Jesus what the f*** are you like?

YES THERE WAS USER ERROR, I WASHED MY F*****G BIKE WITH F*****G WASHING UP LIQUID!

Here is how it went.

A couple of years ago, my headset stuck solid on a 2 year old Cannondale. I sent it to the bike shop, and got a new one put in. I couldn’t figure out what had gone wrong. I got the old bearings back from the shop, the top one was badly rusted.

Now, 2 months ago, the same things happens to the same bike. And you know what, that was right after I had run out of bike cleaner, and used washing up liquid for the 1st time in 2 years.

2 plus 2 = 4

If it works for you, f*****g fantastic, I am f*****g over the f*****g moon, but it f****d up my f*****g bike costing me over a hundred f*****g pounds. I f*****g know because it f*****g happened to me, so get the **** of my f*****g case and awa boil yer f*****g head ya wassock.

:-)

(all meant in good humour)

1. How much salt is in washing up liquid?

5%

2. What amount of salt is used in a standard bike washing dose?

Some grams (enough)

3. What concentration of salt is in the standard soapy water in bucket that people use?

Some grams (enough)

4. What concentration of salt remains after a cursory rinse?

Enough to rust headset bearings solid in a matter of days and cost £50 or more to replace.

5. What concentration of salt remains after a through rinse?

Enough to rust headset bearings solid in a matter of days and cost £50 or more to replace (once the saline soloution is in the bearings, it is hard to get out, especially if you don’t know it is there!).

6. How do the above concentrations compare with the salt concentration found on the bike after a winter road ride on gritted roads?

About the same, but that isn’t poured / scooshed / scrubbed onto the frame in the same way, and especially not down into the headset or in quantity onto the brakes.

7. What is the salt concentration of mud?

From 0.00001% to 100%, what mud?

——————–

Whatever way you look at it, my experience is that using washing up liquid has messed up my headset and my brakes (organic pads). If your experience is it works fine, then great, please be my guest and continue to use Fairy on your bike. There is room for both experiences.

I can only warn others regarding my experience.

I’ve got an old road bike in the workshop that’s been washed with washing up liquid regularly for the last 30 years or so
Hang on, I’ll just go check .

No, it’s not rusted away to nothing yet.
You had me worried then, I was expecting to open the garage door find nothing but a pile of dust

washing up liquid is crap for disc brakes as well, it messes up the pads / rotors surfaces and make them squeak / not work correctly.

this is bollards, sorry. I’ve used nothing but washing up liquid on my bikes since forever, and my brakes a re fine as are my rotors, nothing squeaks or leaks or anything…

It doesn’t matter, this isn’t something that can be resolved on the internets. You guys experience is obviously different to mine, and that is fine. My recent experience has pointed to washing up liquid screwing up my headset twice, and also messing up my disc breaks (maybe it is the pads? I dunno). Thinking about it for more than 0.005 seconds, it is not the right application for it (otherwise fairy would just squirt a bit into some water and sell it in bikeshops for £10 a litre), and I ain’t going to argue with anyone who thinks that salt water + bare steel is a good idea.

None of the products mentioned in this thread are going to do any harm whatsoever to your bike, unless you want to dip them in a tank of it for a few weeks

That is clearly not true.

Try this – add a tablespoon of salt to a bucket of water, and wash your bike with it. It will rust bearings etc if it gets into them, and rinsing doesn’t help much once it is in.

Also, washing up liquid is crap for disc brakes as well, it messes up the pads / rotors surfaces and make them squeak / not work correctly.

Why cheap out and use something inappropriate to save a few pennies on a thousand pound bike?

TBH, you are better washing with plain water than using washing up detergent. It gets the bike almost as clean, and is less likely to mess things up.

But – your money, your choice. Just remind me not to buy a used bike or car from you :-)

Fairy Liquid and other dish cleaners have quite a lot of common salt in them (approx 5%). They also have other stuff that will perish rubber. The combination means that salt water may get into your bearings and knacker them. I have knackered two headsets washing my bike in fairy, I’d never use the stuff again, not for bikes, not for cars.

I looked up the sunrise / set times for central Scotland:

Date Sunrise Sunset Length of day

22 Mar 2010 06:10 18:30 12h20m03s
21 Jun 2010 04:26 22:03 17h36m33s
20 Sep 2010 06:54 19:18 12h23m47s
21 Dec 2010 08:42 15:40 6h57m31s

27 Mar 2010 05:57 18:41 12h43m25s
hours shift because clocks change forward 1 hour
28 Mar 2010 06:55 19:43 12h48m05s

30 Oct 2010 08:15 17:37 9h22m03s
hours shift because clocks change backward 1 hour
31 Oct 2010 07:17 16:35 9h17m44s

It seems we should at least shift to summer time much earlier, like the end of February instead of the end of March.

TBH the whole clock shifting thing I find patronising and old fashioned. The clocks should stay one one time all year, and schools, business, and workers should shift their patterns to suit. Why do we need the government to tell us what time to start?

As has been said, farmers get up when it is light and stop working when it gets dark. They don’t need to be told.

Schools should shift their opening times if they think it will be an improvement.

Having everyone make their own minds up would mean less peak hour traffic.

We don’t all need to be on 9-5 year round.

I am lucky I can choose the hours I work so I can decide for myself what time I want to wake.

Maps!

Photies!

Vids!

Full on multimedia extravaganza!

Nice one :-)

househusband – a few folks whose names or STW monikers I never caught; chap on the white Cannondale hardtail

That’s me – names Nick…

GT is great. For somewhere that is free, and you can ride man made trails till your legs fall off, I don’t see what there is to diss. Sure, it is mega popular and people do hype it up, but if you just go and take responsibility for choosing the route _YOU_ want to ride, it has got to be a really jaded rider who cant have some big grins on it.

The climb from the bottom carpark I love now. The descent also (electric blue) is great fun at the end of a ride. Spooky wood is good. Freeride bit is fun. The Black is challenging in length and also in roughness in places. Extras and hidden bits are there for the taking.

Great ride coastkid!

Good to meet you all and what a cracking day as well as great guiding and cake :-)

Next – long hot bath!

Look into the Panasonic / Olympus Micro Four Thirds stuff – smaller lenses than the Sony and getting to be quite a well supported system, plus the Panny GH1 and upcoming GH2 double as very highly regarded video cameras as well (best out of all DSLR type cameras).

debaser – You are 1st passenger booked on the Surf Express leaving from corner of Easter Road and Harrismith Place at 10.15 tomorrow! Dinnae worry about petrol money…

Kit – If you can make it to Albion Road from Trinity, you are welcome as well.

Just turn up and I’ll spot you, Green Surf is parked on corner ready. If you need to contact me, I think CoastKid has my mobile number from a PM I sent him on MTBR.

Organization!

Ask yourself if it is worth a body cavity search?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_cavity_search

“Body cavity searches may also be conducted by the U.S. Customs and Border Protection when they suspect international travelers of hiding contraband – such as drugs – in their alimentary canal.”

I’m gonna drive out, so if anyone wants a lift from Easter Road end of E’burgh (room for 3) then let me know in this thread.

I believe there is software that will process footage and stabilize it.

Got mine yesterday. Was looking forward to it, was expecting something like NatGeo for Mountain Bikes, but it seems a bit vacant and contentless to me, the writing has left me cold so far, and certainly the photography is not really up to par. The cover is nice, but if the best photo they can pick out for a two page spread is some old fart in a stupid suit in front of a windmill, count me out!

Rule 1 – If you are banking on style over substance, make sure you have style.

I’m not sure the super-smooth eggshell nicely typeset stuff fits well with MTBs either.

Sorry to repeat myself, but:

The Panasonic GH1 and GH2 cameras are THE SLR type cameras to use for video.

They autofocus.

They have a liveview display (electronic viewfinder plus swivel LCD).

They provide top notch video capability.

http://vimeo.com/groups/gh1/videos

The new GH2 looks to be amazing:

The GH cameras are Micro Four Thirds, and so are smaller than standard DSLRs. I cycled round Morzine for a week this summer with one in the front pocket of my backpack.

Sounds good, hope to be there!

coastkid

organising an East Lothian ride out Sunday…all invited train times too,,,details here; cake run…

I may be up for this, take it the more the merrier?

Forget the Canons, the Panasonic GH1 and the brand new announced GH2 are *the* interchangeable lens still / video cameras for video. They produce better video and are much smaller than the Canons, and they are much more suited to video.

Who is selling them now? Halfords?

Littering is horrible and yes it annoys me and really upsets friends of mine.

Regarding the tubes, give them the benefit of the doubt and presume they just forgot to take the tube with them after they had changed it out.

Sell the torque wrenches and buy a new stem.

Tighten allen bolts up holding the short end of the allen key, long end in the bolt. It is very hard to overtighten doing this, and will get your bolts in the right ballpark tightness most of the time, maybe except for crank arms.

The skinnies are great and TBH I almost enjoy that section of climb the most out of everything at GT now – the steep rock step-up is a fave as well. Climbing up the last black skinny the first time I did it was a real buzz, I haven't managed to clear it again so far, and yes, falling off to the left is better :-)

Would be cool to have a continuation of that style of climb out of the Buzzards Nest and up – more features!

epicyclo – I do tend to bite when parts of the country from which my family were forcibly cleared is called wilderness though – it's depopulated, not wilderness, and removing the human traces is just finishing the job. I also don't see any advantage to a community from going from a self-sufficient crofting community to providing low paid servants for the tourism industry.

If the feudal system was still happening and your family were tending to your cows, I suspect you'd be complaining about being very low paid LITERAL servants for the cattle industry (without a choice in the matter). The past is not chocolate box perfect.

Also, I haven't a clue what all this has to to with the modern proliferation of cairns up hills, built by the 'tourist classes' you seem to so despise? Clearing piles of rocks built over 20 years by tourists is not 'finishing the job' the highland clearances started!

Please get off the soap box, and have a word with yourself – thanks.

epicyclo – rather than me continue with my side of the debate, I refer you to an already decided debate between knowledgeable parties where there was split opinion and an interesting swing pre and post debate – http://www.mcofs.org.uk/mag_sm24_page2.asp

Whatever happened to 'take photos, leave footprints'?

Why do people feel the need to start erecting things in the wilderness?

If you are walking in the mountains, you should be following a map and using a compass. Random piles of rocks are for muppets.

Don't change a bunch of things thinking you'll make the bike 'better', it's too late for that now anyway, you should do that before the longer ride so you can test things.

Keep the tyres / suspension / bars you know.

Time in the saddle is more important, but you need to do that for a good month I'd say. If you have been riding 16 miles twice a week, with some shorter rides as well, you should be ok. If you only ride once every other weekend, you'll probably get a sore arse.

Most import thing is proper padded lycra cycling shorts / undershorts. Next is a big bowl of porridge the morning of the ride. Next is plenty of water in a camelback for the ride, and energy food.

30 miles isn't too hard, just take it steady.

That is scary.

It's funny all the titanium mythology – bike for like and all that, but I have seen more cracked and broken titanium frame pics on the interwebs than carbon or steel or aluminium put together recently.

The fact is, titanium is not as strong as good steel. It's not indestructible, and it needs to be designed and welded properly to withstand some of the things MTBs get put through these days. For me, the jury is out.

Beckam's bling bike badly bereft of bloomin breaks.

In other news, Sinbad's slacks stolen by shady soccer star.

Ah, do we all have a downer on David because he's richer than us? Eh? Because he's become wealthy just from playing football while the rest of us have been slaving away for little reward? Because he's better looking than us, and gets women swooning over him while we struggle to get the woman in accounts to notice us? Shall we all slag him off and criticise him to make us feel better about our selves?

Diddums.

Time of the month? :-)

Almost as many recommendations as there are posts:

Lynskey Ridgeline LT
Brodie Ti Holeshot
Ragley Ti
Lynskey Ridgeline 29
Cotic Soda
Cove Hummer
Singular Pegasus
Van Nic Zion
Van Nic Mamtor
Whyte 19 ti
On One Ti 456
Genisis Altitude ti
Voodoo Djab

Do I get the feeling that they are much of a muchness? How can anyone possibly make an informed choice between all these bikes that basically look the same?

My road bike is 1×5 :-)

I have the grey / dark grey transition ones, I believe they have about the same light transmission.

They are too dark for night, and too dark when in dense woods and at dusk. They are OK for daytime and open woods.

I don't think you'll get any transition lens that will do bright sun to night, you'll need a clear or light tint for the night.

Great lenses BTW – the first day I had them on, I hit my wheel on a fence when carrying the bike at shoulder level, and the handlebar flew round and smacked the right eye HARD. The lens saved my eye / face from probably a painful injury, and there wasn't a scratch on the lens! One of the benefits of the transition stuff AFAIK is the tint layer is embedded in the lens, not just a layer on the surface, so doesn't get scratched up as easily.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/edinburgh_and_east/8100953.stm

When Lightning Strikes…

etc…

It seems to me that the headphones were not the root cause of this sad death, but were maybe symptomatic of the causes.

My reading of the situation is she was on her way to work along a route she had done hundreds of times before, and on the fateful day there was a large lorry across her route that she failed to see.

I venture that she was in 'airhead' mode. Now we can all do this, so 'there by the grace of god go I' and all that. It is being distracted, not being 'in the moment'. It happens to everybody to a greater or lesser degree. We switch into autopilot, whilst our thoughts are somewhere else entirely. It doesn't just happen to people on bikes, it happens all the time.

So, she is whizzing her way to work (must have been a good pace, maybe 25mph?) along a route she knows like the back of her hand, and there is 40 tonnes of metal in a place she wasn't expecting it. Maybe she was looking at the ground, or at a handsome bloke, or a bird in the sky – who knows, but she wasn't looking where she was going.

The headphones are not the root cause, but they most likely helped distract her mind and remove her from the moment.

I think adults should be able to do what they want regarding headphones and bikes, but I do believe it is bad practice, as headphones do severely isolate you from your immediate surroundings. Car stereos are somewhat different as the speakers are remote from your ears, and it is still possible to hear what is going on to a greater or lesser extent. Earphones are usually listed to much louder (too loud) and also cut off hearing other things. Combining that with being on a very exposed means of transport (bike) is always going to decrease our situational awareness to some greater or lesser degree, and expose you to greater probability of harm.

if you buy a bike because its perceived as cool you're on a slippery slope to douchebagness

latfh!

I love how people will post "Oh yeah, they use it in X environment, so it'll be fine", normally something not even vaguely comparable to bike handlebar use due to completely different environmental, service and inspection factors. Then a person who actually who knows about it is instantly dismissed as probably being 14, and even if he isn't, not an expert in handlebars

I love how people quote other unknown posters on other internet forums with dodgy sounding credentials that rubbish a technology that is proven usable within the parameters of realism and expectation for over a decade and manufactured by very reputable manufacturers and used by a large number of people without problem, and back that up with a massive warranty.

Yes if you are throwing yourself down mountains then sometimes sh*t will happen, but usually there are mitigating factors such as previous crashes etc.

Don't kid yourself that aluminium bars are in any way shape or form fail-safe for this role.

Tip I use – tighten up using the short end of the allen key, this makes it much harder to overtighten.

Also, I don't see the need to crank on the handlebars, I always am very gentle with everything to do with the handlebar (clamp, levers) and don't find it moves at all.

Do a search for Carbon bars on SDH – there's a recent thread on it with some input from an F1 Materials Technologist – if he says don't use carbon bars (and he does) I wouldn't. It's the wrong applications for the material and simply not worth the 50? gramme saving over a decent ali bar.

SDH = .southerndownhill.com? "You are not allowed to search for posts in this forum. Please login below or register an account with SDH."

What's the guys name? "F1 Materials Technologist", how much does he know about bike handlebars? Sounds like a 14 year old winding people up TBH.

Source http://www.source-hydration.co.uk/acatalog/Military_Series.html

I treat bladders pretty poorly – as in I leave the water in for ages.
Camelbacks mould up the quickest ime.

Any water left in an enclosed airless space will turn stagnant after a while.

Stagnant water can be dangerous for drinking because it provides a better incubator than running water for many kinds of bacteria and parasites. I think people have died of nasty stomach eating bacteria due to drinking out of stagnant bladders.

The Source bladder I use is good because I can open it right up and hang it up after I use it, which means air gets to the whole things, and the water can evaporate.

Worrying about what brand of bike is cool is seriously uncool.

Pigeon-holing brands and likening them to car brands is uncool.

Fixies and retro bikes look aestheticly pleasing because of the lack of cables (minimalistic), but if you can't ride it up a hill, or like to pose with it outside the local cafe, you are very uncool.

No branding is cool.

Old beater bikes are cool.

Being on a bike, cycling, and enjoying it is cool.