Home âș Forums âș Bike Forum âș WC DH coverage have we reached a consensus.? đ€
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WC DH coverage have we reached a consensus.? đ€
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iamtheresurrectionFull Member
I can only hear the love child of Borat and Gru (Despicable Me, for those without kids). On coke.
Itâs unbearable.
FunkyDuncFree MemberIâve been watching on Discovery + through Sky Q app. (comes free with Sky)
Its very clunky. It takes an age to find the mtb stuff in their menu system. The timings of finals were wrong so I went on at the time it suggested for the womens final to find it had already finished and the mens was starting.
Commentary is getting better, but they still are not as good as RW, and miss so much obvious stuff. They also appear to struggle to see when someone is riding fast or slow.
Camera angles were better at the last race, and I liked the interviews with riders whilst the event was live.
Overall not that much different than redbull, but that was free, and there is no shift in coverage to make me think its worth paying for.
scruffFree MemberAnyone know when or if Leogang DH is on Eurosport 1 or 2Â (via Virgin TV).
Leogang XC has been shown but not DH, Lenzerhide DH was shown a couple of days late.
muggomagicFull MemberThey also appear to struggle to see when someone is riding fast or slow.
TBF thatâs always been an issue, as most of itâs down to perception as theyâve no real way of knowing what is fast. How many times did Warner and Claudio think something was up with Ratboyâs bike or similar, only for him to be 3 seconds up at the next split? Or rider x is âflying through thereâ only for them to have lost loads of time.
Would be good if they could bring back some of the key section timing, the zone analysis and the virtual straights that red bull tv had as that gave the viewers and commentators some idea of where riders were faster. Discovery also really needs to do better with the feed to the commentators too, as we see a rider cross the line and show their placing and it seems like it takes a couple of seconds for the commentary team to react. Itâs very weird at times.
1weeksyFull MemberMe and the boy do laugh lots at âheâs so fast through thereâŠâ âheâs lost 3 secondsââŠ
:D
2chiefgrooveguruFull Memberâ TBF thatâs always been an issue, as most of itâs down to perception as theyâve no real way of knowing what is fast.â
I might not be good at riding a bike very fast but Iâm good at seeing if someone is riding fast â would they like to give me a job? Iâm good* at talking too⊠(âSHUT UP!!!!)
*excessive
I remember the early sectors of Gwin at Leogang with his snapped chain and Rob & Claudio were talking about how unlucky he was at that track and I was thinking âbut heâs not going any slower, I swear heâs on a good runâ. Cue much commentator screaming when the split showed!
Maybe they need a bass player or drummer in their commentary team? We (should) have good internal metronomes!
â Would be good if they could bring back some of the key section timing, the zone analysis and the virtual straightsâ
Hell yes! Why on earth is that missing?!
chestercopperpotFree MemberTBF thatâs always been an issue, as most of itâs down to perception as theyâve no real way of knowing what is fast
Itâs definitely an issue with time trial sports in general.
Then youâve got the thing where some riders look fast but donât post as good times as less exciting to watch riders.
Itâs why I like watching Jesse Melamed race. He always looks fast and most of the time delivers. In the womenâs Enduro Isabeau is dull as ditch water to watch but is always at the top or thereabouts, since Cecile retired! Marine Cabirou is good to watch in the womenâs DH, less so Rachel and Camille! Daprela is great to watch but often crashes or doesnât quite cut the mustard. Amaury always looks fast and backs it up. Riders like Loic and Gregg are pretty boring to watch IMO but often produce the goods, Gregg less so now-a-days.
BruceWeeFull MemberTBF thatâs always been an issue, as most of itâs down to perception as theyâve no real way of knowing what is fast
I always used to be able to tell that Sam Hill was going faster than everyone else back in the Freecaster days.
Saying that, I couldnât tell he was going slower than everyone else in the semi-finals although it turns out he was, unfortunately.
tomparkinFull MemberI think itâs just really hard to tell whether someone was going fast based on looks alone. Some riders ride like their hairâs on fire. Some ride like theyâre trundling to the shops. Both can be fast. Or slow.
Coverage generally I think is âokâ. I never would have paid a sub to start watching DH, but now Iâm hooked I will đ€Ł
(TBH I probably would have paid for RB if theyâd continued being the broadcaster for the World Cup but stopped being free-to-airâŠ)
There are definitely some shortcomings compared to RB. Other people have mentioned split analysis, the key section, and the virtual straight, all of which were genuinely insightful analytic tools during the race for me. I also feel in latter years RB were starting to pick up on some of the line analysis stuff people like Cathro were doing on YT and intergrating that into the live show which was great: I miss the lack of that too. I donât feel the on screen graphics are as good as RB: two races in and I still find them a bit confusing and hard to read, which isnât great.
So thereâs definitely room to improve and innovate, but itâs potentially all stuff which can be iterated on during the season. Hopefully there are people at ESO thinking about these sorts of things and working to make things better.
But on the other hand, I think some of the camerawork (different shots and angles, use of drones) has been an incremental improvement on last year, so thatâs positive.
Tech wise it pretty much works, and is broadly similar to RB for me. Website is a bit clunky and annoying. No app for GCN+ on Roku is a pain in the neck so I have to jump through some hoops to watch, but thatâs modern life for you đ€Šđ€·ââïž
Commentary does the job. I was worried it would be either massively annoying (c.f. Rampage commentary at times) or totally hapless (e.g. some previous BBC commentary on Worlds races) and itâs neither. Itâs not as good as Warner et al were, but that said itâs not fair to make that comparison at this point in the season. Iâll settle for âbroadly competent and not actively annoyingâ at the moment!
As ever, the actual star of the show, the racing, has been brilliant đ
FunkyDuncFree MemberThey also appear to struggle to see when someone is riding fast or slow.
I am no expert, but there are times when you can see someone has stalled in a corner, and then the time says they are 0.613 down or something, yet the commentary will still be â heâs getting faster with every turn, and the clock shows that he is upâ erm no it doesnât and that last corner was shit.
Same with the rider whoâs tyre came off the rim, you could clearly see it happen yet it took them a replay and some, to finally notice, and it was then major news
chiefgrooveguruFull MemberâI think itâs just really hard to tell whether someone was going fast based on looks alone.â
The main giveaways are stalls into or out of corners, or rock gardens, especially before flatter/rougher sections, and how well riders are back-siding landings for maximum forward propulsion.
Some riders looks wild, some riders looks smooth, but the above points reliably predict how fast someone is going.
Another thing you can spot is how balanced a rider looks â if they look out of shape then theyâre not doing a section as planned, and therefore are going slower than their best.
This is based on me watching most races on my phone â Iâd hope with a bigger screen youâd pick up even more!
chakapingFull MemberHopefully there are people at ESO thinking about these sorts of things and working to make things better
Iâd be fascinated to know whoâs calling the shots on the TV coverage.
ESO are clearly doing a decent job or running the races, whether or not you agree with the semis being introduced.
But do Ball, Cunningham & co get much of a say in (for example) the style and function of the graphics on screen? Or is that out of their hands and sits with Discovery?
I guess ESO have some influence, or we wouldnât have had that questionable decision on the lead commentator in the first place.
weeksyFull MemberThe funniest one in the commentary is quite close to me in some ways. Both races thereâs been comments from Rick about how Evie Richards is going so fast as sheâs been getting coaching from Tracey MoseleyâŠ.. Which she really really hasnât been :D :D
frogstompFull MemberI am no expert, but there are times when you can see someone has stalled in a corner, and then the time says they are 0.613 down or something, yet the commentary will still be â heâs getting faster with every turn, and the clock shows that he is upâ erm no it doesnât and that last corner was shit.
Same with the rider whoâs tyre came off the rim, you could clearly see it happen yet it took them a replay and some, to finally notice, and it was then major news
I presume they have different feeds and multiple screens to the final feed we see â e.g. a raw video screen and a live data screen. Would be easy enough to miss something on the former while scouring the data for insights..
tomparkinFull MemberThe main giveaways are stalls into or out of corners, or rock gardens, especially before flatter/rougher sections, and how well riders are back-siding landings for maximum forward propulsion.
Yes, I agree with all of that entirely â I was talking just in terms of style really. Even if two riders arenât making obvious mistakes, one person can look like theyâre totally pinning it but be quite slow, while another can look very calm and collected but be quick. Or vice versa.
Iâd be fascinated to know whoâs calling the shots on the TV coverage.
Aye. To be honest Iâve no idea â it would be interesting to know. I hope/assume whoever is putting it together is taking notes and looking to improve the coverage throughout the season but who knows.
ayjaydoubleyouFull MemberWishful thinking but Iâd love to see Cathro in the booth as the DH âexpertâ alongside Ric. (I dont get the Ric hate, but thats another conversation).
If he decides after the most recent injury to give up on the WC racing dream. I think he make top 60 once last year, and the best outcome from that was we got slightly better/extra Pinkbikeracing/inside the tape coverage.
Bart is a team manager and manages to combine that with commentary, Claudio pre-injury got to ride the course in practise for his previews.
simon_gFull MemberSome weird camera placements for Leogang â why was the only shot they had of this crucial corner a drone/wire/chairlift shot from way up high with a tree in the way? Loads of space to stick a camera on the inside.
Some of the woods shots could have been better too â they clearly picked a spot where they could catch them coming off the boardwalk then down and to the right but would have been much better at the bottom of that section roughly where the photographer was standing.
Hopefully theyâre getting a feel for what works, the drone shots on the motorway were great but I suspect very little along there made any difference to the result.
1zerocoolFull Member@Tomparkin â a good example of this was Rachelâs winning run vs the other women before her, they âlookedâ much faster as they were moving all over the bike, with lots of body language and the bike hitting the rough, etc whereas Rachel looked way smoother and slower and seemed less dynamic on the bike even though she was up at every split.
ayjaydoubleyouFull Memberwhy was the only shot they had of this crucial corner a drone/wire/chairlift shot from way up high with a tree in the way? Loads of space to stick a camera on the inside.
the speed they are going, that spot wouldnt get you much. you would be too close and panning too fast.
the outside of that corner though⊠about in the âgoldâ of goldstone on that screen shot, would have seen the entire corner.
that corner has had impact on quite a few of the last couple of races, and was the focus of Cathroâs analysis last year (and this year) so its not like they donât know about its issues if the powers that be had watched the last few years.
siscott85Free MemberTheyâre as much of a muchness I think, I get Disc+ with Sky and Iâve been using their app. Itâs terrible, but so was RBs.
As for the coverage⊠more cameras Iâd say, they seemed to cover all, if not most of Leogang, I didnât notice any massive leaps in time anyway. The picture quality seemed very good too.
Commentery, so-so in isolation, but I miss Warner. Theyâll find their feet, but Rik must have said âweâve been asked to mind our voicesâ about 20 times during Lenzerheide, I was hoping theyâd at least get a little excited before the end.
The format, I watched all of Lenzerheide, but but Semiâs & finals for Men and Women was hours and hours, for Leogang I just watched the finals.
transitionalorangeFree MemberBeen watching through discovery+ and itâs definitely a step back from Redbull the camera tracking/drones are just no where near as good. The lack of Warner in the commentary box is a huge loss and after watching Crankworx you can see how much better Redbull are at it all even without the revenue from the paywall!
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