Most advanced democracies have some sort of devolved/federal structure. Of course the electorate are never satisfied, but neither are they in countries with centralised structures.
While I would like to see it change somewhat, I have to say the scottish parliament has been very successful in it's short lifespan.mikewsmith - Member
Just because it doesn't work in australia doesn't mean it can't work elsewhere.
look at how much the current government spends on advisors and consultation, why would regional be any different. Shooting fish in a barrel while taking candy from a baby.
Inject an interest? Education you have to expose people to it, engage them, not talk to them like soundbite idiots. I have an active interest in politics and hate the dumb down news. Even the youth station here in Oz has a semi serious news discussion every day with people who can communicate with young people.
The biggest step would be to move from my dad voted X so I vote X. Don't associate thatcher with all tories or blair with all labour. Policy by issue not by ideology. Coalition can work with a mixed agenda being the outcome.
How do you inject an interest in politics? And get people to take an interest in who their politicians actually are?
Sorry I need to get back to work 🙂
Start a thread on the subject ?
Policy by issue not by ideology
Now this is a contentious point, I think...
Aye, think you may be right, diverge the question away from this.
Well as I'm here and another 15mins before my flight and the business lounge bar is free...
If you disagree with my position debate me don't just oppose me, persuade me but accept that I'm persuading you. Our view points may be different but our views equally valid. Shake hands after and accept the result.
People need to be engaged and understand what the process is. In some ways the unelected house of Lords is a counterbalance to the self serving election seeking commons members. They can consider and question without fear of expulsion. This questioning is a good thing in some ways. In Oz the upper house is on 6 year terms to help avoid short termism.
Heriot Watt paper was published in 2013. Why have the BBC chosen to publish the news release now? Surely it could have done it last week no?
I don't know why people think it's just the BBC, its a press release (ie HWU marketing) that has been picked up by many news channels, even the SNP!
http://www.snp.org/media-centre/news/2014/sep/new-technology-underlines-bright-future-sector
http://www.offshore-mag.com/articles/2014/09/heriot-watt-university-updates-north-sea-eor-studies.html
http://news.stv.tv/north/293300-heriot-watt-university-new-technology-could-extend-north-sea-oil-life/
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/business/business-science-technology/new-technologies-could-add-decades-4316741
http://www.energyvoice.com/2014/09/technology-boost-oil-reserves/
http://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/scottish-politics/life-of-gas-and-oil-in-north-sea-could-be-extended.25414609
This tin foil hat conspiracy stuff is getting really daft.
What makes you think that they are looking for Utopia? Scotland and indeed the UK at present is shit. There are plenty places on the planet that are not as shit.
George you do know about Australian politics don't you?! If you don't like UK politics then you are really going to struggle with aussie politics.
A Russian friend was commenting on this whole referendum thing, she was amazed how unappreciative we are of how good a quality of life we have here, how free and well off we are yet people still complain and claim it is terrible. I'm inclined to agree with her!
bigjim - Member
A Russian friend was commenting on this whole referendum thing, she was amazed how unappreciative we are of how good a quality of life we have here, how free and well off we are yet people still complain and claim it is terrible. I'm inclined to agree with her!
Well that's an easy one, we have a good quality of life because we question every aspect of it, and continually do so.
When we stop doing that, it'll regress. I utterly reject people that say you should be happy with your lot.
I don't think we are unappreciative, we just know there's always room for improvement.
[i]When we stop doing that, it'll regress. I utterly reject people that say you should be happy with your lot.
I don't think we are unappreciative, we just know there's always room for improvement.[/i]
Blimey...you really do accentuate the negatives don't you? We can all find this to complain about, believe me, but you are living in a country with the most amazing scenery, coastline, golf courses, and open space, you are free,(assummed) healthy and young (ish) and have your life ahead of you.
You're a long time dead....eternity is forever and you're worrying about what exactly??
I don't think looking to improve is negative? How do you work that out?
btw, i'm speaking from a UK perspective here.
[i]I don't think looking to improve is negative? How do you work that out?[/i]
The point is, we are always trying to improve our lot as a nation and compared with just 25yrs ago,(let alone 50yrs) things have changed hugely. But you have to be careful what you wish for sometimes....
Is that not what i just said?
why are you trying to argue?
The point is, we are always trying to improve our lot as a nation and compared with just 25yrs ago,(let alone 50yrs) things have changed hugely. But you have to be careful what you wish for sometimes....
Foodbanks would suggest that they are not changing for everybody though.
[i]Is that not what i just said?
[i]
why are you trying to argue?[/i]
From what you are saying, its like trying to improve things is an original idea![/i]
I'm saying its not and that you can't please all the people all the time. Sometimes you have to count your blessings.
PS. Lucky we have food banks for people that need them....they didn't have them in past times when the need was there.
How can it be an original idea if what i'm refering to is what people in the UK have done in the past?
Sorry but that is utter pish.Everyone wants a better fairer society
George you do know about Australian politics don't you?! If you don't like UK politics then you are really going to struggle with aussie politics.
Jim - the difference is I'll be a lot better off financially and the persecutory policies that the current UK parties pursue will not have the same adverse effect on my quality of life.
One thing that has amazed me about people packing up and shipping out of Scotland is the speed at which they have started going. The first people I know of left permanently today - 7 of them.
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shitebags the lot of them! 😆wanmankylung - Member
The first people I know of left permanently today - 7 of them.
One thing that has amazed me about people packing up and shipping out of Scotland is the speed at which they have started going. The first people I know of left permanently today - 7 of them.
Amazing indeed how quickly people discard their political and nationalistic ideals after a narrow defeat.
Just as well you didn't get your own way.
George you do know about Australian politics don't you?! If you don't like UK politics then you are really going to struggle with aussie politics.Jim - the difference is I'll be a lot better off financially
Forgive me if I have misremembered this, but I thought I recalled someone suggesting that No voters were likely to be more materialistic and short-sighted than those voting Yes?
well really that's you just selectively reading to try and prove your own bias.imnotverygood - Member
George you do know about Australian politics don't you?! If you don't like UK politics then you are really going to struggle with aussie politics.
Jim - the difference is I'll be a lot better off financiallyForgive me if I have misremembered this, but I thought I recalled someone suggesting that No voters were likely to be more materialistic and short-sighted than those voting Yes?
Crikey. Still arguing about Scotland are we? 😯
Scotland will just have to try again I am afraid which will not be easy the next time round.
My prediction is Scotland will only achieve independence with the last monarchy/King (1st President of UK) that is the current Prince (future King/1st President) George of Cambridge.
Forgive me if I have misremembered this, but I thought I recalled someone suggesting that No voters were likely to be more materialistic and short-sighted than those voting Yes?
I thought I lived in a country full of forward thinking individuals who liked the idea of working for the greater good. Turns out I was wrong. It's amazing the extent to which new information changes your opinion.
I thought I lived in a country full of forward thinking individuals who liked the idea of working for the greater good. Turns out I was wrong. It's amazing the extent to which new information changes your opinion.
Truly the flounce to end them all.
you just need to move in different circles.wanmankylung - Member
Forgive me if I have misremembered this, but I thought I recalled someone suggesting that No voters were likely to be more materialistic and short-sighted than those voting Yes?
I thought I lived in a country full of forward thinking individuals who liked the idea of working for the greater good. Turns out I was wrong. It's amazing the extent to which new information changes your opinion.
Truly the flounce to end them all.
It's not a flounce, more of a sashay.
One thing that has amazed me about people packing up and shipping out of Scotland is the speed at which they have started going. The first people I know of left permanently today - 7 of them.
and they managed to organise that in 7 days, your friends live "light"
selectively reading to try and prove your own bias.
Dear Kettle, etc.
and they managed to organise that in 7 days, your friends live "light"
They are wise men, they predicted the future reasonably accurately and made contingency plans.
mmmm Why I don't know, but it wiffs of bovine excrement tbh.big_n_daft - Member
One thing that has amazed me about people packing up and shipping out of Scotland is the speed at which they have started going. The first people I know of left permanently today - 7 of them.
and they managed to organise that in 7 days, your friends live "light"
wanmankylung. I thought I lived in a country full of forward thinking individuals who liked the idea of working for the greater good.
wanmankylung the difference is I'll be a lot better off financially and the persecutory policies that the current UK parties pursue will not have the same adverse effect on my quality of life.
Is that the greater good of your wallet?
That's the plan. Professional registration has been obtained, visa has been applied for and job is just about sealed. Melbourne is my destination - have more family there than what I have here. Will be getting paid around 150% more for doing the same job. Living costs will be comparable.As for the second part of your comment - as I said, it depends how you define shit and where you're looking at that shit from.
Don't know if you have been to Melbourne, but good luck. It was my favourite city in Australia.
Don't assume the grass is always greener. Don't know how things are now however I was there 10 years ago when John Howard was in charge. The place felt quite conservative. Plenty of tough views on immigration. Casual racism and sexism was quite common. Met plenty of people struggling financially when I worked there. Also saw protests by people not wanting Australia to go to war in Iraq. Did not work though. Basically I felt that people were wrestling with much the same problems as over here.
Perhaps if you think things are s**t here, look into the stolen generations. In the same decade that Margaret Thatcher came to power, the Australian government was still taking aboriginal children from their parents and giving them to white couples.
I am not having a dig at Australia, just saying that governments around the globe have grubby histories and policies. Scotland is no different.
A friend of mine emigrated to Melbourne. Describes Australia as being like Essex. On a continental scale. (Apologies to those of you living to the NE of London)
The first people I know of left permanently today - 7 of them.
So that is exactly a week after the referendum then. When are you going ?
I thought I lived in a country full of forward thinking individuals who liked the idea of working for the greater good. Turns out I was wrong. It's amazing the extent to which new information changes your opinion.
Does this forward thinking include a tolerance of a population with wide ranging views on national identity, and a variety of thoughts on the best path for their country?
Does this forward thinking include a tolerance of a population with wide ranging views on national identity, and a variety of thoughts on the best path for their country?
Obviously not, which is why he's going to live in a country where everyone will agree with him.
He's leaving quite soon I think.
Jim - the difference is I'll be a lot better off financially and the persecutory policies that the current UK parties pursue will not have the same adverse effect on my quality of life.
I'm not convinced based on my experience, very high taxation and many things like staple foods over there are much more expensive than here, though fuel is I think still cheaper than ehre, though it's been nearly 5 years since I lived there. Melbourne is nice and the most european feeling city. I wouldn't burn your bridges anyway, it's an awesome place for an adventure but I was glad to come back here.
I thought I lived in a country full of forward thinking individuals who liked the idea of working for the greater good. Turns out I was wrong. It's amazing the extent to which new information changes your opinion.
This new information being that people are actually prepared to leave the country just to get a 150% increase in pay (and sod the rest)?
I think we should probably stop piling on the guy who looks like he's having a difficult personal moment and depersonalize it.
A friend of mine emigrated to Melbourne. Describes Australia as being like Essex. On a continental scale. (Apologies to those of you living to the NE of London)
your friend is stupid, then. that's as stupid as saying all of the UK is like Essex. maybe he lives in the Essex of Melbourne and doesn't get out his/her social circle much. I don't know.
Perhaps if you think things are s**t here, look into the stolen generations. In the same decade that Margaret Thatcher came to power, the Australian government was still taking aboriginal children from their parents and giving them to white couples.
I seem to remember watching a documentary, within the last year. That documented the continued maltreatment of the Aboriginal population. I'm sure a google for Aboriginal rights Movement Australia would shed som light. Bit hazy in my memory to be honest, so can't vouch too much on its veracity.
I seem to only be remembering the opinions of aboriginal activists to be fair.
Too late to edit, I think it was tied into land rights and the mineral wealth driven boom.
oh, it's a total bit of a mess, make life expectancy in Wilcannia is something like 36. it's an absurd atrocity.
So like the East End of Glasgow, then?
So like the East End of Glasgow, then?
Not really. Male life expectancy in Wilcannia is roughly half of that in the East End of Glasgow. Always good to check the facts.
Always good to check the facts.
Well, no, not really, since I wasn't making a serious point.
