25 days + stats + ~3 days at Xmas at the discretion of the management.

In the first call they agreed they could service 11 speed. I’d have gone elsewhwere after failing to service the first time

This is the crux of the “shouty dilema”, which others have alluded to – after the first “mishap” I rang around any other shop I could think of that I’d be happy to go to. None of them had the service kit either – and critically – none of them was interested in getting it either for a, potentially, one off job. I don’t want to burn my bridges too hastily here as I may well end up having to go back to them in the future……..

Stoatsbrother – are you suggesting the OP threatens them!?

Does sound like passive blackmail (which I don’t entirely dismiss as a tactic 😉 but, TBH, I’m sure they pick up so much passing trade that losing my business – or even anyone else on here that might use them – will be neither here-nor-there to them. Workshop waiting time is consistently 6-8 weeks.

Can’t really tell from those pics TBH.

It would be odd for a crack to propagate through the filler material like that though – it would be more likely to be at the weld toe where the material is thinnest and in the heat affected zone of the parent material as they look like chunky welds! Really is hard to tell without seeing it up close though.

Search the forum – lots of good and bad stories on the 11-spd. Have an 11-spd on my road commuter and it’s been absolutely fine over the first ~1000 miles. A little draggy (some say it isn’t, but I do think it is), little heavy at the back, the gear jumps take a little getting used to and tyre changes can be a chore, but other than that, it just works.

If you ignore this http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/dealing-with-an-lbs then, yes, loving mine.

For balance, there are some horror stories around – search the bike forum for alternative views.

Are you not, technically, un-powered…… rather than unhinged?

If it were me I’d go back, get the wheel in my hands, check it’s been done then tell them you are unhappy, explain politely why to the appropriate person (shop manager / owner). Avoid getting p1ssy about it, nice calm and clear. Let them put their side and unless it’s good ask them what they’re going to do about it as you aren’t happy. A good gesture would be no charge, a fair compromise might be you pay for parts (not the kit and they suck it on the labour.

I don’t mind paying – they quoted ~£30 (admittedly, when they assumed it was 8-spd – the 11-spd service simpler involving no dismantling and about 10 minutes of actual spannering as far as I can tell), which seems not unfair when offset against their capital investment in the service kit/oil/time. Deciding if it was done/done correctly is going to be a little bit harder as it simply an oil change…..

I’m tempted to simply get the managers name tomorrow and write it all down – I know the name of the workshop guy who got p!ssy this morning and I think it would come across calmer in a letter…. it might get a little shouty in person 😉

I dont think you helped yourself by not checking the service kit had arrived before dropping the wheel off for the second time. Also If I hadnt heard anything from them after a week I’d have been calling them for an update.

All true – in mitigation, it is a pain to get to them during the week, so to take the wheel home AGAIN and then go back AGAIN would have been a complete ball ache. As I had a spare bike I could afford to leave it with them. You are right, I should have rung them after a week, after which I went on hols for a few days so it got put on the back burner until today. It was made clear that they would ring me when it was done/if they had a further update on progress….

1) I can do it at a time that suits me.
2) I know its been done properly.
3) I enjoy fettling.
4) Costs me nothing other than the raw materials.

1) I’m time-poor at the moment/happily pay a ‘nominal’ amount to get it done….
2) Never done a hub gear before, so in combination with 1) I wanted it done right this time….
3) Same here, but I don’t fancy bu**ering ~£400 of hub without doign a little research first (again, see 1)
4) See cost of service kit and oil, above…..

Looking forward to find out which shop it is!

That would be telling – let’s see how it goes tomorrow… 😉

….they say he moves in mysterious ways…..

Can’t get there until tomorrow AM to pick it up – we’ll see how it goes then before deciding on further action, though I think a letter is in order. Critically, I want an overview of what was done/what they found and have the wheel back in my possesion before going any further 😉

Mindful that I’ve been fed a crock of sh!t at various points all the way along, I did actually consider recording the latest call so the inevitable ‘who said what when’ argument had a little bit of weight on my side….. maybe next time 😉

TJ – that’s all I want really, is decent comms. Delays happen and I understand that…. but the fact they had my home/mobile/work numbers and couldn’t make some form of contact just does not compute. Fair enough – if there was a misunderstanding about who should have called me after the work was done on the day….. but to have the wheel still in the workshop after two weeks, and get mardy about it, rather than trying to find out why it is still there beggars belief 😐

Did you speak to the workshop when you confirmed it was an 11-speed Alfine?

Absolutely – told them at least 3 times on the phone they did not need to open it up as it was 11-spd NOT 8-spd…. and when I dropped it off the first time I pointed out the drain plug on the hub body…. and he still took it.

I’d have been running a mile when they told me I was going to be their Guinea pig first customer for this

They are a Shimano Service Centre – biggest in town AFAIK – so I would expect them to be aware of these things, if not have the kit to hand…..

Learn to service your own hub (easy enough).

Yeah, but the service kit is ~£90 and I would need to sell my daugther to buy a litre of the oil (of which I need 50 ml). Should only need to do it every 12/18 months after the first interval, but I may well look into it now…….

The service kit is complete rip off as ATF does the same job at 1/5 of the price.

This is a ‘keeper’ – if I get problems down the road, I an imagine the response from Madison if I said I just chucked ATF in it. For the sake of £30 every 18 months I felt it was worth doing it right AND putting some work to the LBS…… currently revising that opinion….

@deadly – hmmmm….. based in Bristol you say….. interesting….. <makes note of email for future flooring needs>….

What thepurist said…..but you’re often not to know that before they’ve done at least one job for you, so, what I look for when someone turns up for a quote….

– Discrete logos/corporate clothing, clean etc presents the right image
– Turn up when they say they will
– When noting stuff down for the quote, put it on company paper or in a job book AND BRING A F**KING PEN/PENCIL WITH YOU. YOU KNOW YOU’LL NEED ONE – DON’T ASK ME FOR ONE!!!
– Actually take measurements/ask questions/discuss requirements in a language other than grunts that our chimp ancestors would recognise.
– If you say I will get the quote by Wednesday make sure I get it by then – or communicate that fact so I’m not hanging.
– Be prepared to field Q’s about the quote and be prepared to revise it.

Just my tuppance worth….

RAID1 NAS drive for their data connected to the router? Depends on what question you are asking – see Cougar 😉

Bombproof, never break down and cost buttons to run*

* – NB: comments may be biased as I have an 06 estate for sale 😉 ….though I did by a newer hatch version to replace it…..

Tend to agree with both of M_F’s comments….. 😉

SketchUp (+3, is it?) for all the reasons mentioned above….

Any of the in house aero engineers care to elablorate on why it isn’t done?

Aero noise from the grating, inlet air flow rate/flow stability and it’s effect on engine size/efficiency? At the speed the plane is going, the interface between the bird and the grating would result in chip sized pieces of bird entering the engine, plus the grating would have to be mighty strong to resist the air pressure at crusing speeds! Plus it’s all extra weight, which is bad, mmm’kay…..

Only work with industrial gas turbines (some aero-derivative), but even there a stable inlet air flow is very important to maintain efficient and effective engine operation.

TBH, 20 sq.m isn’t that big – you might be quicker/cheaper overall doing it with a brush. Plus, you’re compressor volume isn’t massive – I suspect the pump will be running near continuously for any serious spraying rate to make it quicker than a brush (this may not be too much of an issue, again, as the area is reasonably small).

My dad has a very large 3-phase compressor at home and bought a creosote-spaying tool for it to do his fence and shed – used it once, but decided it was too much faff overall. Now either does it by brush or borrows a backpack/hand-pump jobs from a friendly neighbour.

A couple of birds leading to 1/2 the engines failing, you’ll prob be OK….. a whole flock leading to a complete loss of power, well, you know how gravity works….

Some great vids on youtube of brid strike simulation and sand and water ingestion tests…

BIKE (Bristol)

Currently strongly disagreeing with that statement <resists temptation to avoid the swear filter and post mini-rant-ette> 👿

My worry is that if the assistance is good for 15mph, a strong rider will be able to get it up to plus 30mph on the flat easy, and being a DH bike, 60mph downhill is quite possible.

I’ve wondered this as well – I guy I see on my commute has an electric-assist front wheel on an old Marin. He’s clearly got a bit a of fitness and will hapilly cruise along the flat at or above 25 mph, keeping pace with the mopeds/scooters.

EDIT: TJ – interesting….but surely it’s not beyond someone in possesion of a pair of pliers to simply wire a switch between the motor and battery and bypass the limtier, as my ‘friend’ above seems to have done.

That’s not really a ‘getting-from-A-to-B’ electric assist is it??? That’s ‘get-me-to-the-top-of-the-hill-again-while-I-have-a-puff-on-a-tab’ electric assist. Will it lead to range-anxiety for the all-mountain crowd…..? 😉

What would be an example of a business where higher turnover is good? i’m curious

Pretty much anything unskilled as far as can tell, where the available labour market is large – helps keep wage levels low. Used to work in a meat processing factory where conditions were generally poor, which meant staff turnover was high, but the availabilty of local labour meant there were always many people still applying for jobs where the wages were always actually and relatively low….. which in combination with the working conditions maintained high staff turnover.

In some industries high staff turnover is good, for some its bad….and it can be good/bad for the staff/business in each instance.

Whatever – by openly stating he wants more ‘churn’ is either an act of management genius, simply a little atagonistic or he’s a complete tool. I have an opinion on which of those three catageories he falls into 😉

But you do know, the faster you go, the greater your mass becomes

Indeed, so all is not lost then! 😆

Haven’t read up on this, but is c elastic, perhaps?

It’s all relative, innit….

I want them to solve the neutrino problem – been trying for years to ride as fast as the speed of light and a definitve answer would help me decide whether to carry on trying or give up and just eat more pies…….

Are we talking real made-from-wafers-of-actual-potato, or ‘potato based snack’? 😉

Depends what level of cover/assistance you want, but can you get something similar as part of your car insurance? No idea how good this will be, but I get offered it every year at renewal time and it seems ‘cheap’!

…IIRC, the CW article went on to say the initial fine is nothign like 1k – you would need to have gone to court to recieve that level, and then it would be at the top end of the scale.

Again, IIRC, the leaflets have been withdrawn as being mis-leading and are the handywork of one over-zealous local bobby.

Samsung 32″ Freeview HD thing here – bought last Xmas for about £400 (IIRC) from John Lewis. No Complaints, but equally not alot to compare it against. Have a compatible Samsung Blu-ray and a Humax HD PVR hung off it and I barely scratch the surface of all the ‘Smart-TV’ capabilities….. 😳

It seems like most beaches in Cornwall with a shop sell basic neoprene jobbies for the little’uns, as rocketman described. Bought one for ours when she was just ~2.5 for a bit under £20 last year. Just about grown out of it now, but wore it more than I expected. Obv, not “pro quality”, but then she’d only be in the water for an hour at a go at most, and it was thick enough that she could wander about the beach in it as well, staying relatively warm and not worry about falling in/getting clothes wet etc.

Powdercoat?

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/frame-mods-and-powdercoating-in-the-bristol-area

I’ve got a rectangular bear. It’s a polar bear after a coordinate transform.

I really shouldn’t have laughed, but I did…. 😳

Frankly, it affronts me that it’s just sitting there when it could be in my woodpile, but I really don’t want to get into legal trouble over a few logs.

It may not be just ‘discarded’, but part of the management scheme – dead wood is a very important part of the woodland eco-system. You may not get in to trouble carrying a few logs home by hand….. anything more than that will likely be problematic, depending on ownership/attitude of the land owner.

any thoughts?

Yep – if you’re fed up with rounding out hex bolts you’ll find small torx fixings and the driver bits even more fun!!

UPDATE: Turned the shed upside down last night, but can i find my spare sprocket – can I ****?!?!?!? Sorry 🙁