What geometry for bikepacking ?

Hi all,

I bought a Genesis Longitude 2016 a while ago. It’s been a good bike but the rigid steel frame weighs a ton and I find myself doing a lot more trail/bridleway riding now (still multi-day trips however).

This has led me to buying a new bike. I could put some shocks on the Longitude but honestly that would be pushing the weight to about 16kg!

I notice a lot of chat about ‘slack’ frames – would this make these sorts of bikes poor choices for multi-trip bikepacking gigs?

My LBS has a Whyte 901 going for under a grand which is a good price. The Whyte gets glowing reviews, has 130mm front sus and is nice and light at 12.6kg. The components look good for £999 (special price).

Would that be a good bike for bikepacking? Will any hardtail make a decent bikepacking rig? I intent to throw on a Jones bar and get lost in the Peaks/Pennines/Cairngorms for a few days/weeks… but also month long dirt-road adventures too.

I’ve also looked at;

One-One Firebrand Evo (£1300)
Sonder Broken Road (£2000)
Kona Big Honza (£1600)

Thanks for any advice in advance!

FM

Any bike will do really. I mainly use a Cotic Solaris but with carbon forks. I also have a Salsa Spearfish for quicker duties.

My wife has a Stooge which are quite popular with bikepackers.

Have a look for any images from the various JennRides and also the Welsh Ride Thing – you’ll see a wide range of bikes so pick something you like to ride.

Here’s some to have a look at http://www.bikepacking.com/bikes/bc-epic-1000-rigs-2018/

P.S. They are bikes not oil production platforms 😉

All,depends what kind of trails your bikepacking on.  I’ve got a longitude too, for me weight isn’t an issue and TBH a couple of kg here or there is irrelevant by the time your hauling all your bikepacking gear.  But as a rigid bike I’d only use it on trails that weren’t too rough or technical.

if I was doing bikepacking in say Cairngorms, I’d go with front suspension, rather than the Longitude.

personally I wouldn’t rule out adding a suspension fork to the Genesis. I doubt it will be anywhere near 16kg.   A fork is maybe 2 kg and maybe 1kg more than what you’ve got.

My Genesis is about 14.7kg I think 🙁

So when the shop/producer advertises ‘slack’ or ‘aggressive’ geometry as a selling point; does that mean it’s going to less comfortable or something over long distances?

whitestone; if we’re going to be pedants might I remind you of the many uses of the word 😀

noun.

apparatus, device, or piece of equipment designed for a particular purpose; a lighting rig

I used to do it on a production privee shan. So 160mm and 65 degree head angle hardtail but i didnt want to knacker it so bought genesis tarn 650b plus rigid for the job. It does great and the simplicity means i have to worry about less going wrong. Have a mate who does it on a bronson and other on full suss rigs as they only own 1 bike.

So when the shop/producer advertises ‘slack’ or ‘aggressive’ geometry as a selling point; does that mean it’s going to less comfortable or something over long distances?

No, but the ‘steering flop’ that a slacker bike has is exaggerated by adding weight to the bars and front end. That might be OK if bikepaking to you is on a FS bike in big country and only 3-4kg on the bike and the rest in a backpack, but for general bikepacking a more neutral geometry works well ime. The bike will be naturally stable when you add a load to it anyway and you simply can’t ride in the same ‘aggressive’ or active (hops and jumps etc) way as you can on an unloaded bike. Not unless you’re a rare kind of rider anyway.

So a more XC design, or a slack bike with a shorter rigid fork, might work well. Basic advice here generally though is use any bike that works for you unloaded, so go with the Whyte maybe. They make good bikes. Strap a 2l bottle of water to the bar and see how it rides if you want to simulate a bikepacking load affecting the steering.

I’ve also a fat bike at that weight – it’s fine. (Until I have to lift it over something!)

I really don’t think the geometry matters that much for bikepacking (within limits), some will be better for steeper stuff, some better for steadier long distance. You’ll probably alter the effective geometry more when you put the Jones Loops on, I have Loops on the Spearfish. It’s worth looking at the cable runs as the handlebar especially can foul them – it may not be fashionable but having longer runs than normal lets you arrange things better.

It’s called bikepacking not rigpacking 🙂

I’m in the one bike (well ok two) for everything camp, so my bikepacking bike is my trail bike is my (occasional) DH bike – a Cotic Rocket. But for me bikepacking is basically a trail ride with a snooze in the middle, so I’ll still be riding the same big pointy trails in the Peak / Lakes / Dales / whatever I would be normally, just more of ’em with stuff strapped to my bike. Big long gravelly stuff doesn’t *really* appeal (it might if I had more spare time, but I don’t) but even if it did I have an ‘Everything Else’ bike (a Pinnacle Arkose) which would be grand for that.

TLDR; the big, slack Rocket works fine for me, for what I ride.

I have a fs bike, (cube stereo) which is firmly in the xc geometry camp, ive loaded it with stuff for an overnighter and tbh it doesn’t feel that much different to ride.

weight won’t matter when you’re gonna strap 8kg of stuff to it.

Definitely consider putting a suspension fork on the longitude.

i also have a surly karate monkey which i use for the same  purpose, it’s fine.

i also have a charge filter cx bike, which i use for the same purpose, it’s ok, but a little flexy when loaded.

lightweight (bike) isn’t always the best way, not for bikepacking at least.

I’ve done overnighters on my 15kg Full Sus, hard work and overkill. Previously had a Marin Pine Mountain with rigid forks. Was also quite heavy. I’ve also done the gravel and fire road overnighters on a Trek Domane with 35mm tyres (about 9kgs). I have to admit everytime I went anywhere rocky on the Marin I always wanted front suspension.

I’m currently trying to decide about buying a Sonder Transmitter for bike-packing and general trail use. May even use it for the odd XC race. I’ve got the permission to buy a new hardtail – just can’t decide on whether I go full XC uber light or take the hit and go mid-weight and comfortable….decisions decisions.

Geometry wise, a lot of bikepacking I’ve done is sitting up and pedalling for long hours. I’d worry less about having a great descending bike. Something that you can pedal up hill comfortably on and is still good on the downhills, most of the bikes discussed here fit that bill.

FM I have both a whyte 905 (2014 model

pre plus tyres) and longitude (I think the same as yours with Alu fork).

i had the whyte first and got the Longitude for BP duties after initially using the Whyte.

They are very different bikes but I am not sure how much of this is down to Plus tyres on the longitude.  I bought the longitude because it was cheap, I wanted to try plus and wanted a dedicated BP bike.

the whyte was good for BP but I had to blow the forks up to very high pressure to compensate for the loaded bar bag and it still buzzed the front tyre on fast bumpy descents.  The longitude seems to just keep rolling along and I think is more comfortable over long days despite being rigid but it is heavy. I couldn’t see me using the whyte for BP duties again but given the choice I wouldnt take the longitude for a blast around the Swinley. I may change this decision after a week in Vosges Mountains if my arms hurt!

This year I’ve done a couple of ovenighters.

The Jen ride in the lakes on my geometron.

The south downs on my hardtail.

Previously I’ve done over nighters and two weeks on my cove Stiffe from 2001. The adventures were all ace. The bikes all took some getting used to with the added weight. After an hour or so they were all fine.

If you want a new bike, get a new bike!

If you want to have adventures persuade your boss to let you buy x weeks off work where x is how ever much the new bike would have been.

Both will probably be brilliant!

I’d love a Sonder from alp kit if I was buying a specific bike packing bike.

whitestone,

I’ve been looking at the Cotis SolarisMax – wow looks nice!! Another bike thrown into the mix to confuse things 🙂

… but it’s billed as a ‘do it all’ bike?

Hmm, buying a new bike is a nightmare!

I prefer the xc geometry of my Cube to the longer setup on my Bird Zero TR if carrying kit

I can’t comment on the later versions of the Solaris, mine’s the Mk1, but if they are still as good then it will be fine. I’ve done everything from long distance ITTs (YD300, HT550) to Alpine trails (badly) on mine. Next month I’ll be doing the 2200km French Divide on it. It’s sufficiently good that it scratches the N+1 itch as whenever I look at another bike I realise that 90% of the riding will be handled perfectly well by the Solaris.

Doing a 4 week trip on my Orange P7. Works great for me as an aggro hardtail so adding handlebar bag and seat post bag doesn’t appear to make much difference to the riding. Lots of FB groups on bikepacking to seek advice. That much choice now it’s hard work. Loads of blogs but just steer clear of brand ambassador ones as for me they all have an obvious bias. Mrs just got a Trek Pro Caliber 6 for the trip but as she’s a bit short it’s what fits and is available that decided the choice. Ride feel first then bags to fit. Not enough space for bikes that are one trick ponies.

Mrs also tried a Sonder and picked it up from Ambleside but had bent rear mech so gear shifting problems and rubbish tyres which they said should have been tubeless. Punctured twice and snapped my tyre levers getting tyres off only to be told we should have explained how to remove the tyres! Totally put her off which is a shame as I like some of their stuff.

Stooge is a cracking bike pointing downhill and loaded up!

Untitled by Richard Munro[/url], on Flickr

33902497_10156541995651474_3520956945936678912_n by Richard Munro[/url], on Flickr

Whatever geometry you want, as long as your hoses and cables are long enough to thread around your bar bag.