ebike or not?

I do like this though @ 16.3kg carbon frame XT/SLX/Fox

bumped into a mate today in the local woods on his Trek Rail, he had ridden about 10 miles on road and boring tracks to get there so he could call in at a few pubs on the way home. he was quite happy to have a slower ride up the fire roads with me than he would of had on his own(or with other ebikes) and have a more sociable ride. he would have normally ridden up from the bottom of a couple of decents we did but as i had to push he just used walk mode.
normally if he knows he’s riding with us he’ll use his normal bike but the rides still work ok if he’s not. his main use for the ebike is going of for a bigger ride on his own.

2 other mates have just got one as well, both orbea’s, one a wild and one a rise, will be intersting to see how they compare although i think for my riding the wild would be better.

yep mail order will likely be a problem.

i really rate the Whyte but the Specialized has the best warranty and you will absolutely need it.

my mrs is on her second motor and one of my riding friends is up to their 6th!

Sounds great… And when the motor packs up outside of warranty?

I have one, had it 4 years.
I’ve lost weight since I’ve had it, (by dieting)
It lets me get out more, by making riding possible for me (**** leg)
I was quick when i was younger, but definitely a pootler now.
If i had the choice, it would be normal bike every time, ebikes don’t ride the same.
I’m in the ‘fast riders are fast everywhere’ camp, it doesn’t matter what bike they’re on.
+1 for only buy from an lbs

My 2.5 year old Levo is nothing like this – it seamlessly fades out the assistance as you approach the limiter and above that speed it goes faster than my previous full-sus (which was 27.5 not 29). I commute on it as well as MTBing (over half my inbound commute is off-road) – nowadays I leave the motor off except for the more significant uphills, mostly to reduce cassette wear.

So I guess it depends on how the motor system is executed.

same with the bosch motor that the poster has in his whyte – there is no drag from the motor after the speed limit cut out, any drag you feel is down to the weight of the bike, tyres etc etc.

I think when people complain that it feels like riding with the brakes on after the motor cuts out its because an ebike enables you to ride in far too high a gear when the motor is assisting (in combination with people using massive heavy draggy tyres on an ebike that they wouldnt on their normal bike)because the motor is compensating for the gear being too high , but as soon as the motor switches off you realise youre in way too high a gear because you cant pedal it. If you deliberately keep the cadence high/gear low you dont notice the cut out nearly as much.

That – or just remove the speed limit cut out ;-)

Didn’t get along with ebike personally, didnt ride how I want a bike to ride, I’m a pump and pull everything in sight ex bmxer.

Agree with the ratio above some stated that it worked out you were about a 1/3 quicker, or got a 1/3 more in the same amount of time before battery went dead.

Didn’t find it an equaliser on ebike group rides, the fast people were still waiting for the slow people with the same amount of faff.

The people I know who it really works for are those who were overbiked and not that fit, there’s a lot of flattish xc stuff on my doorstep, swinley, tunnel hill etc, they’d be blowing after not much riding at a pace great enough to make it fun, now have ebikes and love it. From this I’d say there’s a definite tipping point where if your level fitness isn’t quite high enough, I can see why an ebike would make it way more fun.

if you are a fast rider you will hate it, if you are a slow rider you will love it.

I don’t think it’s quite that simple. I am /was / will be again someone who’s an experienced, pretty rapid, very fit Peak-based trail rider mostly, but has been wiped out by 15 months of long covid. At the start of this year, I could manage to walk round a football pitch, no more. Anyway, on the mend and a mate has incredibly kindly loaned me a 2017 Turbo Levo. I’ve never been interested in e-bikes, partly because part of cycling for me is the pure effort and joy of pushing your body and feeling it working. I love technical climbs as much as technical downhills and singletrack. So I guess I’m a bit of a reluctant e-biker.

For me right now it’s absolutely brilliant, but a little like riding with metaphorical ear muffs on. It’s fantastic being able to get to places I haven’t seen for over a year, a hige morale booster and mood lifter and has helped me start to reverse 15 months of deconditioning.

But… it’s not mountain biking as I enjoy it. Once you’re over the novelty of being whisked up hills, it’s all a bit meh, unless your main priority is saving time on rides, which for me it isn’t. I find the handling of a 50lb bike means agility is a distant country and things like popping up the front wheel onto a step, for example, require far more effort and weight shift. It’s so heavy that the suspension seems almost an irrelevance – it’ll just bulldoze straight through and over most things. It’s ‘fun’, but it’s not ‘my fun’, if that makes sense.

I hate the speed limiter on flat linking sections, I miss sprinty, explosive bursts out of corners and lips, I miss the purity of technical climbing where the assistance of the motor sort of complicates and muffles things, even if it’s impressive.

I don’t ride bikes to be fit or get fit, I ride bikes because I love riding bikes and the fitness is part of it and a consequence of that. I also absolutely get that everyone is wired differently and for a lot of riders, they’re brilliant.

1. If you’re not going uphill then the weight is irrelevant.

I know you’re talking mostly about pedalling effort, but the weight defines these things. I reckon something like a Levo SL would be more fun for me, but I hate the impact the sheer mass of the thing has on handling and feel, even the way it handles bumps.

Anyway… that’s just me. For me now, it’s brilliant, but I can’t imagine ever wanting to own one long term though. It’s crap for social riding unless you potter about in ‘eco’, in which case the weight is even more intrusive too.

Personally I’d see if I could borrow or rent one for a weekend. Enough time to get beyond the novelty and work out whether you’d really want one long terms.

Oh, also they’re a pig to lift over stiles.

“ I know you’re talking mostly about pedalling effort, but the weight defines these things.”

Absolutely, it’s a key part of the feel.

I actually prefer the feel of a full-sus ebike to a normal one – the suspension works better, it’s more calm and stable without needing to be immensely long and slack. My normal bike is a low slack 150mm hardtail and I really like that too. I can’t see myself getting another full-sus without a motor but also I can’t see myself not having a gnarly hardtail (and I wouldn’t want the weight of a motor & battery on that).

Sounds great… And when the motor packs up outside of warranty?

I worried about this with my borrowed Spesh, but there is at least once company out there who will rebuild the Brose motor that Specialized uses, but generally the prospect of a blown motor – and it does seem to go with the territory – would concern me as a longterm owner.

They are just fun, full stop. Remember that climb at the end of the day that you dread? Not any more, you don’t. You can still get a workout if you want – I reckon that Eco mode on my Focus feels roughly the same (OK, a bit easier) than pedalling my very light Intense Primer. I can’t see me using the Intense again, sadly.
The Focus is a 2021 Jam2 6.9. It is fantastic.

Love mine, had a brilliant 3 day weekend riding that would never have happened on manual bike, and would simply recommend the OP hires one for day/weekend and test it out for themselves.
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Was a C-Y-B at the weekend and your no longer hearing “cheat” being muttered as you ride past ppl walking up the trails, it’s “why did I buy this (manual) bike and not an e-bike…”.

Tried keeping up with ebikes on a proper bike, it wasn’t fun, heart rate not dropping below 160bpm on a 5 hour ride ruined me.

Bought a Scott Ransom 910, its annoyingly good, adds 50% more elevation gain on any ride and you dont have to pay any attention to avoiding shitty climbs.

Going downhill, they are great on wide open trails, but tight nadgery stuff, they feel quite ponderous. Geometry between the Scott and my G1 is pretty similar, so its a fair comparison, same tyres on both.

Just need the other half to get one now!

Think I will take the normal bike out tonight, and leave the ebike at home. Havent been on the normal bike for 9 months, but I need to see how much fitness has been lost – if any.

I dont expect to enjoy it as much….

Remember that climb at the end of the day that you dread?

Speak for yourself, I quite like that climb.

To the OP – forgive me if I missed it, but you didn’t say why you were drawn to eebs?

I’d suggest sticking on a normal bike if your friends are all doing the same and if you don’t have a problem fitness-wise.

I’d have one myself as an additional bike, but not as my only one (none of my pals have them either).

I think it depends on the kind of rider you are and where you get satisfaction from riding. I also think it depends on the group you ride with.
On the latter point, I’d not want to be on the person on an eBike when the rest were on normal bikes.The opposite is also true. If you want to stay with a group you all need to be on the same.
Re. the riding. I get it if you feel like climbs are a chore that just get you to the next bit of downhill. Personally, I almost prefer a good climb to a downhill, and a big part of that is the effort you put in, so they’re not for me.

Personally? No, I rather think they are the antithesis of everything that I enjoy about cycling. But plenty of people seem to enjoy them.

It’s interesting how these threads have changed over the years though. It used to be the case that all the owners only had positive things to say. Now we are getting more balanced opinions. But you still need to think carefully about where, what and why you ride to decide if they will actually be a benefit to you.

I have thought about them (and ridden a few) but even the things that sound like advantages to me are actually rather debatable. Yes, I could ride up some trails (or even virgin hillside) that I can’t get up on my regular bikes, which sounds like fun. But should I be doing that? Yes, I could get further into the remoter parts of the mountains in the same time, which is attractive to me. But then I’m just further from help when it breaks or I crash.

I was thinking of this point the other day as I got my second Covid jab. I was chatting bikes with the volunteer who was giving the injections and she mentioned that she was picking up a new ebike in a couple of weeks. She’d hired one (in Aviemore I think) and loved he fact that it allowed her to get so much deeper into the hills. I did find myself wondering whether she might be in danger of getting herself into situations that she didn’t have the skills to get out of. But that’s a rather elitist attitude and could probably be applied to me as well. So I just said that I hoped she enjoyed it and maybe I’d see her out in the hills one day.

I’ve got two ebikes – a Lapierre Overvolt 700HT, and my new Liv Intrigue E+1.

For me, they’ve been a godsend. My knees have been shot since my early teens, and I’d really have to watch how much I rode, be wary of hitting too many hills, etc, because otherwise my knees would be swollen for days.

Now I can ride every other day, and I’m burning more calories even on the same sorts of rides – presumably because I can pedal uphill and only strain my muscles, not my joints. Before I’d have to sit in the granniest of granny rings and gently and slow spin up.

The tech seems to have come along a lot – my new bike’s motor is a lot smoother, and the battery lasts for a good while – I can do 25-35 miles of trail centre riding and still have 40% battery. That said, the old Overvolt is still going strong with no issues – it’s done nearly 2000 miles and I’m terrible at maintaining my bikes. The wheels and fork are a bit knackered (because of poor maintenance),but the motor and battery seem fine.

They are just fun

Bingo, the F word! :P

Strange thread. I woulda thought if you’re in the market for a new bike and have the money, you’d know if you want an ebike or a mountain bike. 2 completely different things in my view.

Some of the replies to this thread seem to ignore the F word and seem more concerned with fitness and ‘achievement’. Smacks of lycra and shaved legs to me …… ;-)

Kayak has it for me.

I have a Decoy 29 and the geometry isn’t dated – although it isn’t as progressive as some bikes. It’s a good all-rounder, with sensible proportions and angles.

I went for a Decoy 29, as its really needed to fill the trailbike role – rather than an enduro bike.

I still would prefer to ride a normal rather than ebike, but it’s just not possible. I have a lot more affection for my Transition Patrol and Stanton Switchback, although I’m grateful that I can still get out.

Some of the replies to this thread seem to ignore the F word and seem more concerned with fitness and ‘achievement’. Smacks of lycra and shaved legs to me …… 😉

This is a forum for dirt roadies though. Fun is for kids and skids are illegal.

If your riding pals are on non e bikes and you do not struggle to keep up its a dick move to get one for rides with them. However winch and plummett riding seems to be what suits them best

Winch and plummet and days in the hills too, a few mates regularly hammer the ochils on them, horrible long grassy climbs on a peasant bike.

Thank you all for the great response! Some very varied opinions there, definitely some food for thought.

I’d love to quote a couple of posts with a direct reply but I can’t for life of me figure it out on my phone.

It was mentioned why’d I’d had my head turned towards an ebike… simply because it seems they are everywhere! Am I missing out begins to linger in my mind. Should I get one to squeeze in those extra runs on the solo days? For example, Cannock, I’m not riding the main loops, I’m pushing up the side of those illustrious jump lines that apparently don’t exist or stile cop. I’m certainly not in it for the fitness, I’m a DH rider at heart that can’t warrant a DH bike as they’re impossible to pedal on anything that isn’t pointing down.

I’m in it for the fun, not the KOM, sorry Strava!

I’d love to demo one but they are rather hard to come by at the moment. I’d seriously consider one if I knew the weight wouldn’t comprise the fun on the way back down. I’m aware they are very different to an acoustic bike, but the riding they’d do is the same. Fast down, slow up. It’s why I have only really considered those two big hitting ebike and not the 29er or more trail oriented ones. Sadly I don’t have 12.5k for that new Specialized SL 😩

DH and Enduro, i prefer the ebike, more runs either way, if i’m with folk not on ebikes i get there a bit earlier, do a few practice runs and get the battery down a bar or two, you learn to know what you need for a day out like that, then days when i ride alone i just hunt and play.

You will learn what runs you enjoy and what you don’t due to things that normal does better than the ebike, but again, if you’re like me, that’s the ones you practice a bit more to get better.

As stated earlier, ebikes just make flow stuff faster and a little more fun, as well as dangerous as the worst falls i’ve had are due to sailing over the landings on tables/gaps, weaknesses for me personally are tight techy stuff, where i just can’t get the back end to float like on the normal bike, that’s the skills i need to learn and you’ll be the same, so don’t look at it as better or worse, focus on what you enjoy, then improve on what you feel needs it.

Whatever you decide op have a normal bike as backup. Motor had just gone on mine, out of warranty – £900 to fix and lucky to get a replacement. Ebikes are great when they work. Useless lumps that are impossible to fix when the battery or motor goes.

Random +ve’s and -ve’s i’ve thought of since owning one for 3 months as a previously fit-ish but time poor 42 year old with kids
+ great fun for quick solo blasts on techy stuff
+ great for self uplift stuff
– boring on XC stuff, I’d rather be on a normal bike
– on tight stuff the weight is definitely noticeable, feels slower
– switched off motor drag is minimal, and whilst they aren’t much slower they are not fun to ride IMO, you can tell it’s a 50lb bike. like a loaded touring bike.
+ good for losing weight. Even if you’ve got no energy and you can still ride and get *some* exercise.
– bad for fitness. I’ve noticed a drop in my fitness since owning one.
– not much fun riding with non ebikers IMO
– 15mph limit is irritating. Easy to hit it, then it’s an unassisted 50lb bike.
+ great for carrying or pulling children
+ good for lending to your OH and getting them into MTB’ing…
– …then you need to buy another ebike
– everything on your bike obviously wears out noticeable quicker, and at the moment, everything is out of stock

But still the biggest drawbacks are
– cost
– lack of serviceability of motor (Shimano are terrible for this)

“ – boring on XC stuff, I’d rather be on a normal bike
– on tight stuff the weight is definitely noticeable, feels slower
– switched off motor drag is minimal, and whilst they aren’t much slower they are not fun to ride IMO, you can tell it’s a 50lb bike. like a loaded touring bike.
– bad for fitness. I’ve noticed a drop in my fitness since owning one.
– not much fun riding with non ebikers IMO
– 15mph limit is irritating. Easy to hit it, then it’s an unassisted 50lb bike.”

I think I might have to write an article on “how to use your ebike so you like it loads and still like your other MTBs”. Judging by the number of comments like this there’s a world of riders who haven’t sussed out how to embrace an eMTB for what it really is.

Just ridden my first ebikes, hiring at trail centres.

I don’t think I’d enjoy an ebike back home in the Chilterns with short ups and downs. I like to feel I’ve earned the descents and with the short climbs I don’t think the ebike would give me that feel. Also, lifting a fully featured ebike over the numerous styles would be a PITA.

But, after a day at Glentress, an ebike tranformed the trails as I could zoom up and enjoy the relatively longer downs. The extra weight wasn’t that noticeable, although in two runs I still wasn’t happy with it landing jumps, but sure that would come with more attempts.

None of my friends have ebikes (yet) and I feel no compulsion to go out and buy one for my local riding. However, on a visit to more vertiginous trail centres, I’d defintiely look at hiring an ebike, even if I had my normal bike with me.

Normal bike = human being trading effort for gain in a win, win scenario. Ebike = fat **** buys the illusion of fitness but should probably spend their money elsewhere and stop lying to themselves

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Normal bike = human being trading effort for gain in a win, win scenario. Ebike = fat **** buys the illusion of fitness but should probably spend their money elsewhere and stop lying to themselves

Particularly lovely position to take….

Ebikes are particularly dreadful to transport. Great if you have a van, not so great in or on roof of car.

Normal bike = human being trading effort for gain in a win, win scenario. Ebike = fat **** buys the illusion of fitness but should probably spend their money elsewhere and stop lying to themselves

there’s are some funny views out there regarding ebikes – reading the pinkbikes comments page whenever there is a review of an ebike is an ‘enlightening’ experience.

I dont really understand the hate for them.

My average heart from yesterday’s ride was 150, max of 180 – both exactly two beats lower than when I rode the same spot a week ago unassisted.

In 90 minutes I did 2,300 get of climbing and 15 miles, versus 1,400ft and 11 miles.

I’m faster on every section, surprisingly, on the ebike – including the tight, nadgery sections through the off piste in the woods. Based on segment leaderboards, the fastest riders in the woods are on unassisted bikes – although not much in it.

My tuppence?

I’m in the ‘planning on using it to get fit again’ category. A year of cancer treatment has left me knackered and unfit. As a treat to myself for getting rid of Trevor the tumour, I’ve bought a Spesh Turbo Levo. In my head, the idea is that I’ll be able to gently work up my fitness again on local trails, maybe even in the company of my mates but Once fit again, I plan to swap back to my main bike, an Orange 4, for local trails when riding in company.

The best trails in my area though, are around Stirling, about 10-12 miles away from where I live. I don’t drive because of an issue with my type 1 diabetes called Low Hypo Awareness. So for the past 20 or more years, when riding Stirling trails with mates, I would have to pedal 45-50 minutes to the meeting point, hook up with everyone as they got out of their cars, chase after them as we climbed the trails, then struggle on the descents because I was so knackered. Once back at the meeting point. I’d then have to watch as everyone packed their bikes away and drove off, leaving me to drag my ass all the way back home in all weathers.

I very rarely do these sort of rides anymore as I just don’t have the enthusiasm for it, however, I’m hoping that the Levo will change that. If I can get a wee eco assist on the way into Stirling, and crucially, on the way home, I’d be more willing to head over to these trails again, widening my range and catching up with folk that I haven’t ridden with for a good few years. I’m actually hoping it’ll get me back into riding with the local mountain biking community rather than driving them off!

Another three weeks and the surgeon says I should have healed enough to start getting back out on a bike again. Till then, Lemmy the Levo is sitting in the garage untouched since he was unpacked by my mate two weeks ago, still with some of the new bike stickers needing peeled off (I can’t bend low enough yet). Can’t wait to get out and ride again!

I dont really understand the hate for them.

Some people just have to hate stuff they don’t agree with I suppose. An eBike is the opposite of what I enjoy from a bike but I don’t care if anyone else rides one just as I don’t care if a person rides a £10K race bike and another person rides a rusty old chopper.

Different sports frankly

Round here (Surrey Hills) There is a whole new breed of different looking people on ebikes.
They don’t look like mountain bikers to me in the traditional sense!

They don’t look like mountain bikers to me in the traditional sense!

You mean they look happy and smiley, chatting to their mates as they cruise up for another run, rather than looking tired and miserable as they slowly grind uphill?

Normal bike = human being trading effort for gain in a win, win scenario. Ebike = fat **** buys the illusion of fitness but should probably spend their money elsewhere and stop lying to themselves

Yep, exactly that. I’m going to go for a lunchtime blat on my normal bike today, do some offensive climbs in a short space of time and ride as many trails as possible before getting back for work.

Then later this afternoon, i’m going to go out on my eeb for a ride with friends, all on eebs & smash a load of trails before the rain comes in. Obviously in those few hours inbetween, i’m going eat lard so I am obese & pretend i’m not actually very fit so I fit in the stereotypical ebiker box.

Should probably add i’m going to ride up all the climbs in turbo, punt all the pesky normal bikers out of the way into the bushes whilst claiming they are too poor to own an ebike, then wobble/walk my way back down anything remotely technical, whilst eating a pie. :)

I avoided them as long as possible, knowing I’d probably want one. Demo’d a few, wanted one immediately.

We live quite a distance from any decent trails, so always want max fun when I’m out. Just ride my road bike locally, which I think compliments the ebike really well.

Max heart rate on Saturday around Cannock was 145, over 24 miles. Similar to what I’d get on my normal bike I think, you just don’t feel it as much. I’m maxed when I’m hammering down descents, the uphills are over too quick to really drag the figure down. Part of the selling point was the ability to do more scary stuff in a ride, while not totally out of breath, to get my confidence/skill up a bit.

On the OP note about pondering MX bikes, I picked up a 2021 Vitus ESommet and I’m loving it. Really good combination of confidence on the front and the bike feeling pretty eager to take off.