If it wasn't for the Second World War….

How far would we have progressed in technology.

Say if hitler had been accidentally killed choking on a bratwurst long before getting into power and the Second World War had never happened.

Would we have put a man in space, have home computers and nuclear weapons now.

Plastic surgery would have been delayed in its development. Maybe other things would also have been delayed such as the things you suggest. But they would have happened by now I believe.

Perhaps the most obvious thing that would have been delayed would have been the second world war itself.

Our history of conflict as a species strongly suggests that, sadly, large scale conflicts are almost an innevitable feature of (anthropoligcal) evolution.

Perhaps the most obvious thing that would have been delayed would have been the second world war itself.

Our history of conflict as a species strongly suggests that, sadly, large scale conflicts are almost an innevitable feature of (anthropoligcal) evolution.

But maybe Germany and Europe would have worked towards the end of sanctions/reparations in a more peaceful way. WW2 only happened because we made Germany angry after WW1. If we’d sat down after WW1 and reached the same outcome as after WW2 then maybe things would have been different. Or another way, WW2 would have happened without Hitler and the far right, it just might have been a Communist Nationalist party instead, in which case a German-Russian alliance might have ended the West…………

Also (as mentioned in the time travel thread), the Haber Process, probably killed more people than any other WW2 development, but has probably kept more people alive than any other technical development apart from antibiotics?

Birth control pill might never have happened or been very delayed.

Atomic power development would’ve been much slower.

Jet engine as well.

Cost of WW2;

Money:

1 U.S. $3,582,143,803,399.78 in 2005.
2 Germany $2,857,311,186,289.56 in 2005.
3 Soviet Union $2,016,925,543,263.22 in 2005.
4 Britain $1,260,578,464,539.51 in 2005.
5 Italy $987,453,130,555.95 in 2005.
6 Japan $588,269,950,118.44 in 2005.

Total $1.075 trillion in 1945 would cost $11,292,682,078,166 in 2005

I can’t even understand that that last figure is $11 trillion? $11,000 trillion. Shitloads, anyway.

Deaths Allies 44 million, Axis 11 million, 55 million Total

With all that money and 55 million people still living to work on whatever their talents allowed them to I’m sure there would have been untold progress in areas we can’t even imagine.

wwaswas – Member

With all that money and 55 million people still living to work on whatever their talents allowed them to I’m sure there would have been untold progress in areas we can’t even imagine. Maybe – depends on the incentives in play. No large scale, multi-disciplinary science / engineering initiative in history ever saw more progress than the Manhattan project.
When we’re not trying to melt our fellow humans, things tend to progress at a more sedate pace.

The nuclear legacy of the Manhattan project is its own story, for better or worse, but just as a demonstration of human enterprise it was hugely influential on later technologies. Things like space exploration and the moon landing were built on this realisation.

With all that money and 55 million people still living to work on whatever their talents allowed them to I’m sure there would have been untold progress in areas we can’t even imagine.

But equally in a very brutal way, those working on the development of technologies weren’t allowed to join up, it wasn’t the brightest and best that were sent to the trenches. The domestic politics and economics of WW2 were a mix of communism and social cleansing.

When we’re not trying to melt our fellow humans, things tend to progress at a more sedate pace.

Yes, I’ve noticed that in the past 10 years with mobile device technology and social media ;)

It wasn’t the brightest and best that were sent to the trenches.

Look at the numbers, in virtually every combatant nation the civilian casualties exceeded the military ones.
(sorry for formatting)

Country Military Civilian Total

1 USSR 13,000,000 7,000,000 20,000,000
2 China 3,500,000 10,000,000 13,500,000
3 Germany 3,500,000 3,800,000 7,300,000
4 Poland 120,000 5,300,000 5,420,000
5 Japan 1,700,000 380,000 2,080,000
6 Yugoslavia 300,000 1,300,000 1,600,000
7 Romania 200,000 465,000 665,000
8 France 250,000 60,000 610,000
9 British E & C.W. 452,000 60,000 512,000
10 Italy 330,000 80,000 410,000
11 USA 407,318 No significant losses 407,318
12 Hungary 120,000 280,000 400,000
13 Czechoslovakia 10,000 330,000 340,000

Yes, I’ve noticed that in the past 10 years with mobile device technology and social media

And where would that be without Turing’s computers and microwave signals.

And Teenagers.

Haber Process, probably killed more people than any other WW2 development,

I thought the Haber process was WWI https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haber_process

As much as lots of lives would not have been lost through WW2, meaning more people would be around in future generations to potentially offset some of the technology boost that WW2 brought, could we have been up to a worldwide population approaching ~9 billion instead of the current ~7.6 billion?

A sad fact of reality is that past conflicts have effectively been humans’ version of rabbits Myxomatosis in helping to keep population growth in check to a certain extent.

Probably wouldn’t have been Israel………….

Well all the carved up and decided nations wouldn’t exist, Israel is a casing point ^^. So to the Baltics and the Eastern Baltics.. and India/Pakistan. China and Tibet maybe, Japan and the Far East and so on..

So maybe the conflicts that still linger may not have happened, think of all the hugging and acceptance of other races, creeds, religious and sexual persuasions.. Almost like an ideal nirvana…

Without the need for the Tizard Mission, Britain would have sat on all of these ideas without ever developing them . So Computers, Jets and Atomic energy would been delayed by generations

Without the huge debt burdens maybe the world would have advanced at a faster rate, with technology led by consumer demand….

Back to reality mankind would have found another excuse for a self destructive conflict

Much slower progress toward sexual and racial equality.

Well there doesn’t seem any curb of attitude to conflict and warmongering since WW2, theres still plenty of that despite the atrocities that occurred on all fronts of defence and attack. So clearly WW2 has taught mankind sweet bugger all and continues to enjoy its mutual assured destruction of itself by instigating Hunger and Disease and ignoring humans calls for help. populating the world with weapons so powerful the earth wouldn’t exist after the second launch, chemical weapons so clean and detect less that the slightest leak or attack would render a continent desolate for humans and animals alike, yet humans still produce and improve the destructive powers that these weapons can hold, build and develop.
WW2 taught us nothing more than the fact that you can drop bombs on innocent human beings and simply wipe them out and walk away from the suffering head held high without recrimination. This has been proven time and time again, despots still operate, governments are still corrupt establishments and the majority of humans care less about life and more about fear and death.

I propose that all WW2 did for humanity is find itself a weapon of threat and fear and then arm itself accordingly.

I also propose that all the technological advances would have happened at the same pace, or quicker, had WW2 not happened. When fear of war and threat is taken away its surprising what humans can achieve for the good of humanity and maybe humans would have shared collective information on Drugs to combat terrible diseases, eliminate hunger and take a look at how and why humans are here, implement cleaner fuel technology with less reliance of destructive methods to produce little for less, and reach some high perspective that allows education and information sharing as the end game.

WW2 taught us its ok the destroy humans, its ok that you populate fear and hate into each other, that industry is built out of fear and threat so you better arm yourselves for another fight. That raping the planet of its core raw materials is fine if its backed up with the strap line “We need more Bombs because those pesky XXXX others have them”

WW2 taught humanity to fear race, fear others belief systems, to kill them before they kill you, to place economic strangle holds on countries that don’t tow the westerns viewpoint and watch whilst desolate countries war monger amongst themselves whilst we continue to purchase raw materials from them for substance money at best..

Long post that, but hey.. wotevz.