There are several problems, which may and may not matter to you too much if the intended use is on a turbo-trainer.

Chainline will probably be wrong, as others have noted, the cranks sits further “out” if it’s Campagnolo on Shimano (ISO on JIS), unless the tapers inside the crank are very worn – in which case you may get away with it (but I doubt it). This will have effects on shifting at the front & possibly give you problems on the big-big combination at the rear – the chain might tend to fall off inwards in this gear and maybe the next one, too – depends how worn other bits in the transmission are.

FD might and might not shift – but probably will. Bear in mind the same FDs are made to work with varying different diameters of seat tube so are not at a constant distance on every frame from the crankset anyway. The biggest problem would likely be on a 28.6 seat tube (trad steel) as the FD already has to throw further, without adding in the problem of an incorrect chainline / crankset 4 mm odd further out …

Some possibility that in the long term the LH crank will split because there is not enough load-bearing surface engaged inside.

We can probably supply rims (2007 might be an issue as they’ve changed twice since then) but it’s usually a close run thing as to whether it’s worth doing the job … the problem being that complete wheels are so heavily discounted now that by the time we’ve supplied rims and nipples (and if the wheels are old enough for the rims to have worn out, new spokes might also be advisable)and you’ve had them built (we don’t generally recommend this job for home-builders), the costs have started to pile up. Please email me at velotechcycling”at”aim”dot”com for full pricing info.

The cassette body has the same physical dimensions as the Shimano unit, so you need the same spacer set.

The cassette body / wheel comes with the 1.85 mm spacer that you would use if you were fitting a 9s cassette. The 1.85 mm spacer reduces the effective width of the cassette body to that of the original Shimano 8/9/10s width bodies.

The 10s cassette itself comes, as others have noted, with a 1 mm spacer to fit behind the biggest sprocket, so for a 10s fitting, you will need that, plus the 1.85 mm spacer .

An 11s cassette needs no spacers behind it.

Triple front mechs are deeper “top to bottom” than are doubles, so as to cope with the increased disparity in chainring sizes.

Campag currently don’t make a triple front mech in anything other than 11s format which dosen’t play very well with anything other than it’s intended shifters / chainset / chain … so really, a bit more info would be handy …

What’s the FD fitting (clamp on or braze on, and if it’s clamp on, whats the diameter of the seat tube?
What are the chainring sizes on the chainset?
How old is the chainset?
What levers are fitted
How many sprockets at the back?

Given that info, we can probably make arecommendation about something that will work for you and how to go about finding it – it may be Campag, we may end up having to look at a mixed marriage 🙂

HTH
Graeme
Velotech Cycling Ltd
Campagnolo Mian UK Service Centre

Ref the FSA rings – following the link, it looks as if they are shaped to match the aesthetic of the Shimano 7900 chainset (sort of …) and are 130 BCD so not a match in any case for a Campag chainset – the “Campag 11s comaptible ” may refer to the fact that Campagnolo space their 11s chainrings effectively closer together (by offsetting the teeth on the inner ring) than do Shimano. Just a guess.

UltraTorque compatibility – you have to be careful about the year, as in 2011, Campagnolo swapped to a threaded inner ring for UtraTorque only – so it may be that which Stronglight are alluding to.

It’s only the compact-pattern rings that use an offset “5th bolt” – standard rings (42/52, 42/53 and 39/52 & 39/53 pairs) did not use the offset bolt, which is there to hold the rings in a fixed orientation relative to each other. The orientation matters because of the way that Campagnolo ramp the inside of their inner ring – the ramping is deigned to work in a very specific way with the leading edge of their own chains – the inner ring has to be able to “let go” of the chain to let the lift pin and ramp guide it up to the outer ring, at a specific time. Hence the orientation of inner to outer matters.

The ramping is more critical on Compact ring combinations and especially on 34/50 because of the big step that the derailleur is trying to force the chain to take.

Manufacturer’s own data shows that changes made to chainring shaping (and stiffness) have most influence on compact-type systems’ shifting and between the “normal” compact combinations of 34/50 and 36/52, the biggest difference is seen in 34/50 as this is where the %age difference in ring size is greatest.

If you are running a KMC chain this won’t work properly anyway as KMC use a different shape on the outer plates and the shaping lacks the chamfer that (in Campag’s case) is designed to mate to the ramps and lift pins. All that will mean is that the upshift won’t work, in all circumstances, as well as it would with an all Campag system. The same would be true in a Shimano system or a SRAM system – all these things are increasingly designed to be used very much as a system, which is not to say that they won’t *work* … the question is, how close to the designed parameters will it work & how much does it matter to you, as an individual user?

On ring prices vs full chainset prices – well, that’s pretty normal. Firstly, chainsets are sold in large numbers and are very heavily discounted – chainrings are more troublesome to stock & to stock control and so are generally not so heavily discounted.
Secondly, in many cases, very cheap complete groupset components are sold into the aftermarket through “grey” channels (they may be OE units sent out to bike manufacturers / assemblers, rather than after-market units, for instance) wheras all spares are sold as AM items and so subject to a different distribution and pricing structure.
Thirdly, spare parts usually appear disproportionately expensive against buying a full item in very many manufactured goods – inventory costs, shipping costs, rate of turnover, the margin required to deal with technical queries around which part suits what and why, all contribute to the final price. When I was dealing with spares at a national wholesaler, we found that complete unit turnover ran at about 15 x the spares turnover … and at the end of each year, our profit on spares was, in effect, sitting on the shelf as stock because of the number of spares that we had to stock “just in case”.

For others referring to this thread …

Yes, don’t forget to make sure that there is no washer in the recess of the crank … you can’t extract the crank past it! Even if one comes out with the bolt, have a look in the crank as well, to make sure no-one has doubled it up in error!

Campag recommend the following pullers, having tested them both in the factory / Service Centre environment and with the teams:

Facom U.301 in combination with FC-UT090 & FC-UT095 (the original recommendation and the one we use in-house at Velotech)

VAR P12600 – we have tested this and it works really well.
Cyclus 720249 / 720310 (carbon crank adaptor) – we also have tested this and again, it works really well.

They have not conducted tests on the Park tool so it’s not recommended. We’ve tried it and the tool failed 🙁

HTH
Graeme
Velotech Cycling Ltd
Main Campagnolo Technical and Service Centre UK

You can’t use “any 110BCD chainring” as Campag have one bolt offset at 108 mm so as to get the rings correctly timed relative to one another … TA do a compatible ring or we probably have stock of the relevant outer ring. If you’d like, please PM.

FD will shift better with Campag 9/10 compatible & if it’s set right, you’ll be able to use all 10 sprockets from the big ring without trimming – but the Shimano units aren’t too clunky with 10s and only occasionally throw off to the inside (on the 9s units the cage is a tad too wide …)

HTH
Graeme
Velotech Cycling Ltd
Campagnolo main UK SC

You need to check that the cassette is correctly spaced, as per the advice above (Shimano 11s cassettes are wider than their 10s counterparts and a spacing washer is required under the 10s cassette on an 11s body also as noted above).

Once you think you have the cassette correctly assembled on the cassette body, it’s worth checking, before you fit the lockring, that the surface of the smallest sprocket that the lockring is supposed to tighten against is “above” the end of the cassette body – otherwise ni matter how tight you assemble the lockring, it won’t compress the sprockets onto the cassette body.

Last, turn the cassette with your hand clockwise to ensure that all the driving surfaces on all the sprockets / sprocket carriers are against the relevant surfaces of the cassette body splines and then tighten the lockring to the 40nm recommended – probably 75% of the cassette lockrings that we see in our workshops fitted by end-users (and, sadly, often other mechanics, who should know better) are nothing like tight enough. The torque given is designed to prevent any possibility of sprocket fret against the cassette body and so any damage to either the driving surfce of the cassette body spline body or to the driving surface of the cassette sprocket / carrier.

HTH
Graeme
Velotech Cycling Ltd
Campagnolo main UK SC

When you say the cage return tab, exactly what part are you referring to? A small (KB size) image would assist. We may be able to help as many parts of the older 9s RDs are common to current RDs, plus we have stock of many older RD parts … Please contact us off-forum at velotechcycling*at*aim*dot*com

HTH
Graeme
Velotech Cycling Ltd
Main Campagnolo Service Centre (UK)

This could be a relatively expensive job, as Campagnolo have withdrawn 10s Triple (although there is probably still material out there)…

Your options will be to go Athena Triple, for which you will need F & R derailleurs, chain, cassette and ErgoPowers, as well as the triple chainset and BB, or to go 10s if you can still find it, where you can retain the cassette and chain, potentially, but may need a rear derailleur and will definitely need a front derailleur and ErgoPowers, chainset and BB.

Current entry-level Campagnolo ErgoPowers are PowerShift and the left hand levers in the current range are specifically double or triple – it’s likely that the gear system on a via Nirone would be entry-level.

You might be able, depending on the year of your existing levers, to just change the LH body for the triple version. Otherwise you’ll need a pair of levers.

What rear derailleur you need (long or short cage) would be dependent on the size of the cassette and the chainring sizes that you opt for (info in Campagnolo’s Technical Manual available online at http://www.campagnolo.com).

In both of the triple groups made in recent yeras, the now obsolete Centaur Triple or Athena triple, the chainset is PowerTorque and therefore uses it’s own BB cups.

HTH
Graeme
Velotech Cycling Ltd, Campagnolo Main UK Service Centre

Given that Campagnolo Service and Warranty is a significant part of my company’s income, I have an obvious bias towards Campagnolo – but we are also providers of neutral technical service on sportifs and races as well as offering an industry recognised training programme in all aspects of cycle mechanics – so I get to see all manufacturers kit in use, all the time – some of it well cared for, some of it not so well cared for and some basically neglected.

None of the big three make anything that is fundamentally bad or seriously flawed. In general we find that set-up and how (if?) kit is looked after has far more bearing on how well it works than any differences in technology.

In that respect, Campagnolo are often seen as being on the back foot because their kit is not so widely fitted at OE (although as the OP says, this is changing in the mid-market now) hence mechanics are not so familiar with it. This leads to errors in set up because Campagnolo do some things differently to Shimano and SRAM, who are more widely distributed at OE. This is natural – SRAM do some things differently to Shimano too, but it’s not seen as odd or tricky because mechanics see it pretty frequently.

The old adages about Shimano wearing out and Campag wearing in are definitely dead and buried – in fact a Campagnolo gear system, correctly set up, runs as well as anything from Shimano or SRAM stright out of the box. It has done, in practiacl terms for probably the last 15 years or so. Where it is different, though, is in feel. Campagnolo have made forays into lighter action levers over the years but have always, through market demand, come back to the more mechanical feel for which they are known … this and other differences are not there “for the sake of it” as some comments above imply but because Campagnolo’s customer is not always Shimano’s customer and Campagnolo products in general have a wider range of reverse compatibility. The current 2015 changes to the gear systems that make 2015 shifters and derailleurs from Chorus “up” incompatible with previous shifters and mechs are the first significant technical changes since the launch of 11s in 2009. 10s compatibility (with one or two technical changes) has remained the same since 2001.

Making a choice between groupsets these days is about liking the look and feel of the equipment, liking the technical support available (and Campagnolo are gradually rolling out a network of fully trained technicians in LBS – and interestingly “Campagnolo ProSho”p does seem to be an increasingly coveted status symbol from discussions we had with cycle shops at the NEC Show this year) and to some, aspects like where the products are made (over 85% of Campag production is still in Europe) and history / tradition … choices that pro teams make on the basis of who will pay them to use what are also influential, as are to some small extent, who wins what on which kit – Nibali and Quintara both had Grand Tour wins on Campagnolo this year, Del Costs won the Worlds in one of the wettest races ever last year on Campag EPS …

Obviously we’d love it if you bought into Campagnolo but the other makers out there build good equipment, no question.

Sorry to hear that you have had this problem.

If the crankset is in Warranty – i.e. you are the original owner, it’s less than 3 years old and you have a proof of purchase, we can look at this as a possible warranty issue.

Please contact us at the Campagnolo Main Service Centre via velotechcycling”at”aim”dot”com in any case – it is important that we see failures like this, whether it results in a Warranty claim or not.

On the compatibility issue – Chain ring spacing and design on both SRAM and Shimano is different to Campagnolo so you will find that the front shift will work, but it won’t be as good as it should be – plus if you are within warranty on the other parts of the system, you will be voiding both that warranty and any warranty on the Shimano / SRAM component (in all probability) as well … in general all manufacturer’s warranties tend to include clauses like “must be used with compatible parts from the *insert name here* range” …

HTH
Graeme
Velotech Cycling Ltd, Campagnolo Main UK SC.

Campag max is 105 kg and we suggest more frequent checks for riders over 85kgs.

Bearings in the Vento are sealed cartridge, though for 2015 they are adjustable with a screw-locked preload collar (rather than friction-locked as Mavic tend to use).

If you can stretch to £220 or so, Campag Scirocco 35s are hard to beat – otherwise the new Ventos are a great wheel, very lively for their price.

I’m biased working as tech-rep for Campag but I know the guys at Mavic UK well and would not say anything negative about the Aksiums – they have been around a long time as a model and they are also well-known as a bomb-proof piece of kit …

Contact us at velotechcycling”at”aim”dot”com and we can help, in all probability. We are the main UK Service Centre for Campagnolo.
HTH
Graeme

It somewhat depends on what you are trying to try out … if you want to know how an optimised system feels against a full Shimano set-up, then you need to use a full Campagnolo system including chain, chainrings, cables etc., set up by someone that is as familiar with Campagnolo as many mechanics are with Shimano.

If you just want to know how you get on with the different ergonomics of Campagnolo against Shimano, then there are corners that you can cut but in doing so you’ll be losing accuracy, predictability and smoothness of shift.

The absolute minimum you can *get away with* is probably rear gear, and shifters. The front shift won’t be very good but with careful set-up it will be workable, the rear shift (if you are running Shimano / SRAM 10s cassette at present) will be OK but possibly a bit rattly, probably worst through the middle of the cassette (where any derailleur system is at it’s most sensitive).

As you add in more dedicated Campagnolo parts, the shift overall will get better and more accurate. A full crank set (cranks, rings and BB so that you get correct chain line) chain and chain will make a big difference to the front shift. It needs to be set up correctly.

Campag cables assembled with metal ferrules and if you can avoid it, no in-line adjusters, make a big difference to consistency and accuracy of shift.

There are warranty considerations, too, depending on the extent to which they are important to you.

There considerations apply just the same whether you are looking at Campagnolo, SRAM or Shimano … systems are increasingly designed to work as just that.

HTH
Graeme
Velotech Cycling Ltd
Campagnolo Main UK SC

The chainset will *work* but the front shift won’t be as good as it could / should be – the ring spacing, ramping and pinning are all different and designed to work with a Campag chain, FD and lever. A Shimano chainset will work better, just as would be the case in the reverse scenario, trying to use a Shimano chainset with a Campag system.

Don’t try and take the laquer off the chainset – one important function of the lacquer on any CF component can be the protection from UV of the carbon matrix underneath. Messing with the lacquer layer can cause significantly reduced lifespan in some carbon parts and in the case of a highly stressed part like a crankset, do you really want to take that chance?

HTH
Graeme
Velotech Cycling Ltd
Campagnolo main UK SC | Cycle Mechanics training to national standards

Ultimately it depends how much faff time you have and how well you want things to work – warranty also rears it’s ugly head, if that is relevant to you.

The best shifting is always achieved by using a system as it was designed to be used – as a system. OK, we are biased as Campagnolo’s main UK SC, but if I were speaking for Shimano or SRAM, my experience and training would lead me to say the same – mixed systems are to some extent always a compromise.

That isn’t so say they won’t work – but in the context of your question you have to take into account that all three main manufacturers use subtly different actuation ratios and approaches to the technical challenges of indexing. The more gears you pack into the space available, the more accurate you have to be and so the more the systems become sensitive to being compromised by an unexpected (by the system) factor being added in.

Shiftmates seem to offer the best of the available compromise solutions to using (specifically) combined Campagnolo / Shimano systems but if you are dealing with new parts, just remember that using any third party part in the system may affect your warranty …

Remember too that the main manufacturers test and test and test on a variety of scenarios that fall within their overall frame design and intended use parameters – individuals may be able to persuade combined systems to work in their particular circumstances but that doesn’t mean that such a solution will work in another set of circumstances.

The more we expect from gearing systems in terms of shift performance, range and overall “slickness”, as in the case of practically every other technical product, the less we can expect to be able to be able to interchange parts and retain those characteristics.

I don’t say that is necessarily a wholly desirable thing but it is “the way it is” …

Depends what you mean by *work* and whether you are waranteed, and if you are, whether you are bothered about maintaining the warranty.

It’s doubtful that the shifting will be in any way optimal – SRAM’s ramps and pins are designed to work with SRAM chain and FD, not Campagnolo’s, SRAM ring spacing is also diofferent, plus the “yaw” motion of SRAM’s FD puts different amounts of force on the chain than does the Campagnolo FD.

Chainline (which likely falls into Campagnolo’s tolerance as it is a function of rear drop out width, cassette width and cassette placement relative to the dropout) is likely to be the least of your worries!

HTH
Graeme
Campagnolo UK Main Service Centre

This sounds like the Hirth joint is damaged. It can happen, sometimes from being ridden with the fixing bolt loose, sometimes from a huge over-torque load being applied to the fixing bolt.

That of course sets us wondering about the “clicking” noise – maybe movement caused by an under-torqued bolt, or a bolt that had worked loose.

Send them to us at the Service Centre and we can have a look for you. The best address to use at present is the office:

Velotech Cycling Ltd
37 Dinglederry
Olney
Bucks
MK46 5ES

HTH
Graeme
Velotech Cycling Ltd
Campagnolo Main UK SC

Hi there

We are on it!
Thanks for your call …

Cheers
Graeme

Hi there

What colour / year are your Eurus?
If they are current or last 5 / 6 years we can probably help.
If they are older – then we may struggle.

If you can post an image, we can be pretty specific on cost and availability.

All the Best
Graeme
Velotech Cycling Ltd., Campagnolo Main UK SC

Hi there

Normally this fault is caused by the thumb lever (lever 3 as we generally term it) snagging on the lever hood, or lever 2 (the one behind the brake lever) snagging on the lever hood – in the first case, the spring that returns lever 3 to the “normal” position isn’t strong enough to overcome the hood catching the lever, in the second case, as the two levers are responsible for driving a central spindle (which carries the shift ratchet) in opposite directions, if lever 2 doesn’t release off the shift drive ring, sometimes the system will free up by “wiggling” lever 3 up and down but this can also break things – so we don’t advise it.

Some pattern shifter rubbers are notorious for causing the jamming problem – as the fit isn’t quite “right” and some are a bit slack & sloppy on the lever body.

Older Campag hoods can become slack if the levers are lubed with spray lube – not required, don’t do it, can make a lever problem worse in some versions, regardless of damage to hood!

@Ollie51, it’s often times not that simple – in cases of doubt, especially on new levers, or levers up to 3 years old, best to send the lever to one of the four UK SCs – otherwise warranty may be void. In older levers we can usually return them to “as new” function, which can and usually is a case of more than just the index springs.

@faustus, the lever just needs to be in top gear, as per the fitting instructions available online & sent with the levers …

HTH
Graeme
Campagnolo Main Service Centre UK

We can help. We are the main Factory-appointed UK Service Centre for Campag and have taken over from Mercian in that role (well, actually, there was another SC between) ..

Mercian are also a superb choice and we can absolutely vouch for their excellence.

There are some issues around 9s levers, it depends on version, age and is not *quite* straightforward in every case.

Veloce internals can be swapped into Record or Chorus bodies in many cases but it’s not a straight swap, there are some subtle differences that you need to be careful about that make the difference between it working – and not.

PM me or contact us via our website if you’d like?

Cheers
Graeme
Velotech Cycling Ltd
Campagnolo main UK Service Centre
http://www.velotech-cycling.ltd.uk

Hi brooess, aP’s reply is substantially correct – the only thing to be careful of (and we see this all the time) is that the LH ergos all require correct cable tension.

Once upon a time, with older design levers it wasn’t so important, but as with Shimano and SRAM, the cable tension now has to be “right” to get correct function.

So, the full and correct procedure is:

1. Check the condition of the gear tunnels, they should be clean and the cables should not have worn grooves in them. Unless your frame has come equipped with it’s own tunnels, ensure that they are Campagnolo and are a snug fit the the BB shell, if you have external cabling. Best to do this now as if tou find it’s a problem later, you’ll have to unset and then reset rear and front derailleurs … cables should be genuine Campag (yes, it does make a difference) and ferrules should be metal, not plastc (likewise).
2. Ensure that you have correct chainline. For a 10s Campag sysstem this is 43.5 mm, +/- 1.5 mm … the measurement is centre seat tube to the inner surface of the outside chainring & assumes a Campag cassette mounted on a Campag hub.
3. Ensure that you have a compatible front derailleur – older designs don’t shift correctly with PowerShift.
4. Set the derailleur height (lower surface of outside cage plate 2 – 3 mm above the tops of the tallest teeth of the outer chainring) and orientation (outer plate part opposite the hinge parallel with the chainrings) correctly.
5. Before attaching the FD cable, shift the bike to the biggest sprocket at the rear and set the inside limit screw so that there is between 1/2 and 1mm clearance between the back surface of the chain and the front surface of the inner cage plate of the FD. If you do this without the FD cable attached, you know the only thing limiting the movement of the FD is the screw – not the cable which might otherwise end up being pre-loaded.
6. Screw the LH cable adjuster all the way in, then out about one and a half or two turns to allow you to reduce cable tension if you pull too much cable tension in initially.
7. Ensure that the LH lever is in the low gear position (required in any case to install the inner cable).
8. Pull the slack out of the front gear cable (not too much, just eliminate the looseness) & attach the front gear cable at the pinch bolt. It runs over the little shoulder adjacent to the punch bolt, not “under” it (i.e. not between the shoulder and the pinch bolt).
9. Turning the pedals at a speed similar to that used when riding, take one click on the upshift lever – the FD should move towards the big ring by about 1mm. If it doesn’t move, increase the gear cable tension. If it moves much more than about 1mm, reduce the tension a little. The second click should move the FD about another 2 or 3 mm outboard and in bottom gear, the chain should now scrape noticeably against the FD. The third click should shift the chain all the way up to the big ring, and when you shift at the back into top gear smallest sprocket at the back), there should be no scraping of the chain against the inside of the outer plate of the FD. If there is, increase cable tension until you have a gap of approx 1 – 2 mm between the outer surface of the chain and the inside of the FD’s outer cage plate.
10. Screw the outer limit screw in until it just touches the surface of the shift arm, so that pulling on the FD cable will not pull the FD more than about 1mm further “out” – the system needs a small amount of “overshift” as all derailleur systems do.
11. Check that on downshift, the first click just allows the FD to move about 1 mm inboard and that in this position, the chain does not scrape on the inside of the FD cage when you are in the lowest gear / two gears (biggest two sprockets) at the back.
12. The limit screws are now set and will not need to be changed again, but you may need to fine tune the cable tension – some compaction of the outer cable, and some pulling of the outer cable into the ferrule and the seat in the lever and of the ferrule into the adjuster may take place over the first few dozen shifts, which will need the adjustment of the cable tension, to maintain the 3rd click to the big ring from the inmost position of the front gear situation.
13. We recommend this method as if the cable is set too taut, the trim click won’t work correctly. If the cable is too slack, more than one sweep of the LH upshift lever will be needed to get from small ring to big – part-way through the second sweep, the FD will come up against the limit screw and eventually this application of shift force at the lever against an immovable screw may result in upshift lever failure.
HTH!
Graeme, Velotech Cycling Ltd., Main UK Campag Service Centre.