhere near the standards of a clinical, or even psychology, study but it might be enough to persuade you either way.

Surely it doesn’t need to as the only relevant effect is that on a particular person?

It’s not either/or tj.  I agree that for city dwellers without off street parking, owning a vehicle of any description is an expensive hassle.  I would like to buy my daughter a car if it was remotely practical, but it isn’t.  But for us, it works.

@Kryton57 this sounds like a job for a local electrician who can visit and discuss options with you.  Underground, overground wombling free.

First ev driving experiences are very positive here (2021 Zoe, third week of driving it but only local so far).  Went to visit a mate last night and pootling around looking for a parking space was so restful.  Also the almost instant de-misting was great as Cardiff suffered biblical rainstorms last night.  This included some monster puddles.  I took these carefully, but only when I got home did it it occur to me that all those 600v electrics would have got a bit damp.

And sticking to 20mph is deffo easier even without using the speed limiter.  Still to do a long trip requiring a re- charge, but we have got some local slow chargers to work.

Also it must be said that modern car bells and whistles (rear camera, phone connection etc) are nice.  This car replaced a 2007 Fabia, and our other car has a cassette player…

I had two historical quotes through Octopus and in July they decided they were going to take the payment for both via Direct Debit – about £2000. It took over a week of daily phone calls before they acknowledged an error. No apology for the bother.

Yes I think I recall you posting about that, it sucks goats.  We went through Ohme (I think that is what Octopus do) and it never got to the stage of giving the custom quote electrician that they use payment details as although they contacted us to say hello, a quote never arrived.  I think the photographs and video of the house may have scared them off, the quote we accepted from a local electrician is substantial, but involves a lot of work. And he has now got in touch to arrange a time for doing it.  But we are off on holiday in a week, so it will be a while I suspect. But then, we won’t be using the car much.

It has been a bit of a faff to be honest, and not over yet.

Well we got a quote for installing an Ohme and accepted it, but the electrician has not got back to us for a week.   We did go through the Ohme process of getting a custom quote, but never got one.  Probably too custom a job.

Meanwhile we are enjoying using our new ev but need to find a public charger nearby that works.

It is not particularly easy to get people to do stuff it seems.

Knees are bastards.  Best possible evidence against intelligent design.

It would have been in black and white on a tv between 50 and 55 years ago.  I remember quite liking British noir (if that was a thing), the Len Deighton/ Michael Caine stuff, various TV series eg Callan, Budgie and stuff I can’t remember the name of now.

Still haven’t seen Bambi.  I don’t recall ever being taken to the cinema to see a non grown up film, which looking back on it is a bit odd.

But isn’t it a problem that our basic conception of mathematics doesn’t do what reality does?

I wouldn’t call the Lorenz Attractor our basic conception.  Some bits of maths appear to reflect reality as well as we can measure it, other bits of maths don’t appear to have much to do with the reality we can measure.

But that is to ignore the thorny problem of whether maths is, at a fundamental level, part of reality that we uncover, or whether it is something we make up. That is a mangled explanation, but it is a question that philosophers and theoretical physicists have lively debates about.

I once got told off by the Rangers for boomeranging on Hampstead Heath.  Quite fun to make , I think there was an article about how they worked in New Scientist and you could send off for plans (pre Internet days).

Top Cat and Clangers.

Reduced sugar and salt ones if possible, lightly fry a clove of garlic and some chilli flakes, add beans and a splash of red wine, simmer to let the alcohol evaporate, consume with a jacket potato and cheese.  I don’t eat beans with anything else, unless they are home made beans which are a different thing entirely.

I bought the one about that cheating cyclist although I’ve never been interested in road cycling.

Clearly, there are several ones about several cheating cyclists.

Easier to pick blackberries whilst walking

Interesting @flaperon.  I should have said 40m or so total wiring distance, if that makes a diff.  He’s had a look inside the meter cupboard so I guess he is happy we don’t have an isolator switch.

Thanks for the replies @andy4d, @julians and @molgrips.

As it is clearly a non-standard installation (by about 20m and a few walls etc.) I went direct to an electrician for a quote, so he has budgeted for the extra cabling he thinks he needs, but he clearly doesn’t think he needs the load monitoring, I was wondering what was going on with that (I have also asked him).  I can’t remember where I read about needing the CT clamp, what I now get is that you can proceed without one if you disable the “load monitoring” option during set-up. I can’t see how we would reach 100 amps anyhow, we don’t have a hot tub, power shower, electric heating etc.

I have got a quote for an electircian to install an Ohme Home Pro (it will be outside Ohme’s limits for their online quote and I am not sure our meter is smart enough for them) and the quote is “not including load monitoring cable”.  From what I can glean from the Ohme site, a load monitoring cable would be a good thing and is necessary for charging at the full 7kW.  Why would the quote not include this?

Update on my post above.  Having emailed Octopus about our intermittently smart electricity meter we got a somewhat equivocal reply.  The tl;dr version is you have to join Octopus before we can say for sure, but we need 48 readings every 24 hours to put you on a smart ev tariff.  Our email to them said that would be true most of the time but not all the time.  We are none the wiser really.

Well bemoaning the unavailability of fair trade cocaine is peak something or other.