Yes correct ernie. But what sets the agenda for tv news? Right wing newspapers. So the neutrality of the tv news is actually the midpoint of the newspapers which is way to the right of centre and very anti labour
Telly? Newspapers? Bit 20th century innit chaps? Get with the programme grandad! 😂
Surely if Brexit and the last election taught us anything it’s that loads of people are getting their news* exclusively via social meedya
* the word ‘news’ is used figuratively in this instance and doesn’t imply any factual content in this Wild West unregulated space, ripe for exploitation by unscrupulous liars like Dominic Cummings and Boris Johnson
Telly? Newspapers? Bit 20th century innit chaps? Get with the programme grandad! 😂
Says the man who is probably the only one on this thread who still goes out and buys a printed newspaper! Or do you get a newspaper boy to deliver it?
.
Surely if Brexit and the last election taught us anything it’s that loads of people are getting their news* exclusively via social meedya
You don't need to go on hunches, Ofcom provide detailed breakdown of how people obtain their news, it's mostly through television. If you think working-class people waste their time getting their news from social media you are mistaken.
Or, more likely, the right wing press tells them that labour have nothing to offer them.
See my point above about not patronising them. The working class are more than capable of forming their own opinions based on their life experience and observations. Yes the media has an influence, but it’s not nearly as much as you think.
Ask working class people what they think about politicians and they’ll all give the same answer, and are exactly right in that analysis. You don’t need me to tell you what it is, and until that changes, not many will want to vote for them.
Surely if Brexit and the last election taught us anything it’s that loads of people are getting their news* exclusively via social meedya
You only have to look at the latest Kettlegate saga to see that in action.
A couple of sentences being shown in a different context to how they were actually said, goes viral , and the hard of thinking just lap it up as gospel.
Says the man who is probably the only one on this thread who still goes out and buys a printed newspaper! Or do you get a newspaper boy to deliver it?
As a 50-odd year old giffer I know how wildly unrepresentative this makes me. And I have my butler bring it up to me in the morning with my warmed slippers and Earl Grey 😂
Ofcom provide detailed breakdown of how people obtain their news, it’s mostly through television
Ofcom are monitoring all the click-throughs from Instagram, Friendface, ****ter and Tik Tok now, are they?
Old duffers like us think of ‘news’ as a half hour programme fronted by a man in a suit, for a lot of people it’s a 30 second YouTube clip reached off a (probably paid) clickbait link on Facebook
Nobody knew this more than Dominic Cummings, who successfully weaponised it
We need to redefine the word ‘news’ in an age of totally unregulated ‘content’
Ofcom are monitoring all the click-throughs from Instagram, Friendface, ****ter and Tik Tok now, are they?
No Ofcom presumably do it by carrying out research and asking people what their main news source is. The conclusion they have come to is that television is the most popular source.
How have you come to your conclusion that 'social media' is a more important source of news for working-class people than television, which you apparently dismiss as '20th century'?
Can we stop trying to treat a whole “class” as being homogenous? It’ll all be very age dependent, obviously. That applies to media consumption, voting patterns, likelihood to protest… pretty much everything. Just like all other “classes”.
The point that “the papers” help set the narrative for both TV and Social Media is a key one not to skip past. I know people who get all their news from Facebook, but TV news still makes up the bulk of that (shared BBC, Sky, C4news posts on FB etc), which in turn report heavily on stories picked up on by Newspapers, often echoing the slant they put on those stories.
You don’t escape the agenda setting of newspapers by not reading them.
Ask working class people what they think about politicians and they’ll all give the same answer, and are exactly right in that analysis.
What I hear a lot from working class people is that the Labour Party is for foreigners and welfare scroungers.
I don't think their analysis is right about that?
I also hear that the Labour Party doesn't represent the working man anymore ( I think they mean the 'white' working man, - see above )
They were offered a manifesto that stood firmly behind the working man in 2017 and arguably again in 2019 and they rejected it - 2017s high vote share or not, they failed to win power.
Don't get me wrong, I want Labour to offer policies that help working people, re-nationalise the things that people need without choice and re-invest in the country after 12 years of it being run into the ground - but the idea that all Labour have to do is offer 'policies that help the working man' is for the birds.
You don’t escape the agenda setting of newspapers by not reading them.
That is a completely different argument. This was the claim that was made:
the right wing press tells them that labour have nothing to offer them.
I believe that there is an exaggerated view of how much working-class people rely on newspapers to provide them with political news.
Most working-class people rely on the television for serious news and use newspapers, if they bother at all, for light entertainment purposes.
You don’t have to read newspapers to have their repeated messaging infiltrate nearly all the news content you consume. And the idea that reading newspapers primarily for social and cultural content means that you’re unexposed to their political slant is, well, flawed.
What I hear a lot from working class people is that the Labour Party is for foreigners and welfare scroungers
Indeed. And I also hear lots of middle class commentators telling us that the majority of people are in favour of renationalising everything. Well… yeah, right up until the point they get to vote for it, whereupon they go reject it and vote for the ‘less immigrants’ party instead
You don’t have to read newspapers to have their repeated messaging infiltrate nearly all the news content you consume.
Okay so the television tells them that Labour has nothing to offer. Is that peculiar to working-class people? Since the criticism was specifically aimed at the working-class.
I was in Cornwall last week talking to two guys around 30 who lived there on how it was impossible for them to ever own their own home. Asked them what the solution was as I had no answers. Dead pan immediate reply of burn all houses that are Air B and B year round for a start.
Well… yeah, right up until the point they get to vote for it
Of course it’s got bugger all to with the fact that there were loads of labour MPs and others who spent all their time telling working class voters not to vote labour because it was too left wing.
Meanwhile, back in the real world…
Is that what reality looks like to you binners?
Fifteen Labour MPs have launched a campaign urging voters not to back Jeremy Corbyn at the general election.
The group has put their names to full page adverts in a number of local and regional newspapers in the north of England.
The advert, which will be seen by voters in a number of key Labour seats being targeted by the Tories, says: “Everyone wants a safer, fairer society. But in this election the Labour Party is set to deliver the opposite.
"We were all lifelong Labour voters and all former Labour MPs. We are voting for different parties at this election, but we have all come to the difficult decision not to vote Labour.
That was a couple of days before the last general election.
Yes the media has an influence, but it’s not nearly as much as you think.
Balderdash
A 20.year big lie anti eu campaign mainly in right wing newspapers totally changed the uk view of the eu resulting in brexit.
Is that peculiar to working-class people?
No, far from it. I’d say it’s worse with middle class people who still consider the Telegraph a news outlet.
Since the criticism was specifically aimed at the working-class.
Not a criticism of the working class, an observation about how the media landscape in the UK is a barrier to changing social and political attitudes, and also, more specifically, getting a non-Tory government. The problem starts with newspapers. But no one claims it ends there.
I believe that there is an exaggerated view of how much working-class people rely on newspapers to provide them with political news.
Most working-class people rely on the television for serious news and use newspapers, if they bother at all, for light entertainment purposes.
It's just as well!
Fifteen Labour MPs have launched a campaign urging voters not to back Jeremy Corbyn at the general election.
The group has put their names to full page adverts in a number of local and regional newspapers in the north of England.
It's remarkable that Schrodinger's voter a) doesn't read newspapers, and yet b) was swayed by Chuka Umuna and friends in the newspaper, but c) is perfectly capable of forming her own opinion and shouldn't be patronised and Chuka has nothing to do with it, yet somehow d) keeps helplessly voting tory because some people think Brexit is still a live issue.
So, let me get this right…
Labour gifted the Tories an enormous majority at the last election because…
*checks notes*
… a few former Labour MP’s went to the local press to say that Magic Grandad was a bit shit?
Bless you and your delusional lefty comfort blanket
Have you thought about re-engaging with the real world at any point? Granted, it’s a bit shit at the moment, but living in a fantasy world isn’t really healthy in the long term 😂
The default position of most Brits, of all classes, is to mock, to be cynical and to tear down. So anyone proposing something better gets torn to pieces and discredited. Tories don't propose radical change for the better, they don't propose much, which is why they aren't as vulnerable to being torn down. So nothing ends up happening and people vote Tory.
Molgrips
The tories have control of or friends controlling the media thus they don't get questioned in the same way labour and SNP do in the media.
The Tory press have a huge and malign influence. Brexit is a product of this. A 20 year anti eu propaganda campaign
Not disagreeing with that.
my warmed slippers and Earl Grey
You see, at first reading, I thought you were getting all posh having warmed 'kippers'.
I'll slink off back to lurking. 😳
It’s just as well!
I am sorry Doris if I have got this wrong but you appear to believe that my second quote somehow negates the first one?
I maintain that there appears to be an exaggerated view of how much working-class people rely on newspapers to provide them with political news.
The link I provided and the quote associated with it was in response to binners ridicule of Daz's comment.
It is abundantly clear that there were Labour MPs who attacked and urged people not to vote Labour. Whether they did so on the television, as many did, or less commonly in full page adverts in local/regional newspapers in northern Labour seats specifically being targeted by the Tories, is irrelevant.
The fact remains that Daz's comment, despite binners usual attempt to ridicule, was perfectly legitimate.
It is abundantly clear that there were FORMER Labour MPs who attacked and urged people not to vote Labour
FTFY
Imagine that? MPs who were no longer members of that party, having left to form their own, urging voters not to vote for the party they just left
On that basis I take it you’re attributing Boris’s downfall to Rory Stewart and David Gauke, and interviews they’ve subsequently given to the Stoke Advertiser and the Bournemouth Gazette, yeah?
Talk about desperately clutching at straws to try and apportion blame to anywhere but the glaringly obvious 😂
Ernie is right in that the attacks on Corbyn from sitting and former labour mps cost labour the election. That and the labour/ tory anti snp pact in Scotland
It was utterly disgusting to see labour mps cheering tory wins and slagging the labour leader. Those labour right wingets behaved disgracefully and share a large part of the blame for Brexit and the big tory majority we have now.
Utterly disgraceful behaviour
It is abundantly clear that there were FORMER Labour MPs who attacked and urged people not to vote Labour
FTFY
"Former" by a matter of about 4 weeks.
Talk about desperately clutching at straws
Quite. The idea that these Labour MPs had done nothing until the adverts appeared in newspapers two days before the general election is clearly absurd. As is your repeated suggestion that it caused no damage to Labour's electoral chances.
Those labour right wingets behaved disgracefully and share a large part of the blame for Brexit and the big tory majority we have now.
Don’t be daft. It was all the fault of thick racist working class people. Serves them right, and now they’ve messed up the retirement plans of rich middle class people moving to the Dordogne they should be happy their kids are not going to starve.
Those labour right wingets behaved disgracefully and share a large part of the blame for Brexit and the big tory majority we have now
If we’re in the game of apportioning blame for Brexit among Labour MPs, then I think we may need to look at the man who voted against EU integration for his entire parliamentary ‘career’, conveniently went completely AWOL during the referendum campaign then was first out of the blocks, even before Farage, demanding that Article 50 be triggered immediately after the results were in, then whipped his MPs to support leaving the Customs Union and Single Market ensuring that Boris and the ERG got their hardest of Brexits
Who might that be then? Hmmmmm….
Honestly… what planet do you lot live on? 😂
So in answer to the question in the thread title… this is what a revolution looks like
The left joining forces with the far right to ensure a project to take us out of the EU
There’s your revolution.
Oh we are now back to talking about Corbyn are we binners?
About a week ago you claimed that Corbyn was, and I quote, "echoing Farage" during the referendum campaign. I asked you in what you meant by that and you disappeared from the thread.
Do you want to tell me now binners since you are apparently keen to talk about the issue again? Views on asylum seekers? Foreigners? Immigration? The country is too crowded? What?
He wanted us out of the EU just as much as Farage did and, somewhat ironically, a lot more than Boris did.
And now, as Truss tears up workers rights and carries on with the Brexit ‘project’ of turning the UK into a sweatshop/tax haven she can smile to herself knowing that she could never have done it without the full support of the former Labour leader
A man so profoundly stupid that he willingly acted as a cheerleader for a far right coup
they’ve messed up the retirement plans of rich middle class people moving to the Dordogne
No they haven’t. The rich can retire to anywhere. That will never change. It is the working class and our children that have lost opportunities, the rich can always flash their cash and buy their way past barriers that have been erected for the rest of us.
Binners derailing another thread with his obsession with Corbyn. 🙄
No they haven’t.
It’s definitely a lot more difficult if you’re the sort of person who is property rich and cash poor which is most of the uk middle class.
Binners derailing another thread with his obsession with Corbyn. 🙄
And once again… it’s never me who brings the stupid old goat up. I leave that to the usual cult members, who are like those Japanese soldiers still found fighting the Second World War in the jungle on some remote pacific island
He wanted us out of the EU just as much as Farage did
Echoing means to repeat, as in "this place is an echo chamber". I have to assume that you can't think of any examples of where Corbyn repeated Farage's brexit narrative and your comment was merely designed to be a slur.
I would be interested btw in why you think Labour didn't do better among traditional Labour voters in the "red wall" seats, if brexit was what motivated them and Corbyn "wanted us out of the EU just as much as Farage did"?
An anti-Semitic racist brexiteer...
.. what more could working-class voters want?
Corbyn and Farage wanted the same thing for very different reasons, Farages obvious, Corbyn absolutely inexplicable to me. As a Brexit supporting Corbyn fan boi, maybe you can try and pick some logic or reason out of it and explain it for me…
They both got what they wanted. As did you
Hurray for them and you. Unlucky for the rest of us
And once again… it’s never me who brings the stupid old goat up.
Nah it was definitely you binners. About an hour ago you mentioned "Magic Grandad", up until that point no one had mentioned Corbyn.
You have a complete obsession with the former Labour leader.
I think this thread (as always 😄) perfectly sums up what a British revolution would look like.
Everyone would be too busy arguing with each other than getting together to stick it to “the man”
Corbyn who spent the entire campaign campaigning for remain and who spoke to more people at more events than snyone else with a pro remain agenda
Binners
You have to face it. Your beloved labour centrist ie right wingets effed it up not Corbyn
Stop attempting to rewrite history
I have little time for Corbyn but i do have a liking for truth
Along with that grandstanding idiot Swinson of course
Corbyn who spent the entire campaign campaigning for remain
In his shed on his allotment, apparently?
You know courgettes don’t have voting rights?
