I also want a Garmin and a power meter HRM thingy.

Training to power will give you the best gains overall IME. Which i know doesn’t help with bike choice 😀

Ah I didn’t realise it was a lower %. 🙂

Lots of respect for turboing in the heat. I managed one turbo sess this season when it was pouring & windy but hot outside. Felt ill after it!

I was thinking about this thread the other day, and the FTP tet of 8mins vs 20mins. I’ve only ever done my FTP outside and full 20min efforts. I recently did longer intervals (7mins) which gave me an idea of what the 8min test would be like. I don’t see how the 8min test can be accurate – i knew i only needed to suffer for 7mins and my 5min power is good so the results (for me) would be out if i did the 8min test. I could have carried on for another minute (just) but not the full 20mins at that effort.

Not looking forward to the turbo this winter.

Purely from the point of view of performance during and next day it needs to be carbohydrate before during and after.

This. Plus protein and green veg. Eat within 30mins of stopping riding (or if not possible then have a protein shake as soon as you get off the bike). Protein shake just before bed helps a lot if you are training / racing.

I don’t think it needs to be as high as 90g carb per hour, i’m lucky if i hit 40g but can train / race fine on that as long as i have carbs before/after as well.

I got a bit of a shock when i worked out what a portion of rice should actually be to give me the number of carbs i wanted – its not very much compared to just piling it on my plate!

Other stuff like proper rehydration, stretching, foam roller will also help.

@crosshair, being on the front or in the top 10 in corners means less slowing down & virtually no sprinting out of it (unless you attack). Being at the back means big accelerations as you’ll have had to scrub off way more speed. It’s not that hard to stay near the front, you just need do be alerate all the time & constantly move up.

Are you taking your RHR or HR when riding – usually good indicators of over training. Also PE pretty reliable too i.e it feels harder than normal at same HR/power.
As for rest and knowing when to return, most people return to quickly – take a few more days then you think you need, or at the very most, z1 for an hour max for a few days before starting back properly again.
Heavy legs sounds like under recovered more than over trained, massage, foam roller and diet make a big difference if your riding lots (i train 5/6 days a week, foam roller every day, massage every 2 weeks, i eat tons and protein / recovery shake after every session). Are you eating enough to fuel your rides and recovery? Elevating your legs for 30mins after riding helps as does epsom salt bath.

I had 3 weeks off the bike at the end of my season last year (not through choice, it was my coach’s decision). I was miserable and lost what felt like tons of fitness. I think it’s the longest time I’ve ever had off the bike since I first started riding. But time off the bike and total rest is normal if you race seriously throughout the season – you have to come down to let the body recover and then start building base fitness, and mentally you need a break from training too (even if you don’t feel like it!). It came back pretty quickly once I’d got back into structured training again and I don’t think I lost as much as I thought I did either. I know some riders who have 4 – 6 weeks off at the end of the season and they are on amazing form from March – September.

I struggle with that side of things, mostly I hate being inactive, I like riding my bike for all sorts of reasons more than just training for racing and hate being told not to, and I also hate losing the fitness I’ve worked so hard to build up.

If you keep going hard now, you’ll end up peaking in Dec/Jan which is fine if its cx, but if its TT/RR’ing, you’ll be knackered by mid season. Focus on getting better.

Not looking forward to darker nights, 4 nights in a row on turbo/rollers last winter. Hoping to mix things up this year now I have power and my coach can see what I’m doing (or not) and get outside to ride in the evenings as often as I can.

Very early to start turbo training already if you’ve been racing this season? I’m not finished racing yet, then its end of season rest which is just as bad as turbo sessions! 🙁

Buy them!

Went to Lanza in Jan. It was hot, around 25-30degs but stupidly windy, i was blown off riding uphill & could hardly stand up to get back on! On the plus, you can ride on the roads even in pouring rain. It’s pretty small though & I wasn’t impressed with the roads / riding really. Traffic wasn’t great either – despite being on roundabouts with right of way, it was the norm to be ignored & have cars pull out on me. Gonna try gran canaria next, forced to go off season due to racing so limited options for sun in winter.

We are in similar position looking at GC or Portugal. It seems ££ to fly back into the UK wherever you fly to. Will let you know what we find out 🙂

Another vote for Tripster although mine is slightly older but very comfy on and off road.

Can you ride? Really easy gentle spin should help, or foam roller? Salt baths good too. Otherwise massage from
Deadlydarcy? 🙂

My coach told be to take 3 weeks off at the end of my season last year. He then told me I did his head in pestering him to let me ride 🙂 I find it hard at the end of the season to take a break like that, I love riding my bike & if I wasn’t doing that then id be doing something else active & so not resting.

Also he wasn’t really up for me doing my FTP on the turbo either, he said the results would be out by a certain % but I can’t remember what. Would hate to do it on the turbo too, bad enough outside!

My summer training seems to have mostly consisted of vo2 TT efforts. Yuck!!

Ooft no. It’s been so nice I’ve even ditched my recovery ride on the rollers for a spin on the cycle path instead!

Power meter, training peaks & my coach analysing the data from training & racing.

(the older I get the longer that seems to take!)

Yeh i’ve found that too, and my race warm up has had to change this season as the elites/pros go full gas from the gun in crits whereas i need time to get going. 🙁

My coach used HR to train me initially – for just under a year – and the rest of the time has been to power. The difference with power (and the way he interprets/uses it) is that if i blow on lap 4 of a climb at say 400w, then i’ll be doing intervals at 400w. Both are a good investment – i couldn’t interpret my data in the same way he does, nor could i train myself in the same way he does. Power also makes hitting specific zones much easier, having spent the last few months doing V02 TT efforts i can safely say i’ve never ever worked this zone in HR training!

Also, have you warmed up before hitting your intervals? Not just riding but proper warm up – again if i just rode for a bit then tried to do my 1st interval i’d never hit high HRs – power however is different.

I went out yesterday to try to interval at +189bpm and it was near impossible to get my hr that high on anything but good sized climbs

That’s around my threshold HR. If your fit, it’ll take a while to get HR up that high (for me it takes around 90s or so if i’m on my own) so depending on how long your intervals are, you could have already been at 189 hence tired legs by the time its showing on HRM? I used to have to do my zone 5a/b training on a climb as it was hard to hit 190+ otherwise. Horrible! Otherwise position and or being quad dominant? Are you using your glutes and hamstrings?

I’d say spend your money on a coach (you should get training peaks as part of this too, at least with my 2 coaches over 3 seasons i always have). They will be able to structure your training better than you can plus the right amount of intensity/recovery in intervals through either power or HR.

If you have the spare cash, then get a power meter as well as a coach…i switched to power earlier this year, its been an interesting adjustment to my training and i much prefer it to HR.

It’s ok when not exercising, not good when exercising: http://bit.ly/BizarroCoconut

Ygm I hope.

i’m currently going through lots of tests to find out what i’m intolerance too. go see your GP – you can get refered to a specialist for tests (i’m getting some 3 hours of lactose breath testing done in a few weeks to see if i react to the lactose/glucose solution – not going to be a fun day if i do)

Cinnamon girl – why avoid sugar in fruit for this?

What does training with 9.30s mean?

sorry, the fastest chaingang or black train of death if you prefer (certainly feels like that when i ride with them!) – was just trying to give you an idea of standard of rider from the strava table. 🙂

http://www.strava.com/segments/arthur-s-seat-climb-686793

The strava segment. 3.20 would put you in between Jar and Walter – walter placing top 10 in cat 3/4 races, Jar wins hill climbs for comparison. Both train with 9.30s.

Nice to catch up on this thread, lots of achievements! And good to see Molgrips trying racing finally, it took you long enough!! :-)I did 4 races over 3 days in June, results weren’t what i was after for one reason or another, puncture with service 5mins back, my back packed in and a really bad moment during my 4th race when i appeared to forget how to ride a bike on the worst part of the course to have a bad moment on. But i got into two breaks with riders from Wiggle Honda, pretty cool racing in the same group as Laura Trott and Jo Rowsell. My power numbers are all up too which i’m pleased with…but i’m a bit fed up racing with injury and it affecting my results so most of my racing adventures knocked on the head for this season i think, cat 1 isn’t happening again this season.

I also raced one of the Tour Series rounds, massive mistake ditching a bottle, and running my normal psi in my tyres on a course that was about 50% cobbles. I got on TV too, lets just ignore the fact i was refered to as a “back marker” of the race 😀 It was fun in a think i’m dying kind of a way…city centre crits are my worst nightmare (much like racing tameside, awful circuit!)

I watch highlights of men’s racing but couldn’t watch a full stage unless I was on the rollers/turbo. I will watch all of what limited coverage of women’s racing there is because I get to race with (against) a lot of those women so it makes it more interesting and or I’m on TV too 🙂

More interested in taking part in any kind of sport than watching it.

Camelbak in a crit? Surely trolling molgrips?!

In most crits you can get away without drinking unless it’s really hot. I like a gel on the start line but that’s just personal preference, it’s not needed.

If you happen to still be in the bunch towards the end then you need to think about positioning for the sprint – generally as a rule if your in the top 10 coming out of the last corner you’ll get a good result. If this means sitting in the wind & suffering to hold your line then so be it. Crits are tough, sprint corner sprint corner sprint. Get used to riding at puking level then riding a bit harder for your first few then they get easier 🙂

I’ve got both. My rollers are not quiet (neighbours complained about the noise!) but my turbo (fluid) is really quiet.

Kryton have you no fast chaingangs of that speed to try instead of turning up to a race? My local chaingang averaged 27mph, I did two turns in 4 mins then died going uphill at that speed 😀 A month of this & it’s getting easier.
Depends on what you want out of the race to answer your question…much harder to hang on in a crit at that speed than a road race but if you can work on a few things then it’s not all bad.

I was racing today, proper torrential rain. Glad I was in the break as I couldn’t see a thing!

although I am on a “break” between training plans

why would you be on a break between plans yet riding just as much? that seems very odd to me mid season!

How many races per year is the right number?

IME you can’t really dip in and out of racing as you end up not being race fit enough compared to those who race consistently from March – Sept, but you do need a mental break from it which is where training sessions like chaingangs come in as still race like speed but without the nerves of racing/being away from home etc. I personally can’t do more than 3 – 4 weekends in a row of racing because of the 8ish hours of travel involved but would quite happily race week in week out most of the season if it was on my doorstep/less travel. The more you race, the more you learn/mistakes you make and the easier it becomes. Plus it all becomes a bit more routine so less nerves etc.

I did 7 races in March, but only 2 in April after my crash since i didn’t have a race bike for a while…suddenly my target races in June are very close but i don’t have the races in my legs that i’d wanted to by now. 😕

Yeh i stupidly went for the sprint on thursday night with 1 lap to go. I much prefer longer circuits where you don’t need to think about laps etc. I’m forever asking my teamies how many laps we’ve done – all i’m ever thinking about / concentrating on is moving up/positioning etc.

I remember my first crit (town centre), all the blooming bells and whistles and NEG bikes coming past – i had no idea what was going on! 🙂

Seem to have lost my race mojo, not remotely interested in racing atm and got to decide if i want to race the Tour Series asap 😐

deep section wheel has broken spokes with poss damage to the deep section bit and is buckled i think. rear drop out is bent, mech hanger ripped off and bits of the screw are stuck in the frame too. think it can be repaired but i’m meant to be at a stage race at the weekend and don’t fancy it on my winter bike! not a mark on me as i held it up right until i could unclip and get my foot down…the worst bit is the chopper fell off going uphill…i mean really, how hard is it to keep pedalling going uphill?! it was on closed roads too, no excuses for it!

Involved in my first crash on Saturday, bike too broken to continue. Gutted, an expensive 20min race and can see my 1st cat licence goal slipping away already as no race bike no so missing more races. 🙁

Would agree with the comment that if you are finding it hard in a race then everyone else will be – i didn’t believe this when i first started racing but the more races i did the more i learned this – to start with its a case of holding that max effort as long as you can to hold on but if you can hold on, then the does eventually ease up and you’ll be fine. You only get better at racing by racing lots too.

Kryton, RRs are much different to crits, esp if a break has gone and stuck – the bunch will cruise along until its near the finish if that’s the case. If you can’t climb, get on the front of the bunch for every climb so you’ve wheels to fall back on otherwise you’ll be out the back on the first climb. Less sprinting (unless you are at the back coming out of corners)

“If you aren’t moving forwards your going backwards”. Race craft is learned over many races, i think it took me at least a full season to learn it. Now I’m on my 3rd season its second nature but you can’t switch off mentally for a second. The last few laps are crucial to your placing – come out of the corner in the top 10 and you’ll get top 10 generally.

Soemtimes its easier to work / sit on the front and suffer and hold places than it is to be in the bunch and sprinting out of every corner. I generally stay in the top 10 wheels of the bunch if i can, anything further back than that means sprinting out of corners/wasting energy.

I make quinoa cake for ride snacks, its yum! But you should have carbs when exercising according to the idiet.

I won my first ever race on Saturday thanks to my team mates controlling the bunch which allowed me to get away. By the time I was done, I’d been on my own for 33mins and came within 150m of lapping the field 8)

Raced a hilly RR the next day, got into a break on the climb but cramped the last time up it taking 10th.

Love racing bikes 😀

I had lentils and some veg. Sad times indeed. 🙁

I don’t believe I’m anywhere near the fitness/stamina level required.

Having been fighting back tears on the phone to my coach last night about my injury/lack of race legs after i’d expected to be flying after a consistent winter training, i’ll share what he said to me that helped: celebrate the good things/achievements you’ve made along the way and give yourself less of a hard time. Easier said than done as i’m my own worst enemy for being hard on myself which is a vicious cycle to break. 🙂

Remember its a journey as well as a result – sometimes (usually?) the journey there is more important than the result. Training is very different to riding, took me a long time to adjust – but i still have days when i feel like you do, usually related to not eating enough / properly – hows your diet?

I’d say have time off the bike, exercise for fun (or not at all if you don’t feel like it – as my coach always tells me, a week off the bike won’t do anything fitness wise, you may feel like you’ve lost fitness but you won’t have). Ride with friends (this always helps me as solo training is tough going) Think less and don’t over think it – you are fit and can and will complete it. Get a change of scenery – train on different roads, or in different places (or bike!). If you are doing lots of long miles, you could try doing shorter but high intensity stuff for a change.

Nice one Tired.

I warmed up for 20 mins pre race feeling conscious I was the only one doing so

Ignore the others, put ipod on and zone out.

As for the rest, chin up. Racing is mentally tough, maybe even more so than physically tough. I had a bad race last Saturday, an attack went, i went to go with it, legs just didn’t work and my injuries complained a lot, I missed the break, spent 20mins on my own and then got caught with 3 laps to go!! I’m struggling with 7 months of injury and rehab which has reduced my power a lot, i have some dark days when i wonder if its all worth it, knowing i’m way off form and yet racing week in week out. Woke up the next day for a RR. Didn’t know if i could even face racing after such a bad performance the day before but went onto have a great race, slightly mucking up the sprint finish but got 4th, just pipped for 3rd by literally nothing. Good days, bad days, happens to everyone. Good thing about RR is there’s always another one next week. 🙂

I’ve got a rare weekend off racing and was looking forward to some long rides and chaingangs….instead my coach has put in a 20min FTP test. 👿 🙄 I guess its going to be a very grim 20mins….

I spent the weekend mostly going round in circles with a crit race on Saturday and a road race on Sunday that was more like crit course than road race course and i got cut up mid sprint by a chopper to so finished with my worst result in a long time. 🙁