LOL – I'm stupendously bored at the mo, watching the clock swing round to 5:00. This wasted all of 30 seconds…..

<mental note> F'ck – need to get my 10 year renewal off ASAP </mental note>

http://rubylux.net/

3rd hit on Goggle if you search for "Brighton band street gig Bristol July"

No need to thank me! … 😉

Foxy – any bloody excuse…. 😉

I'm going slightly weak at the knees at Samuri's beauty. The black spoke/silver hub/white rim combo was what I had in mind. Now leaning very heavily towards white rims…..

Thanks all.

Shameless bump for the lunchtime crowd 😉

Al – good idea. There should be a limited number of threads that run and run for ever…. A few ideas:

– My helmet saved my life last night…
– Why would anyone want kids?!?!?!
– F'ing dogs – discuss
– What commuting tyres?
– Do I need a torque wrench?

I'll leave it there – oh, and once you commit to the 'Epic Battle' forum you have to stay in there until you've beaten all others! 😉

Can't help you…. but I still dream about the three-shanks-on-a-bed-of-mash that I had in Ohakune, NZ after finishing the Tongariro Crossing.

Is it epic?

Usual "I am right, therefore you must be wrong" STW 'discussion' 😆

There should be a pop-up everytime you log on to the forum with a message along the lines of: "Protective thick-skin must be worn at all times on this site" 😉

Do mean efficient as in super-speedy, low rolling resistance, or efficient as in not fixing a puncture every couple of days?

We were right at the front..

In the Fleece, you can be halfway down the corridor to the toilets and still be classed as 'right at the front' 😉

Although, did you know that the petrol engine is also a pseudo-atkinson cycle engine – with a longer power stroke than exhaust stroke? Another cool thing they've done.

…but you can't break the laws of thermodynamics – cool, m'be, but it's tickling the problem. Everyone is chasing ever more marginal gains at higher and higher cost and complexity.

<cough> new words are where it's at you know 😉 </cough>

It's a looooong way from that. Electric cars have indeed been around for a long time, but they've always been rubbish due to battery technology. The Prius is a petrol car with a battery to help it out. Totally different thing. Main fuel is petrol, that's all you put into it.

It's a parallel hybrid. This means that you can vary the amount of power coming from the petrol engine AND going to or from the wheels or the engine to the battery via the motor/generators. Very clever bit of kit indeed. The heart of it is a Power Split Device invented by someone outside of Toyota I believe and patented – but developed by Toyota.

I completely get and understand all of that – none of which backs up this asseterion that it is somehow a new engine technology?? Everything you've just written supports it being a smart piece of integration with technology culled from elsewhere. IIRC the power split-thingy came out of the turbine industry for balance loading multiple power sources (I have no source for that – a client was telling me about the technolgy behind it while back as they do similar clever things.)

The energy density of petrol is amazing, and that's what we are used to.

That is truly the nub of the issue…. well said.

But, with tongue only slightly in cheek, the Prius is an electric milk float from the 70's with a petrol engine in it to cope with charging the batteries and lopping power demand for a bit more performance. The latest technologies have been pooled from other industries to do it – there was a tehnical challenge to pull it all together into something that felt like a car to drive and could be sold for a similar money so it was economic…. but, IMO, to claim it is a new kind of engine is pushing it. If they'd been first-to-market with a mass produced fuel cell car and the infrastructure to back it up then I would have stood up and clapped as loadly as anyone else!!

That's my definition of innovation.

This is actually a gripe of mine (…and where I might come dangerously close to agreeing with TJ…) If you put a Model T Ford and a Yaris side by side, you could wander round them and identify all the key features in the same places (front wheel drive and heap of electric gadgets, as TJ points out, aside). There's nearly 100 years between them?!?! Where's my nuclear powered hovercar, eh?!?!?! It's still a f'ing metal box with an IC engine and a wheel at each corner?!?!? You could argue that Uncle Henry got it right first time, or that we as the public are so conditioned as to what a car shoudl look like that, bar a few niches, no volume manufacturer will go out on a limb for fear of committing commercial suicide. Parallel hybrid is but a tiny limp forward based on current economic needs, IMHO, not a step change in thinking.

They make dull cars for the masses

To be fair – and leaving the quality aspects to one side for a moment, this is exactly where the money is and what most people want. The average school run mum (and dad for that matter) doesn't care much beyond where the petrol goes in, what colour it is and how much it costs.

this is why the experimental fuel challenge cars have tiny highly tuned engines run flat out and then they coast

<waves> I've built and run one of those cars for the Shell challenge </waves>

Good fun, but a couple of observations a) I always felt the drive/glide philosophy was entirely within the rules, but not really in keeping with the overarching spirit challenge. As much development went into optimising your drive/glide cycles for a particular track/wind speed/etc etc as the car itself and b) if you had a midget on your team to drive, you were immediately onto a winner. 15 stone knackers need not apply 😉

…of stripping and fannying so…

Whatever you do in your own time is your business…. 😯

I think the key here is that an idea that remains in your head will always just be an idea…. the 'clever' bit is patenting/licensing or commercialising/selling the product…. and alot of that is about having the balls to back yourself and your ideas. ….None taken…. 😉

Allowing steam to occur in the system ?, wouldn't that reduce system pressure ?.

Also, engine coolant isn't just water, boiling it would cause issues

You don't boil water it in the cooling system – as you say, in current engines it is pressurised so it doesn't. By throttling the high pressure temp liquid back into ambient air, you get wet steam to drive the turbine. As energy is extracted from the steam it cools to liquid water again and is pumped back into the cooling circuit. The technology isn't new, but the application is.

Again, this is drifting off-topic somewhat – this was meant simply as an example of an alternative 'hybrid' technology and the fact that there is now an economic and political/marketing driver to invest in bringing these technologies to market…. but not yet a business case to move away from oil based fuels.

Where does the steam come from

Hot water from the coolant (with the water jacket extended to cover any remotely hot part of the block, plus INSULATION around the engine), further heated by a water jacket all the way along the exhaust system. You easily get >100 deg from the current cooling system, so by presurising it a bit more and stalling the flow longer around the engine (the complete opposite of what a current cooling system does – i.e. remove heat as effiicently as possible) you can get enough energy to do useful work.

br – thats a serial hybrid propulsion system, which molgrips kindly pointed out as I went slightly off-topic in post #1 😉 That has as much to do with power delivery characteristics (electric: peak torque at zero revs, commpared to IC: peak torque at nearly peak revs) as efficiency.

£25+ per gallon at todays prices( ratchet it up over 20 yrs)

I don't think you'll need taxation for those kind of prices at that kind of timescale. Cost of extraction and open market demand will do it soon enough.

I think we've done the car is bad/what will happen when the oil runs out to death before and is drifitng off of the OP's more technical question. As an alternative to hybrid electric, BMW are looking at adding a a medium pressure heat recovery system from the coolant system and exhaust to power a steam turbine directly attached to the crank shaft. Adds a further 10/15% to the overall thermal efficieny of the engine. Planned to be added to road cars in the next 5 years (IIRC) if development contiunes on track…..

I think the idea is that an internal combustion engine can be made to work as efficiently as it can (…another topic of discussion…) at a set speed/load, which isn't what you do currently accelerating through the gears/braking/ etc etc. So overall, an IC engine working at constant load charging batteries and running and electric drivetrain may still be more efficient overall – but is not optimal, just a bridging technology with the infrastructure we currently have.

EDIT: A similar technology is used for ships, whereby an industrial gas turbine which is relatively efficient at a given load/speed is used to drive a generator, which feeds an electric motor. There are other issues here around packaging/control of the ship/etc etc, but overall thermal efficiency is a driver too.

Hell yeah – odder-squared!! 😆

And the melting tarmac…..

I guess if you consider (simplistically) the rear triangle in isolation, the chain stays are necessarily stiffer than the seat stays to react pedaling/chain loads and therefore have a considerable stiffness against vertical bending as well. If you are prepared to keep on beefing up the chain stays then the seat says can be thinned out, giving the effect of some decoupling of the riders ar$e from the rear wheel. So yes, fair enough.

EDIT: Too slow 😉

A while back I did some FE analysis for someone-who-shall-remain-nameless on a new type of pivotless 'full-suspension' frame design. It was interesting a complete nightmare trying to balance the vertical stiffness/lateral stiffness/fatigue life/weld strength. Didn't go anywhere as the final form looked a bit odd! 😉

Even at a crappy level, most road races have a neutral service vehicle. However if not, you're buggered anyway, it's not as if you're going to be able to swap a tube and then chase to get back on

What I meant was that on an average Sunday bimble – not a race – a flat with tubs is going to be a monumental PITA. I'm not disagreeing that tubs have advantages (though the gap is closing), but for the average Joe – even one who races a bit, but mostly 'just rides' – it's not worth the hastle.

The flash picks the fibres up pretty brightly, it looks fine in natural light (to me).

Fair enough – the outline/edges do look to follow the line of the original profile…. it's just the reflection of the flash down the middle make sit look VERY uneven. Time will tell…

the stays don't take a massive amount of load (apparently, so I've read!)… time will tell I guess

Genuinely interested where you read that? 😯

Had almost exactly the same injury as you, with a fragment of bone, on my left elbow (with a dislocation though). Cast came off in four weeks, physio went on for (IIRC 8 further weeks). I reckon it felt "OK" within 3 months, was able to start really using it and had full range of motion within 5-6 months, but I couldn't race off-road without it feeling painful/aching during and afterwards for about a year. Was pootling off road by 9 months though and on the road quite a bit before that (if rather tentatively).

As the others have said it can take a long time to get full strength/range of motion back as you first need to let it heal, then start getting motion back then think about strength. Still gives me a bit of discomfort in cold weather, no idea why….

The first time I did it was 7-8 years ago – about 3 years ago I came off in a road race and fell on the same elbow and really thought I bu&&ered it, thankfully not, but fracture clinic have told me in no uncertain terms they don't want to see me ever again!

Maybe the photo doesn't do it justice (probably the case)…. but that 'repair' looks interesting….

Oh, and…

Why is it teams that spends 100s of thousands of pounds getting the most efficient bikes use tubs (GB track team for example), even those sponsored by companies that don't do tubs anymore?

Rolling resistance arguments aside, tub rims are lighter and/or stronger, less prone to pinch punctures and are safer in the event of a puncture. Tubs do deform better due to their shape and so grip harder too

All true and very real benefits…. provided you have a team car following you to hand up a wheel in the event of a flat….

As above, standard M6 cap head bolts fit – just. If you're replacing, get longer ones which will reduce the risk of stripping the crank threads (been there, done that, got the T-shirt….)

My only comment here is that any delivery time Ribble quote is just p!ssing in the wind – it'll (almost) certainly turn up at some point, but that will bare no relation to any delivery date that you were quoted at the start or during the numerous phone calls that you will make along the way to find out where your bike actually is.

IIRC, the final 'buy' payment is a separate purchase to the loan, so VAT is chargeable on the sale. The original purchase of the bike by the company for the purpose of the lease to you is separate…. maybe….

I was certainly charged VAT on my last bike, but then the sale price to me was £1. Accounts department got a bit of stick from the accountants for that…. 😉

In the early days of the scheme I got a F+F no-questions asked by employer/LBS/voucher scheme company but tired it a while back and no-one wanted to know.

As a further note to what Barney said do make sure you have some kind of 'cover'/insurance/pot of money in place should the bike get stolen in the load period. Happened to a bloke at work who was uninsured, but had to keep up the payments for 9 months on an item he didn't have. May get even worse if you still have to pay for the F+F and recoup for the cost of the rest of the finishing kit not covered by the lease.

Macca Pacca +1

Lol Clubber 😉

Detailing, beautiful…. colours, likewise….. but overall, did they really need to beat it with every branch of the ugly tree? 😉

Find out who's been having a cheeky wee-wee in it…….

Van Nic Amazon Cross – not as flash as some, but not (quite!) as pricey either….

What nols said – I have a mate who used to go when he was in the trade…. always took a spare suitcase with him for the freebies 😉

Go on, I'll say it – join a union! 😉

Most of the 'big boys' have a local set of agents for each patch. As an example, for the love of god do not use the Andrews letting office that covers Emersons Green – they would be only marginally less useless if they didn't have a pulse. On the other hand the Westbury office may be fine……