ebike or not?

Afternoon all,

So as the post topic suggests, ebike or not? I will be in the market for a new bike imminently and to date, I have been eyeing up a Santa Cruz Nomad, the new MX Bronson or MX Capra.

However I have kept finding myself looking at the YT Decoy core MX & Canyon Torque ON. The bigger hitting ebike.

Most of my riding is push up/uplift centres, FOD, BPW… you know the ones. However, locally I’m bound to Cannock so pedalling isn’t completely off the cards and I occasionally go to the peaks. Im keen on getting my wheels off the ground & I’m keen to start throwing the bike around a bit more. Cheeky turn bar is about as stylish as it gets at the moment! The chaps I ride with are on ‘acoustic’ bikes and won’t be changing anytime soon.

So, will I regret turning my back on a playful park bike in favour of a emtb?

My biggest concerns, will the weight make it a chore to move and jump? will it be bore at uplift centres? Finally, if I find myself on a push up, can it be pushed easily so I’m not unsociable ditching the lads whilst they walk.

If I could grab your opinions please that would be ace. Thank you!

There will be plenty of folk who will be along in a minute to disagree, but I’ve just sold my ebike (that I had and rode regularly for 5 years) as I prefer my (much) lighter normal bikes on the fun stuff, to the point I’m willing to suffer on the ups. There may be some geo reasons for that too that a more modern machine will take care of, so worth trying some. YMMV.

How about a light eBike like a Kenevo SL or the Forestal Siryon (if it ever appears…)

owned an ebike for about 3 months but decided it was detrimental to my fitness and all that travel and super chunky tyres that the motor drags around just dumb the trails down too much.
if i only rode DH tracks then they are great, i did endless runs at Rogate whilst everyone else was pushing.
i found on normal trails the ebike just held me back and was slower than my regular bike on anything that didnt go uphill as the speed limiter kicks in and it isnt worth the effort to try and pedal a 50lb bike any faster.
my mrs has one and loves it though, but without it she wouldnt be able to do the usual 30-40k surrey rides.

I’ve had mine for about 3 months now.

In a lot of ways it’s amazing, but in some ways not so much.

The actual amount of trails I can do has increased significantly obviously. The bike (Orbea Wild fs) is an absolute weapon of a bike, so capable and brilliant.

Ebikes are fantastic for most jumping. The weight actually really helps. Where they’re not good is if its jumps you need to pedal at faster than 15.

It becomes quite difficult to ride with folks not on Ebikes which is really a massive shame. You’ll get cold and bored waiting and feel like you’re not getting a workout while they are at full tilt.

They can in my experience ruin the feel of your previously loved non eebs, as getting back on them feels like they’ve got the brakes locked.

Recently I’ve been riding mine in only the lowest setting on some of the ride which makes the transition back less noticeable.

They’re fantastic for shuttling downhill runs and you’ll easily be doing 3 times the ascent of an mtb.

For me, in a weird way that I can’t explain, this isn’t an entirely good thing.
I don’t really like repetitive riding I guess, like doing the same handful of tracks over and over, so I need to make myself seek out different stuff.
However, an eeb really allows you to explore new areas better. You’re not bothered about heading off somewhere that might yield nothing as…You’re on an eeb.

Yesterday though, I went riding around the Long Mynd and had just the most awesome day on it. I was riding mostly in the lowest setting, attacking the brilliantly technical climb out of Carding Mill and even riding with it off in solidarity when my mates bike ran out of juice.
Back to the van for lunch, second battery in and we were away again. Amazing.
No way I’d be doing that on my mtb.

But yeah, they’re brilliant and also can be not so brilliant.

Sounds to me like it might split your group a bit which would be a real shame.

Mind you, I was always riding with a similar group of non-ebikers and it was just never an option for any of us. Ebikes were heavy as hell and only for lazy people.
But then, one of the group (possibly the least likely to ever get an ebike) got one out of the blue, and within a couple of months, nearly all the group have them and are out every weekend doing loads and loads of fantastic trails.

They are fantastic in many ways but they certainly dilute the simplicity(lolz) of riding a bicycle a bit.

In terms of handling though, if you’re mostly doing downhill runs and jumps, you’ll love it. For xc, they’re not great.

Incidentally, Cannock is awesome on an eeb. Because you don’t have huge gradient, the flatter and uphill sections become really swift and fun.

I tried a FF Levo and Kenevo, on push ups you will be ‘unsociable’ cos you’ll either be up front(motor on) or miles behind (motor off)! Went SL myself, Best of both.

Use my ebike for all the enduro runs at FoD, Wind Hill, Nibley, Cranham, etc where you are doing run after run, simple sacrifice really, you get more runs in and more area covered in a day, i find my ebike is a little less capable at tight tech stuff, but works better at flow stuff, only time i take my normal enduro is if i’m wanting to do an hour or two session somewhere or out with others on normal bikes where speed isn’t going to be an issue.

Realistically though, it really is up to what you want to do in the future, if you are doing flattish stuff in Cannock that’s blue level then it’ll be a bit mundane on a big ebike, but if you’re hitting big stuff it can be fun, BPW as well is good, ebikes eat up flow stuff due to the weight/CofG and more solid feel on landing stuff, but i do love my normal bike for the light feel and playful feel that gives, best answer is have both, but if i had to have one, the ebike would win.

Best thing I’ve ever done is buy an ebike. I will never buy a pedal bike again, well I did but sold it after 5 weeks when I re-realized how pointless they are.
If you like spending lots of your ride time pushing a bike uphill crack on with a pedalbike. If your like maximising DH runs, ebike every time.

in summary…
if you are a fast rider you will hate it, if you are a slow rider you will love it. You just need to be honest with yourself as to which category you fall in.

Finally, if I find myself on a push up, can it be pushed easily so I’m not unsociable ditching the lads whilst they walk

They all have a walk mode where the motor will drive the bike forward at walking pace to make pushing up easier

in summary…
if you are a fast rider you will hate it, if you are a slow rider you will love it.

I don’t agree with that. My group are all fast riders and they’re loving the extra trail miles.

The two fastest have shed loads of the downhill focussed KOMS in many popular areas on mtbs (if you judge Strava as a good indicator of bike speed) and they’ve only become faster since having ebikes.
Fast riders are fast everywhere. 😊

My biggest concerns, will the weight make it a chore to move and jump? will it be bore at uplift centres? Finally, if I find myself on a push up, can it be pushed easily so I’m not unsociable ditching the lads whilst they walk.

No, in short. Only people who I find complain about not being able to move them about cant ride properly anyway.

I’ve ridden mine at venues where there are uplifts, but I pedal up. At BPW for example I can get more runs in that the uplift, and it’s quicker.

They are no fun to push. Although walk mode makes it easier.

if you are a fast rider you will hate it, if you are a slow rider you will love it. You just need to be honest with yourself as to which category you fall in.

Not the case at all. Most of the fast guys I ride and race with – we all have them & it’s a constant point, if we didn’t race any more we probably wouldn’t bother with a normal bike.

I do other things to keep me fit, rather than slogging up hills slowly so I don’t need to suffer for the sake of it. Riding for me is about enjoying the downs. I get more, in less time – what’s not to like. :)

I think if youre always going to be with others on normal bikes you may find being on an ebike but going at their speed a bit frustrating, but if you’re on your own or with other e bikes you’ll probably love it.

Pretty good balance of opinion above.

I’d add that ebikes let you get more riding in because it makes it possible to do longish rides day after day or when you are tired or injured.

They also open up other route choices not possible on normal bikes (e.g. a climb that would be completely unrideable now becomes a brilliant challenge)

I have normal bikes and an ebike. Love riding them all.

If I had all the time in the world and could go out whenever/wherever I wanted then I probably would just use normal bikes and wouldn’t bother with the eeb.

However, I live in the real world where amount of time to ride is limited.

in summary…
if you are a fast rider you will hate it, if you are a slow rider you will love it.

Baws.

I’ve got a Decoy and a Sentinel, and love them both.

On the really, really steep loamy stuff the weight of the Decoy can be a big disadvantage, but nearly everywhere else it’s at least as fast.

I can’t imagine not having something like the Sentinel, but I can see it getting less and less use over time, especially at local ride spots where there are lots of runs through the woods which take 60-120 seconds, with 5-8 mins of climbing between each section.

I’m going out tomorrow into Northumberland to a popular wood with a lot of sections. I’ll ride for a couple of hours and do about 3,500ft of climbing on the ebike to ride the sections, whereas two hours on the Sentinel would be 2,000ft and nearly half the number of sections. Ebikes are perfect for this.

Sorry should also say they make it possible to get to more / different trails in any given timeframe.
For example I reckon ebike:normal bike is about 2:3 in terms of time taken. That’s on local technical tracks with lots of short sharp descending and climbing.
That means in any given time I can get to about 1/3rd more trails.

Id class myself as a reasonably fast rider.

only going off my own experience which is that the speed limiter is like riding with an anchor.
my battery would get me around 60k in the surrey hills, i can do that on my normal bike so i wouldnt say it allowed me to ride further but you can absolutely get more runs in for a given amount of time.
i guess im a little old fashioned in that i like to work a bit when i ride, the eeb was too easy, but its interesting that on the majority of trails in surrey my 160mm ebike was slower than my 100mm ‘down country’ bike. ive no doubt the opposite would be the case for some other riders.

However I have kept finding myself looking at the YT Decoy core MX & Canyon Torque ON.

I personally wouldn’t buy an ebike from a mail order only company. I fully expect to take advantage of the warranty at some point and for that reason I bought from my LBS.

I personally wouldn’t buy an ebike from a mail order only company. I fully expect to take advantage of the warranty at some point and for that reason I bought from my LBS.

Totally agree with this. I have had to lean on lbs warranty support for mine.

I am also be put off by proprietary batteries and the like (as in the yt). That’s a recipe for arguments about where a fault lies and warranty resolution responsibility.

I love mine cos basically I don`t want to spend the time and effort getting mega fit to enjoy riding the trails I do :D

yep mail order will likely be a problem.

i really rate the Whyte but the Specialized has the best warranty and you will absolutely need it.

my mrs is on her second motor and one of my riding friends is up to their 6th!

in summary…
if you are a fast rider you will hate it, if you are a slow rider you will love it. You just need to be honest with yourself as to which category you fall in.

Hmmm, not sure about that….

Hmmm, not sure about that….

lol then youre not fast…:-)

ribbing aside the eeb was equal parts fun and frustration for me.

Specialized has the best warranty and you will absolutely need it.

On a specialised brose motor you definitely will need the warranty…

Was warned off them by the lbs and plenty of other info about poor reliability out there if you search.

Whyte Vs trek were tied for me. The tiebreaker was trek’s better warranty support.

One other thing I would also be looking for now is an easily removable battery. This wasn’t a factor for me when I was buying, but now having lived with the bike a while it’s an important feature i use a lot.

ribbing aside the eeb was equal parts fun and frustration for me.

Which ebike did you have? I think it’s only recently that they’ve become worth having, older ebikes either had ancient geometry or motors with massive drag after the cut off speed.

El bouf, you got a rail?.

I had a wild fs ordered, but got a couple of issues in the house that need fixing, so I canned it. I’ll be in a position to get one come Feb/mar 22, really fancy rail 9.

Yep rail 9 is what I’ve got

Daft questions time…..(I’m a roadie who also mountain bikes so not riding god!).
So tight very slow turns where you almost track stand to get through, is the ebike the same? So not jerky when pedalling? I’ve ridden my dads Carerra EBike and that’s very jerky.
Same for rock gardens, I’d want a smaller travel bike (130/140), being a bit of a wuss, is it simple to control the speed over rocks? Presume it must be and my dads bike probably doesn’t compare to modern emtb’s.
I live about 7 miles away from the trails, will I get to the trails and back plus a couple of hours of riding? I have a few short but steep hills on the way to the trails and a lot of short steep climbs to get to the fun stuff (Woburn).
I’m fairly fit, but the constant uphills for 90 seconds of downhill does get rather irksome.

Cool El bouf, any words of wisdom on it? My lbs does trek too, which is handy.

is it simple to control the speed over rocks? Presume it must be and my dads bike probably doesn’t compare to modern emtb’s.
I live about 7 miles away from the trails, will I get to the trails and back plus a couple of hours of riding?

Yes, all the main motor systems, bosch, shimano and brose are very controllable and natural. Turbo mode can be a bit much in some situations, but picking the right mode for the situation is easy enough.

Regards to 7 miles to the trails, its going to depend how much climbing in those 7 miles. I’m 7 miles from the trails along a flat old railway, and I can ride there, do 3000feet of climbing in mostly turbo and come back and still have 30%battery left.

Which ebike did you have? I think it’s only recently that they’ve become worth having, older ebikes either had ancient geometry or motors with massive drag after the cut off speed.

i had a 2021 Whyte E160 RS with the newest Bosch motor. if the trail was steep enough to not have to pedal it wasnt an issue but if it was the kind of trail that needed some pedalling then i ended up just sitting on the limiter which was really frustrating.

it needed steep ups and steep downs to get the best out of it, anything less then it just became frustrsating.

I was cursing myself for my bike choice at Alwinton today. I took the non e bike. ☹️

Ebikes rule where the climbs are so steep that they are in reality push up tracks for non e bikes.

Nobeer it’s been great overall really. No regrets about buying it.

It’s a very very capable bike for all sorts of stuff. Great for winch and plummet DH (what I mainly bought it for) but also totally rideable on mellower xc with tech bits thrown in.
I’m fairly surprised by how much fun it is locally (we have a good selection of up/down tech but no massive climbs/descents).
Also great on jump lines .

It’s not light, but being 14 stone and 6 foot 3 I don’t really notice other than in particular situations when needing to hop the bike around precisely at slow speeds

4 issues I would say:

1) Bosch battery died. Currently waiting for a new warranty one. Luckily the lbs where I bought it from had a spare one to lend me (great service from leisure lakes there).

2) wheel problem 1 – freehub died. Sorted under warranty by leisure lakes.

3) wheel problem 2 rims are shit. Made of cheese and ding when even in the same postcode as a rock. I swapped them out for DT ex511. Miles better. I probably could have warrantied them but didn’t want them replacing with the same!

4) It creaks a bit. All bikes do that though. Need to spend some time finding the source.

Lots of people moan about the tyres but I actually like them. The sidewalls seem a bit thin when you feel them, but in use I’ve found them surprisingly robust.

Haven’t felt the need to swap anything else out, except grips.

Oh i should also say, at my weight and 270psi I am only one click out from using the max rebound damping on the rear shock. Any more pressure and I would be pogoing about.
So it’s just about ok for me, but only just.

w00dster
Full Member
Daft questions time…..(I’m a roadie who also mountain bikes so not riding god!).
So tight very slow turns where you almost track stand to get through, is the ebike the same? So not jerky when pedalling? I’ve ridden my dads Carerra EBike and that’s very jerky.
Same for rock gardens, I’d want a smaller travel bike (130/140), being a bit of a wuss, is it simple to control the speed over rocks? Presume it must be and my dads bike probably doesn’t compare to modern emtb’s.
I live about 7 miles away from the trails, will I get to the trails and back plus a couple of hours of riding? I have a few short but steep hills on the way to the trails and a lot of short steep climbs to get to the fun stuff (Woburn).
I’m fairly fit, but the constant uphills for 90 seconds of downhill does get rather irksome.

I ride trails with a lot of slow manoeuvres, so track standing down steep or twisty stuff, ebikes work well, just like a normal bike, you need to be in the right gear for it to work, and the right power setting for the ebike, i don’t even think about it now, it’s as natural as being in the right gear on the normal bike for that trail or feature.

7 miles to and from trails is the easy part, you’ll be in eco or off if it’s normal metalled roads, flatish and so on, your only concern there will again be the same as a normal bike, what tyres you’re doing 14 miles on if it’s roads, you don’t want super tacky tyres that a high resistance, as you’ll need more power to get there.

“ if the trail was steep enough to not have to pedal it wasnt an issue but if it was the kind of trail that needed some pedalling then i ended up just sitting on the limiter which was really frustrating.”

My 2.5 year old Levo is nothing like this – it seamlessly fades out the assistance as you approach the limiter and above that speed it goes faster than my previous full-sus (which was 27.5 not 29). I commute on it as well as MTBing (over half my inbound commute is off-road) – nowadays I leave the motor off except for the more significant uphills, mostly to reduce cassette wear.

So I guess it depends on how the motor system is executed.

I’d also suggest that there’s a tendency to put really sticky and tough and knobbly tyres on an ebike on the grounds that it has a motor so rolling resistance doesn’t matter – if you’re treating it as a DH bike with self-uplift then I’d agree but it’ll suck the fun out of a trail bike because it’ll be so hard to pedal past the cut-off.

owned an ebike for about 3 months but decided it was detrimental to my fitness

it isnt worth the effort to try and pedal a 50lb bike any faster.

Not having a pop at you :) but just think these two statements are at odds to one another. How can it be detrimental if youre not wanting to make that extra effort. I would have thought extra effort, on a heavier bike would be anything but. Or maybe im just reading this wrong :)

I like the ideas of ebikes, but agree that they have their settings, and maybe offroad settings amongst riders without isnt quite it, or maybe it is, allowing fitter riders and unfit riders to at the very least keep together.
That said I’ve ridden in many a large group, and find fitter or more skilled riders do inevitably lead the way and get quite far ahead. But we do all catch up eventually.

i personally dont have a problem with the concept of ebikes, I think they are a great idea, a middle ground between electrically powered throttle wise and pedal driven only. Just a shame the pricing is completely off the wall and asking many thousands for bottom of the range componentry, which isn’t always up to the task set of it.

there are as many types are there are cycling disciplines. They make it easier for people to get out (bums on saddles) to enjoy the great outdoors, to embrace a level of fitness and maybe as a stepping stone to greater levels of fitness.

“it isnt worth the effort to try and pedal a 50lb bike any faster.”

Two more points regarding this:

1. If you’re not going uphill then the weight is irrelevant.
2. Even if the weight was relevant, I bet you’ve ridden with people 2+ stone heavier than you, who are still perfectly capable of riding their bike uphill without assistance.