I’ve got a Manhatten T3-R 1TB but I see that they’ve replaced it with the T4-R which is suppossedly a bit snappier and is smaller.

My T3-R has had extremely little use, and none now as I’ve got Freesat, so if you are after a second hand one PM me, as this thread has reminded me that I should probably ebay it.

But as it is for your mum I would buy a new one, they are only £170, and then you are less likely to get complaints about sluggish interfaces (probably) and can offload support issues to Manhattan.

My Heals sofa broke so I fixed it. I got it from the Heals outlet some years ago for half price (£2k instead of £4k) so it wasn’t covered by a lifetime warranty.

The new webbing wasn’t as substantial so I used more span and lots of staples:

I also had to add an extra layer of dense foam as the webbing is now attached on the opposite side of the cross beam than it was.

May or may not be slightly firmer now, I am not sure.

Don’t think Heals stuff is as well made as it was – wasn’t very impressed on examination. The cross beam had split because of a badly placed nail shot into the side of it during assembly.

I’m pretty sure the LS3/5a was designed as a speech monitor

you would be wrong then !

It was designed as a miniature two-way loudspeaker of adequate sound quality and loudness to serve as a monitor in conditions where larger existing designs would be unusable, where space was at a premum and where headphones would not be considered satisfactory, like TV production-control rooms as well as OB vans.

If you total up the expenditure on this design, and the acoustic scaling modelling work that it was based on, it’s very probable that there hasn’t been another speaker since that has cost so much!

It says ‘adequate sound quality’ but the original prototype versions built at Kingswood Warren were slightly different and achieved higher performance, using thinner walled cabinets with screwed on backs, more like other BBC monitors, where the cabinet was supposssed to be ‘lossy’ to help control resonances. They also had higher quality crossovers with careful component matching.

The versions I use are more akin to these, with modern drivers that are much more performant, and with much higher quality crossovers that achieve significantly lower THD levels, so whereas the LS3/5a was a grade 2 monitor, mine are more akin to a grade 1, especially with the AB-2 bass extenders.

There’s your issue, the LS3/5a was designed to a standard for on-site broadcasting vans, not home listening.

Yeah, I know all about the history and what it was designed for – near field monitoring in compromised environments, which is typical of most UK living rooms, and also Asian rooms which is one of the reasons why they are so popular out there.

Not sure why you linked to an unlicensed clone version with compromised performance – there’s another review recently showing much worse results from an old 15ohm Rogers version.

I use a modern, and licensed, version from Stirling Broadcast (so called V3), with their AB-2 bass extenders, so although the sound signature is basically the same plus bass, the speaker system is significantly better, certainly significantly better than any old 15ohm versions which will have drifted out of spec by now, mostly in the midrange (which makes them even more desirable for the Asian market…).

The results were absolutely clear: different wires produced different sound on otherwise the same kit. But they were unable to agree on which was “best”… apparently a sizable number liked the cheapest wires best!

I think solid state amps are more susceptible to influence from speaker cable ‘topology’. Tube amps (and I thin Quad 303s/maybe 520s) use output transformers and aren’t susceptible to speaker cables, I think.

I would be -astonished- if you could tell the difference reliably in a double-blind test, unless the 79 was wired out of phase.

I don’t really care – as I would like to be a cable sceptic and was dismayed that cables made a difference, I didn’t go and buy some expensive cable expecting it to make a diffference, I expected it to make no difference and when it did spent ages switching back and forth trying to convince myself that there was no difference, or the difference was volumne related, etc.

With the Quad 707 and external crossover difference, the sound was very phasey, which wasn’t anything to do with incorrect connections. Switch from the 4mm stranded (Quad branded) cable to something thinner (1.5mm stranded Kef branded to start with, but later 2.5mm Van Damme) and the sound was fine. Later tried with 4mm stranded Van Damme (which is PMC recommended I believe) and it went all phasey again.

I haven’t tried to see if my 909 monos and QMPs are affected in the same way as I can’t be arsed, the 2.5mm cables work well enough for me.

I wouldn’t, under any circumstances, argue the toss with the Quad crew! If anyone is going to know what cable works with high-end kit, they will.

I don’t get that, as Quad gear is mid-range stuff in the hifi sphere of pricing, and people that buy it are generally not the audiophile cable/tube rolling types of people.

I once read about Quad demoing their latest electrostatics to the audiophile world at some audio show, the journo noticed the speaker cables were bright orange and asked the engineer what they were, he replied that it was cable off a flymo, he said it was just really good thick gauge copper cable and was as good as anything else you could use.

yeah, the problem with that is that I’ve had some Quad amps that have dramatically changed their performance because of speaker cable – not just subtle audiophile ‘tweak’ level change.

First was a Quad 306, into Rogers LS3/5a speakers. Initially I just wired it up with the standard 79 strand because I am a cable sceptic, but my mate had some thick Cable Talk stuff which I tried and the sound became much more solid and extended.
So I bought some Quad cable that was of similar type (4mm stranded), but cheaper as I am a cable sceptic…, and got the same result.

Then when I added some AB-1 subwoofers, which go inline with the LS3/5a, the sound became muffled, and I ended up using some Nodost Flatline that set it back to normal.

I then had some similar shenanigans with a Quad 707, buy this time with some external crossovers.

So I think it was down to impedance loads seen by the amp.

I know the guy who used to run Spendor and he said that they used to have problems with Quad 405s becoming unstable into certain speaker loads.

So Quad amps aren’t perfect and they are affected by speaker cables and that story might be true but it is BS, although with the speakers they used maybe their amps were always OK.

I now use some 2.5mm stranded Van Damme cable as this is fairly cheap (£8.60 p/m now it seems) and seem to always give good results : https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00URNW50S/?th=1

I did once mess around with different types of mains cable (solid, etc, twisted) but it never seemed to even work decently compared to what I had.

I’ve had loads of problems with my arm – I think it may actually stem from a problem in my neck.

Don’t go to the NHS, you might end up with someone trying to inject you with stuff that doesn’t work and might cause other issues, or, unless you are lucky, a mediocre physio.

Probably the most effective for me was a well reviewed massage therapist locally who probed around and found several sore ‘trigger’ points in other areas, which when released stopped or releved the issue. For instance one was in the pectoralis minor from an old injury where a pizza delivery guy sent me flying off the bike.

So have a probe around and look for any sore muscle points in other areas.

She also used a Guasha tool durng the massage which was very effective, like on this video :

There are also videos on YT where people use spoons or knives to do the same thing, as in this video from a (US) Chiropractor, but he has some excellent self-help videos in many areas

I’ve also used percussion massage (with a conical tool attached to a jgsaw) at an angle in order to increase blood flow in an area and also cause some bruising.

With the tool or the percussion massage wait for a day or so for the bruising to subside and then do some exercises, and then repeat the process.

Lots of people report good results at killing off RSI effects using rice buckets, although I’ve not found it helped me that much.

Just resting doesn’t do much to rehab the muscle if it is in a bad state…

I actually enjoy cerys’s show, and I’ve been a fan of Giles since 2003.

latecomer – 1987 for me – he was still on Radio London then I seem to remember.

https://youtu.be/YJRUW0azIqk?si=KvMY5Ephhq14e0s8

He didn’t think a lot of it for measurements like heart rate, oxygen saturation or sleep tracking – worrying that it was so different than the Fenix. Good for user interface, mapping and gps tracking.

An spdif cable transfers a digital signal so its impossible to make a difference

I think there are ways to screw it up, if the plugs used on a cable (not optical) are RCA and not BNC then there can be problems as not many RCA plugs are not the required 75 ohm impedance, something to do with the geometry of the plug I think, and then there can be unwanted reflections caused that mess with the signal. It’s not just 0 and 1s simple.

But you still don’t need that expense on cables, mine weren’t bargain store cheap but have plugs at the correct impedance.

No way would I pay the £7k they’re asking for nowadays right enough.[/quoyte]

And that one has a movement that hasn’t been through the Nasa test cycle (twice) but they still call it the Moonwatch…

I got the Speedmaster because I saw lots of forum types calling it there One Watch Nirvana, so the theory was that I wouldn’t hanker for more watches after that – and it worked.

Although originally I wanted the Heuer Carrera reissue, which used the same Lemania movement – probably would have kept that as it’s smaller and also a reissue of a 1964 watch, which was my birth year. Wife reckoned it was too small though, and I was tired from workng overnight…

And if I had actually paid more for it than a normal V6 – a Wahoo Kickr Move.

The back and forth motions isn’t particularly realistic – maybe a more damped version would have been to simulate an acceleration ‘kick’ back when you put the power down but not the slide back forward again.

But if you use the Move with the Climb, and the boot you have to buy for it, then out of saddle cycling, such as when doing one of the Climb Portal routes in Zwift, results in the Climb ‘walking’, via the see-sawing action, over to one side of the bike and then the bike leans to one side.

So then you end up locking out the Moves front/back motion, which would almost negate the extra £400 you would have paid for it, over the price of a V6. I say almost as the slight side to side motion that occurs in the Move mechanism is still worth it for comfort purposes. Luckily I only paid a good V6 price.

I see several places have the Move on sale, although not as cheap as I paid.

I am about to put my Move/Climb on a plywood base so I can level it on the carpet where I want to place it. I think I will experiment with adding guides for the Climbs motion so it doesn’t wander to the side, and something so I can use rubber/sorbothane buffers to restrict the front/back motion in a controlled manner.

Luxury watches – not accurate, they are just either status pieces or placating someones (normally a man) magpie-like tendencies to hoard nice things. I had a Omega Speedmaster to scratch my magpie itch but sold it because it seemed even more ‘out of place’ now that I am not working in London.

Diamond rings – just like luxury watches, a triumph of marketing.

My iPad Pro 12.9 gets a lot of use.

I like the John Lewis Crisp & Fresh 440 thread count bed linen but I might try that M&S set linked too next.

Baavet wool duvets – excellent.

Quad power amplifiers – I had a 306 to start and upgraded to some 707s, and now got some 909 monos, a QSP and a pair of QMPs. The QMPs are the best of the bunch, but they are all pretty similar and offer great performance and value for money. Quad preamps, at least the early ones, not so much.

Music First Audio pre-amplifiers – expensive but good value for the performance – would need to spend a lot more for better solid state preamplification.

Got 3 Sleepeezee pocket sprung mattress and they have all been good – different models though and some with better edge support. Had a Sleepeezee before that got dumped after many years.

Decent walking boots

This is the rivnut tool I used – reasonably priced and well made :

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/125753853320

This is the Turner Sultan from the Amazon review – it is also a 27.5+ converion but the XL frame allows the battery inside the frame :

Here’s a Marin with the CYC motor on it :

And here’s a conversion using a more powerful CYC motor by the guy on Rob Rides EMTB YT channel :

with an older CYC battery that was a better shape than the new ones.

Here’s a review of the CYC Photon :

but notice later that he had an issue with the hall sensor, probably due to overheating. The CYC uses a different motor design than other that means that the case doesn’t act as a heat sink so much – so when these guys are trying to drive it at powers close to max with the throttle they get problems, but pretty sure that won’t be an issue for me.

There’s another quirk in the tool used to remove the chainring – the supplied tool is a two pin affair and some people have been having issues – so CYC have made a better tool available from their site.

That guys channel is worth browsing – he has covered Bafangs and the torque sensing Bafang M635 (which has a proprietry battery), and other stuff. But he is US based so they want more power and throttles.

For UK legality the motor is supposed to have a plate on it saying 250W, the voltage and the manufacturer – I’ve had a bunch printed up if you need one ! Ones for Bafangs are readily available on Ebay and Etsy.

@Andy

Here’s the sultan running as a 27.5+ with 3.0 tyres and a couple of offset bushings to correct the BB height.

It’s a large frame and thats the battery hanging from the downtube – I don’t really need those straps as the rivnuts seem pretty solid, but they are there for piece of mind. I saw a picture of a Sultan on an Amazon review for the Bafang motor, with a similar battery that fitted inside the frame, but that frame was an XL.

I was going to put some 29 wheels back on the Sultan, which might make that battery look less bulky, but I was also thinking of swapping the kit over to my 650b Turner Flux as the battery will just fit inside the frame (I think), as in reality having the battery underneath makes me worry when banging down rough rocky bits. Also it’s not the best way round for if it rains.

That’s quite a large capacity battery, but I didn’t really see much smaller cases in the lower capacity ones. In the US there are more places selling better shaped battery packs :-(

The chain line is also slightly too wide – making the chain run at a bit more than I’d like to the large cog – but being an ebike I don’t use that gear too much anyway. I think all the kits have a little bit of a chainline issue.

I also had to remove the bottom ISG tab, but I use the other two to zip tie to for cable routing.

I suppose it currently falls into the so called e-bike SUV catagory at the moment :

https://www.cyclingelectric.com/buyers-guides/e-bike-suvs-a-guide-to-do-it-all-electric-bikes

T^hats the one. Yes changing gear early is good. However it did not show what you claimed at all as you can still change up early and accelerate less aggressively at 20 mph. so it proved the opposite of what you claimed

Not if you are driving up a steep hill – at 30mph you might have been able to change to 4th whereas at 20mph you wouldn’t – unless maybe you were driving a large BMW diesel but round here there are lots of Ford Ecosports, Vauxhall Adams and ‘normal’ cars that won’t be able to make that gear change and will therefore have a lower mpg and higher emissions.

The reports stating that fuel efficiency at 20mph is often as good or better as driving at 30mph are based on being able to drive calmly (and make those gear changes early), whereas in areas like here with lots of hills calm driving (and early gear changes) is not so easy.

i think it’s a fit issue, as when i push up the wrist a bit and kick start the readings via the native app, it’s generally accurate for the remainder

I’ve seen that mentioned quite a few times now.

The Quantified Scientist on YT certainly thinks the Apple Watches are more accurate than the Garmins, including for cycling, although maybe not mtbing. The smaller Apples are also probably mmore accurate because of the less movement/vibration.

Which point was disproved by your link

the one about changing gear early – it is not my fault that your comprehension skills are so lacking that you couldn’t understand the effects that changing gear early have

Helly Hansen are great value for decent salopettes and jackets – I once bought some Trespass salopettes in an emergency, which were reasonably priced, and they were nasty and clammy.

And no-one should wear anything cotton, ever…

all the way thru this you have been making totally spurious objections to the 20 mph limit trying to use research that disproves your point.

whilst talking about emissions, not not being able to keep to 20mph.

but complained you petrol engine can’t hold a steady 20mph up a hill.

that’s more BS, I just said the research on emissions at 20mph relied on driving calmly, which isn’t the case when hills are involved as you use the accelerator more.

I’ve got bags of power and torque in my engine to ensure I can get up that hill easily. My second car was a diesel, and did you not read my comment about the DPF making a diesel impractical.

It’s worth doing a few lessons on a dry slope locally if possible, I did that and then got streamed into a higher ESF group my first year, which was good.

Subsequent years think of doing the Warren Smitth ski school – he is excellent. ESF and the like are just lowest-common-denominator production line type schools.

The Bafang is cadence driven – ok for some people but probably not someone who enjoys actually cycling.

I put the CYC Photon kit on my Turner Sultan – the Photon is torque sensing and works well. It is also slimmer than the Bafang unit.

They do a version that is EPAC compliant, such that you can’t switch away from the 250W mode.

I’ve got the normal unit which goes to 750W, but I keep it as 250W as I don’t want that much assistance.

Some people have been having issues with overheating with the CYC because of the type of drive it is, but this is from people who all run it at higher power settings and often use the throttle.

The main issue is finding a slim battery to fit in your frame – mine doesn’t quite fit in my triangle so I had to drill some holes for rivnuts on the underside of the frame. The CYC batteries are all awkward shapes now.

These guys say they should be able to work on CYC Photons once out of warranty : https://www.facebook.com/EbikeMotorRepairs/

I got my motor from Paradise Cycles :

https://www.paradisecycles.co.uk/cyc-photon-mid-drive-motor-kit.html

These guys explicitely list the EPAC compliant version, although being a special order most places I would imagine that everyone can get it :

CYC Photon – 250W EPAC Compliant eBike Torque Sensing Mid Drive Conversion Kit

(I didn’t buy from them as they seemed to have a misunderstanding of the legality of motors and thought riding offroad allowed higher powered motors)

I got my battery from BesBike :

HOME

I liked the guys enthusiasm, and they sell Tongshengs and Bafangs as well.

This is the battery I bought – note that the height is pretty low for this type of battery :

52V 14Ah Down Tube Battery Pack – Polly5 with 2A Charger

And they also have this side release battery which might help more with keeping the battery within the triangle:

48V 10Ah Side-Release Battery Pack – Hailong#2

Although they haven’t got the Photon listed for some reason they can probably get it.

It sounds rather like you do.

BS – show me where I’ve said that I have.

yeah, its not a diesel BMW

precisely.

Not really a fan of BMWs and certainly not franchised garages so I’ll stick with decent Alfa independants.

Also don’t really like how diesels drive, and I don’t do the sort of driving that is needed to clear the DPF anyway.

Oh, and I also do the carbon offset thing on the Shell app – which may or may not mean that I am carbon neutral on my emmisions.

So only an ‘nth quicker (a bit of a second to 60 and about 7mph top-end) than my diesel BMW

who cares, apart from many diesel drives who seem to like the acceleration

This Alfa is probably a lot slower than your diesel BMW but I wonder which is more fun to drive (not that I drive like mine that) ?

You wouldn’t have to buy a new one, just swap for one of a similar age.  Maybe get one with a speed limiter function to help you with your 20mph problems.

still got the increased emissions from the buyer of my car who is highly likely to do more miles, so there will be a net increase in co2 emissions as my emissions are not reduced by much with my low mileage count, unless I scrap my car which would a strange thing to do considering its condition.

plus my car is pretty close to the average emission level of cars of that age anyway, so my choice of cars of that age that will get me a significant reduction in co2 emissions is small.

and I’ve got no issues sticking to 20mph personally, dynamic mode and a stick shift means I can drive in 3rd or 4th most of the time pretty easily, unlike a lot of the big automatic cars whose owners seem to moan about it the most.

Intrigued you are worried about an increase in pollution yet drive a car with higher than average pollution levels?

Had the car for a while now, it’s emissions are 162g/km compared to the UK average of 138g/km but I only did 2.5k miles last year so if I bought a new car to significantly improve on C02 emissions at that rate of mileage I probably won’t ever pass break even over the CO2 cost of the new car.

Plus whoever bought the Alfa would probably do a higher mileage than me and therefore emit more, decreasing the benefit of me driving the lower CO2 emission car that I changed to. So by keeping it I am actually keeping the overall amount of CO2 emisions down :-)

The Guardian seems to agree with me :

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/green-living-blog/2010/sep/23/carbon-footprint-new-car

“With this in mind, unless you do very high mileage or have a real gas-guzzler, it generally makes sense to keep your old car for as long as it is reliable – and to look after it carefully to extend its life as long as possible. If you make a car last to 200,000 miles rather than 100,000, then the emissions for each mile the car does in its lifetime may drop by as much as 50%, as a result of getting more distance out of the initial manufacturing emissions.”

The cars been reliable, only has 61k on the clock, has a very solid engine, so as long as the electrics hold up (…) I should be able to keep it going for a long while and bring the overall CO2 cost of it down.

Yeah but look a bit deeper. This a political issue, and a grumpy whiner issue, and as with all such issues there is more to it than you might think at first. Read my earlier post and have a look at what the actual diversion is.

But the diversion is only a small part of the route, and if many of the more open sections that were 30mph are now 20mph this will affect the time the bus takes to get around the route.

In the denser urban areas that are now 20mph it is pretty likely that the bus only managed around 20mph anyway.

In south wales there have been more exceptions applied for, so more open roads that were NSL 30 and would have become NSL 20 have been ‘corrected’ back to a more free flowing 30mph. In the north less exceptions have been applied for and made, so the bus is now stuck at 20mph on what many would say should be a 30mph road.

As an aside, why are the speed limits in urban areas marked with 20/30mph signs when, as they are national speed limits, they could have used the ‘white circle with a black diagonal line running through it’ sign instead?

If this had been the case the wouldn’t have had to spent so much money, just announced that the national speed limit for urban areas was changing and then put new signs up on the exception roads.

Probably because you’re accelerating harder, for longer coming out of a 20 into a 40/50/60 rather than coming out of a 30. Accelerate less hard.

What car are you driving, and manual or auto?

Manual, Alfa Guillietta cloverleaf.

Not accelerating hard, I am ony really talking about having to crawl up a steep local hill in 20mph rather than crawling up it at 30mph, the mpg is lower at 20mph.

Actualy my car has a ‘dynamic’ setting which would normally take a mile or so from the mpg, but I have a feeling that it’s actually better in the 20mph zones as it is much more flexible at lower revs, meaning I can keep in a better gear ratio.

You don’t live anywhere as aggressively working class as south Wales, though, do you? I can guarantee that you’d do for about two days before a roided-up bloke in a BMW or Audi took offence and decided to teach you where you should be riding, in his opinion.

and that’s my point – bringing the limit down on so many roads that are monitored by cameras, etc, has some effect for law abiding citizens but not much for the many such drivers in south wales and the valleys, and even for the abiding citizen speeds seems to have crept back up to closer to 30.

It’s been said that proscecutions are only going to be for over 26mph, in 30mph areas where there’s a speed camera speeds drop to probably 28mph, so not much different.

I still think it would have been a much better use of the money to put up speed cameras in areas that were actual accident hot spots, more pedestrian crossings and cameras catching anyone jumping red lights on pedestrian crsossings – zebra crossings being more of a problem.

There were already many 20mph zones around with existing signage.

I am also in favour of more unmarked police cars, and don’t really see why speed cameras have to be made so visible, surely that just reduces their effectiveness?

I had one pulled a few years back, second from back on the bottom leaving a gap before my wisdom tooth. Once it had healed (no dry socket thankfully) it has caused me no problem whatsoever.

Same here – a crack had appeared under a previous filling (that had been done well, apparently) so I had it pulled. Considered a dental implant but decided against it.

Still get a fractional amount of blood when I brush my teeth but I brush my teeth a lot and it’s been like that for years. But basically no problems.

@gravedigger what the fit like on those scarpa boots?

I bought the Scarpa Treks in 43 and also bought some Scarpa SL Actives in 43 at the same time but the SLs didn’t fit at all, much more narrow than the Trek which I think are the comfort last.

I’m a 43 in my Shimano MT51s and MW81, I have some Specialized Expert Carbon mtb shoes in 42 that are snug and also some in 43 which are less snug and I use with my woolie boolie socks instead of normal thin DeFeet socks. I am a 43 in my North Face mules, and a 43 in my Merrell Moab II Mid boots, which fit like a glove when used with the green Superfeet insoles.

With the green Superfeet insoles in the Scarpas they fit really nicely (probably would of with the supplied insoles but I’ve used the Superfeet for so long I stayed with them). They are close fitting around the heel and ankle (I kick my heel down into the boot when doing them up) and the toe box is roomy – almost making me think I ‘might’ have been able to go to 42 but when testing size with my foot pushed forward I get the fingers width behind the heel as most fitting videos suggest, and the insole test looks about right.

I did go out walking for about 4 hours in my Merrells around a local loop of about 9.5 miles and 2280 ft of elevation, so that my feet were ‘swollen’ up, and then tried the Scarpas for another couple of hours around the house and up and down the stairs, before finally deciding they were good.

I have now walked a lot in them – initially my lower legs needed breaking in to cope with the extra stiffness of the ankle support, and my feet needed hardening up as well. But when I bought the second pair and walked in them, the was no breaking in needed, now I was broken in… They have not creased up excessively before the toe box after many miles of walking, which would have happened if they were too long.

I’m using some Bridgedale merino socks so pretty normal thickness.

Its actually the opposite but never mind.

So it is the opposite then, so 20mph zones are a bad thing, right?

not according to the 20 is plenty site;

https://www.20splenty.org/do_emission_increase#:~:text=Many%20people%20think%20that%20driving,fuel%20consumption%20better%20than%2090mpg.

Or the Welsh government:

https://www.gov.wales/introducing-20mph-speed-limits-frequently-asked-questions#:~:text=Will%20driving%20at%2020mph%20mean,health%20%7C%20Guidance%20%7C%20NICE).

Or the ethical choice website:

https://www.eta.co.uk/2023/05/05/myth-busters-20mph-speed-limits/

Or a German report quoted by the Guardian;

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2010/apr/19/ask-leo-20mph-speed-limits-pollution

(Which also quotes a report that speed bumps should be removed as they cause increased emissions).

So what are you basing your statement on ? Anything factual ?

gravedigger – I suggest you read that – it has nothing to do with 20 mph limits – its about what revs you change gear at. Zero relevance

“can reduce the emissions of CO2 (and fuel consumption) when shifting up gear early.”

yes, shifting up early means you are out of that less efficient gear as soon as possible, into a more efficient gear which will have a better mpg and therefore you will produce less emmissions over your journey as your mpg will be better – as co2 emmisions are generally about constant per gallon of fuel.

My mpg going up that local hill at 20mph in second is a lot worse than my mpg going up that hill at 30mph in third, hence more fuel used per journey, hence more emmisions.

My average mpg now has dropped from just over 32mpg to around 28 mpg, which must mean more emmisions.

Most of the studies showing that mpg isn’t meaningfully impacted by the 20mph zone are based on the fact that you are driving steadily, and it is easy to keep your mpgs up, especially if they are displayed on your car.

However the presense of significantly steep hills somewhat buggers this up.

Slowert speeds = less fuel burnt = less emissions. the RAC tried to prove your po9int and infact proved it wrong

I give you some research results that are probably more rigorous than those by the RAC :

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/267202788_The_influence_of_gear_change_on_vehicle_exhaust_emissions_Calculations_with_the_vetess_emission_tool

Happy to be corrected but it hasn’t cost £30 odd million, but will cost that over the decade or so it takes to switch out and change the signage, etc.

£34.4 million according to a BBC report, that is quoted on a parliamentary web page :

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cdp-2023-0214/

and £32 million quoted on the Welsh government web page :

https://www.gov.wales/introducing-20mph-speed-limits-frequently-asked-questions

Pretty sure most of the signage has now been changed…

Again – complete nonse4nse proven to be false

It’s been proven that emmissions are the same no matter what gear you are in ? Please show me that research.

The only way that could be true is if the drivers are too stupid to change gear.

too stupid to attempt to drive up a hill in a gear than is going to stall the engine ?

too stupid to use the lowest gear possible in order to save fuel ? In an area of low incomes ?

Before you cuold drive up the hill in third but now you will be using second, hence higher emmisions.

Most of the people I know who were vehemently opposed are now “meh”.

That’s because they are driving round at 26mph as that’s what has become known as the limit they will proscute at.

But if they had instead spent that £34.4 million on putting up more speed cameras in the pedestrian areas/accident hotspots that are now 20mph then they would actually have caught the speeding cars that are doing greater than 33mph, rather than now just having most people doing 26mph and still have the dangerous speeding cars that are unlikely to be caught withput further massive expenditure.

And I am guessing any claims on emissions are void in certain areas where you now have cars struggling to climb steep hills at slow speeds.

Not because of a default 20mph limit unless otherwise signposted…

Actually it is – trying reading their reasoning for adjusting the route and the action the government is taking:

Welsh Government is reviewing 20mph limit’s effect on buses