rather than a stuck out tread.

someone used to make some..any idea’s

Marathon?

Avocet did one an age ago, I think. Also, Conti Town and Country?

Maxxis Hookworm were certainly an inverted pattern as well.

Nothing super gnar that I can think of, though.

i cant remember the name of them, iirc they weighed about 3 tons though. maybe late 90s?

Didn’t halo do some. Twinrail they were called.

the ones i remember were like a balloon tyre, with square block tread pattern.
EDIT: yep, halo twin rail are the ones i remember.

Maxxis Holy Roller?

the captain has it…avocet is the one i was thinking about.

thanks for all the other idea’s..i will have a look now.

Why?

No benefit whatsoever

Cars have that kind of tread to pump away water so they don’t aquaplane. You’d have to be doing 200mph to get a bike to aquaplane, so any tread on road tyres is purely cosmetic.

Why?

No benefit whatsoever

a. because i want to spaff some cash with a internet giant
b. because i want some.

Ben, I once sat down with my father (A pilot) and calculated the required speeds to get my bike tyres to aquaplane. Your numbers are pretty much what we came up with!

That aside, an inverted tread might make sense for a gravel bike. Run at the right pressure, it would be smooth on road, but still have something to get a little bite on linking/gravel/muddy sections.

Maxxis Hookworm?

Ben, I once sat down with my father (A pilot) and calculated the required speeds to get my bike tyres to aquaplane. Your numbers are pretty much what we came up with!

I don’t just make this stuff up off the top of my head, you know 😀

That’s something like a Marathon Mondial then

hookworms look like they could do.

You’d have to be doing 200mph

Nah, just a ton 🙂

Kenda K Rad.

DMR Moto RT’s had a similar composition. Worked ok on hardpack too!

BITD Avocet made an inverted tread tyre called the ‘Cross’, there was a Cross II, both had a Kevlar option.
http://www.avocet.com/tirepages/cross_2_specs.html

so any tread on road tyres is purely cosmetic.

Don’t the extra edges on a treaded tyre increase grip when cornering on slippery surfaces?

A bit like all the sipes cut into winter tyres

Avocet cross was an absolute pig. I used them for commuting for a year or two before I knew any better. Inverted tread makes for a really heavy slow tyre – think of all the extra rubber. But long wearing.

Marathon plus – so heavy and slow they reduce any risk of aquaplaning

Don’t the extra edges on a treaded tyre increase grip when cornering on slippery surfaces?

The best way I’ve seen it described is that tyres work by having a hard knobbly surface digging into a softer surface.

With road tyres, its the knobbly tarmac digging into the softer rubber of the tyre. With MTB tyres it’s the (relatively) hard knobbles digging into the soft surface.

On the road, gaps in the tread just mean gaps where the tarmac can’t grip the rubber. If it’s a slippery surface – a metal plate for example – a tread on the tyre doesn’t make the surface any rougher, it’s still the hard surface trying to grip to the rubber.

^+1

I always laugh when I see tread on road tyres.

We tried this for Polaris Mountain Marathons on the theory that you ride over 50% on tarmac and need a smooth, fast tyre that will still work off road. Spent ages finding a tyre and can’t remember now what we used but they were very sluggish because they were HEAVY thanks to all the rubber.

The best tyre I had was a 1.4″ commuter tyre called a Kona Crossroads, it was grey and had a central ridge, on which you rode on tarmac, with side grips for when you went off road. It was fast and light and I think I still have the pair hanging up, though they will have gone hard by now. Googling doesn’t find a picture.

CaptainFlashheart – Member
….That aside, an inverted tread might make sense for a gravel bike. Run at the right pressure, it would be smooth on road, but still have something to get a little bite on linking/gravel/muddy sections.

I use 2.35″ Schwalbe Big Apples for gravel. It comes down more to the pressure than the tread for this sort of use. The BA’s have an inverted tread, but I reckon it’s just cosmetic – there’s not much rubber there anyway.

Obviously mud requires a bit of care but that’s usually such a small portion of a ride that it’s better to use tyres that work for the majority of it.

I reckon most of the current gravel bikes have it wrong because they can’t fit full size 29er tyres. They’re still thinking roadie or cyclocross rather than dirt road cruising.

Here’s mine on a 80 mile loop in Ross-shire (near Loch Vaich)

tread patterns on road tires are for “marketing” i.e. to explain the ‘purpose’ of that tire to the consumer

you’ll see file patterns, sipes and some weird ‘alternate panel’ detailing on tires Continental 4 season

all of the grip comes from the quality of the rubber compound, with the suppleness of the casing combined with correct tire pressure, allowing the tire to readily deform as it encounters variations in the road surface

Specialized Hemisphere and Crossroads are tyres with a bit more ‘chunk’ to them.

I fitted some of the Hemisphere’s to my Wife’s bike. They roll really well, but have a decent amount of bite for gravelly surfaces when cornering.
I’m not sure they make a massive difference in real terms but they give my Wife a lot more confidence, which at the end of the day was why they were put on….

Esher Shore, there’s a recent post on Jan Heine’s blog where he questions all that and argues for fine herringbone treads. tbh as much as I respect the work they’ve done on some areas of bike performance I think it’s all getting a bit princess and the pea when you get into the tiny details of tread, going past scientifics and into simple feedback and confidence cycles, but he makes his points well as ever.
I’m not convinced either way, I’ll use the ‘too many variables’ get-out. Stability of a smooth rubber surface vs flex of any tread, vs the friction area of either, the variations in road/trail surface .. It’s all a bit complex and those debates are generally ‘won’ by those who make their points best – if there is a right in all that in the first place.

A vote for Marathon Mondials here, tough and a bit wooden but a really good all-roads tyre tread. Durable, smooth on road and suprisingly good off-road. Used the 47C version locally on all sorts of ground in winer or summer and they would be my choice for a big tour, no second thoughts.

epicyclo, your post reminded me I wanted to ask you about something but there’s no mail in your profile. james.olsen.remote at hotmail.co.uk if you have a mo.

As well as bikes not aquaplaning the other key point is that cars don’t tip over to corner and hence their tyres have a square profile.

Check out a motorbike tyres and they don’t look wildly different from the types you see on a (push) bike.

Aren’t all tyres inverted tread – you only ride on the rubber that touches the ground. Some tyres just have more gaps than others.

🙂

I use these all year round on and off road, they’re not much good in slippery mud so I try and avoid that.

What was the MTB tyre with inverted tread, I can remember how it looked in the magazines but never saw one in the wild.
Very squarish profile, instead side knobs there was a row of triangular(?) recesses.
Was it Club Roost or some other brand?

Holyroller, DMR Moto-R, etc, are all good for dirtjumping etc because they cause very little erosion, they’re also surprisingly grippy in anything short of mud. I used to run them on the back of most of my bikes over the summer.

Aren’t all tyres inverted tread – you only ride on the rubber that touches the ground. Some tyres just have more gaps than others.

Legally to pass whatever EU/BS/DoT standard it is tyres on cars and motorbikes have to have more tread than gaps (i.e an inverted tread). So if you look at a MX bike’s tyres they are very similar to the enduro version* except the tread looks like it’s been spaced out around the tyre more.

*you can race an enduro on MX tyres as long as it doesn’t go on any roads and the rules let you. You wouldn’t race MX on enduro tyres as they’re not as good off road.

thecaptain has it, Avocet Cross