Despite what is being claimed, there is a lot of ill-informed, ignorant tosh like the above spouted by many “leave” enthusiasts.

A protest vote to spite yourself is ridiculous.

Or Was this the Boaty McBoatface referendum?

no, I posted before I’d finished typing!

woffle – Member
There’s doubtless a percentage but I think it’s ironically narrow minded to cast the voting majority as being in some way deficient in intelligence, reason or logic.

Ok, so why did they vote to leave then?

Wilful ignorance of the ‘facts’ and confirmation bias due to an emotionally reached decision based upon misleading information and long-held prejudice (not necessarily racial/national).

tpbiker – Member
OP..

I give you this

as an example of why at least a few of those ‘insults’ are probably quite accurate

people like this, who voted without any measure of common sense or comprehension of implications are going to make alot of peoples lives significantly harder…including their own and mine

Exactly.

Change!

It must be better, right?

kimbers – Member
Working in a cancer research lab, with UK (non commercial) science getting around 20% of its funding from the EU and working with a large number of Europeans, Im hearing a lot of the above

I think the problem is that its very very hard to see a rational explanation for voting leave, certainly from my perspective

This appears to be the case for most thinking/educated people.

There was no rational reason to vote leave.

Emotions will not buy a lot of food, though….

mefty – Member

Well it is extraordinary that people like yourself and Aristotle who obviously have such above average gifts were unable to persuade them of the merits of your arguments – maybe your arguments are not quite as strong as you think or maybe you didn’t even try.

It isn’t that extraordinary really.

Very few people want detailed facts or explanations, they want simple and quick “solutions” to their perceived problems and will seize upon the slightest justification for their quickly-formed views.

Populism appeals to simple emotions.

Fear works.

What is interesting is that fear of losing jobs/money -a typically pretty rational fear- seems to have been over-shadowed by fear of “foreigners” (immigration, EU laws etc.) and some very misleading numbers about relatively small EU contributions in this referendum.

How many of the population would have been interested in or cared about the EU investment in scientific research, for example?

ps. I did what I could and surprised myself by persuading a few undecided people to vote to Remain.

As an educated English man, interested in current affairs, with a rational outlook and of young(ish) years, I feel that my views and vote have been swamped by hordes of

elder generation ruining it for everyone else
stupid
racist
xenophobic
un-educated
ignorant masses
poor
lower class
daily mail readers
sun readers

(-I’m not sure about the Guardian readers)

spoiling my country and the rest of the EU for everybody else for the wrong reasons.

Markie – Member

Given the breakdown of the vote and the reaction to the result, that (with the exception of ****ts) seems to be a pretty reasonable list…

Yes, I’d say so too.

I must now declare my intolerance of wilful ignorance, British/English nationalism/jingoism, racial discrimination, scare-mongering, hypocrisy and prejudice.

Stupidity is slightly different, as the stupid may not be able to do anything about it.

It was only held to help Cameron win the last election because he was scared UKIP would mean a labour victory. There was never any principled reason for it. So we are now leaving the EU because Cameron wanted to be PM and win the last election.

Agreed. What an idiotic thing to have done.

woody74 – Member
The Remain campaign should have concentrated on publishing the benefits of the EU that effect people every day, cheap flights, mobile phone roaming, flight delay compensation, animal welfare, funding of mountain bike trails, consumer protection, toy safety, etc Without this all of these benefits will disappear

Sadly, it would have made very little difference.

Unfortunately, very few people take the time to come to a considered decision. Most people will quickly form an opinion (or had it drilled into them since birth) and will seize upon any perceived ‘justification’ for their opinion, ignoring/dismissing any evidence to the contrary.

Most people just coast through life without much deep thought about anything.

I would be truly amazed if more than a few percent of the Out vote actually understood the ramifications of their actions.

One of the (very few) out voters I know watched the TV debates, read the Express and went with “gut feeling”, rather than rational thought.

Typical of many of the older generation I believe.

maxtorque – Member

the BBC just interviewed a Welsh lady, who when asked “you voted out, which seems odd considering that Wales is net positive in terms of EU spending” and she replied “well, yeah, but we are FREE now arn’t we”. er, Free from what? People giving you money?

Sadly, stupidity or ignorance are no bar to having a vote.

Referenda are really not the way to run a country like ours.

Appealing to the base emotions of the masses is what captures the votes. Few people genuinely want or are able to consider the facts.

I suspect that we will actually stay as EU members in all but name …and influence. Paying similar amounts of money to that which we do now, like Norway.

The EU will continue to be blamed for everything “punishing us because we left” , even though we won’t actually have “left” in any real sense.

The people in other EU nations will still think that we are a bunch of free-loading, uncultured, thuggish oiks -as they always have done.

coppice – Member
The vote was close, surely the next step is a trip to Brussels and a discussion on what could be offered to help persuade the UK to stay followed by another referendum?

Or am I just being naive?

The ignorant masses still wouldn’t go for it, although enough might change to swing it.

This isn’t (likely) a loss for us on an economic front in the long term, it is a loss for progress, moderation, tolerance and cooperation.

Yes.

It is a loss.

ernie_lynch – Member
Well I’ve always said that if you can’t be honest when it comes to politics then change your politics.

I was referring to the problem with your eyes.

And what is that supposed to illustrate with regard to the UK and the EU?

ernie_lynch – Member

Don’t I just.

In fact I can sense my eyes swiveling as I type

Thanks for your honesty 😉

ernie_lynch – Member

Obviously I’m some sort of loony because I don’t support the noe-liberal agenda and therefore want to leave the EU.

Well you do appear to be a member of one of the groups referred to in my hypothesis

Perhaps UK courts could save both time and a small fortune by instead of requesting psychiatric reports simply asking the accused how they feel about the EU ?

We discussed something along these lines earlier today. As an idea it does have legs.

BoardinBob – Member

99% of people who I’ve heard or read opinions from are firmly in Remain

That depends upon who you read and socialise with.

People who have a hatred of the “neo-liberal agenda” dislike the EU intensely.

People who hate “socialists” dislike the EU intensely.

People who have a Nationalist bent dislike the EU intensely.

Racists dislike the EU.

The ignorant hate the EU because they don’t know what “intensely” means, that Nigel Farage fella likes a pint and he,
“tells it like it is”(n’t).

Normal people who don’t believe the EU to be perfect, but believe that it is better to be in the EU than out of it, and would prefer to maintain the status quo, rather than “take a punt” on leaving, for any of the reasons listed above, don’t dislike the EU intensely.

ernie_lynch – Member

Because of course anyone who doesn’t subscribe to the neo-liberal agenda of privatizing everything is some sort of loony.

I didn’t say that. Loonies of all persuasions seem to hate the EU.

The EU being just like the Soviet Union….

molgrips – Member
So the EU is both Marxist and neo-liberal, is it?

Hmm.

It’s the perfect bogeyman for all loonies.

scotroutes
Of course it could be that some folk actually know they are petty, small-minded, insular, backward looking, racist bell ends but don’t feel the need to advertise it

I don’t think that is feasible 😉

Whichever, they are suggesting that if there is a Remain win it will be “fixed”

If remain win, it will be a triumph of good sense over emotion, delusion, willful ignorance and prejudice.

If leave win, it will be a sad day as it will suggest that the majority of voters in the UK have a concerning world view.

binners – Member
Hora is already gone. I had enough of his half-baked, nonsensical drivel half way through last week

I don’t blame you.

binners – Member
I have to say that there have been few positives in this pretty hateful campaign (from both sides).

One thing though is that, due to the joys of social media, I now know for certain which of the people who I regarded as friends is actually a complete petty, small-minded, insular, backward looking, racist bell end.

I have been heartened by the fact that so many of my friends, relatives, colleagues, people I knew at university and at school have expressed sensible, rational, level-headed and pragmatic views in favour of the UK remaining a member of the EU.

Same here.

I wear John Lewis trousers for work, albeit in 34 rather than the 32 that my waist measures.

Otherwise, trousers from the USA seem to fit me better than British “modern fit”

-from what I can tell, the typical modern British man is expected to have no glutes or quads. Who decided this?

Have a shower beforehand.

Ride to work.

Get changed and use babywipes on strategic body locations.

Sorted.

I ride my Crosslight, currently fitted with 28mm Duranos (but previously fitted with 35mm Land Cruisers and 23mm slicks), to work on tarmac, a broken and potholed tarmac road and an un-metalled farm track.

Isn’t this just cycling?

This sort of does-it-all bike and riding them anywhere is what people in the olden days used and did.

There’s nothing new about it. Every so often marketeers recycle old ideas.

Different tools for different jobs.

Most of my riding is on a cyclocross bike currently set up as a road commuter, with tough slicks and used on road and local “gravel” -or “tracks” as we know them.

If I could have only one bike, it would be that one… But I can have more than one bike.

The cyclocross bike was harsh even on the relative smoothness of Llandegla Red/black.

I’m not sure of your priorities, but I have used Schwalbe Durano 28mm (the normal ones, not the extra puncture resistant) on my commuter since last Autumn. I regularly pull out shards of glass that have not penetrated the tube and ride along a stony track.

I was going to swap back to summer tyres, but there is no need.

They have 2700km on them and are still going strong.

Keep it simple and train to “be useful”

I actually prefer lifting things other than barbells and dumbells if I am not using just body weight. Uneven, shifting loads can provide the body with more of a challenge for a given motion.

Work at this and become a hike-a-bike in the mountains monster 😉

Kettlebell are good, but you need a selection of weights. Not cheap.

Of course, if you want to get good at lifting heavy barbells then you need to train with them. 5×5 etc. You will need bars, plates and racks though.

There is something to be said for practicing natural movement, although it doesn’t need a course to learn how to crawl, balance, climb, throw, carry etc.

You can do most of what you need without much/any special kit. Local playgrounds, benches and hand rails can be useful.

There are various types of:

Chinups,
pullups,
pressups,
dips (using a bench or between 2 chair backs)
bodyweight squats (2 leg or 1 leg)
abdominal exercises
etc, etc..

As others have said, strengthening the core/trunk is the most beneficial thing though
-everything hangs off it.

The above exercises will also work the core muscles if done properly.

For extra weight, sandbags are fantastic. 50Kg of sand costs about 6 quid from B&Q, and much more beneficial/awkward to pick up and move around than a 50Kg barbell.

The internet is full of ideas.

The main thing is to do the exercises regularly and stick at it.
I like to mix it up a bit.

Pilates is ok, but most classes are not hard, according to my wife
-I suspect that most people don’t want their exercise classes to be too difficult.

Thanks for the ideas.

The Giro Republic look great, but I would prefer Velcro or ratchet fasteners.

Shimano RT82 look very promising.

I currently use a pair of Pearl Izumi Xc shoes that I have had for years, but are now wearing out.

I thought that a pair of more Road orientated shoes without the hard plastic sole tread might be better.

I would use them for everything from commuting to TTs to centuries.

Thanks.

I wonder how many people DNF’d?