Was working on F wing this morning, came over the net that there'd be a 2 minute silence at 11 (a prisoner had already written it on the board, 'shut the **** up at 11 for 2 minutes' or words to that effect) At 11 when it came over the net I shouted, '2 minutes silence please!' I was surprised when 2 games of pool stopped mid stride, 4 black lads playing dominoes kept playing but didn't speak & placed their dominoes down quietly (instead of slamming them down, as they do) & the wing went quieter than I'd heard it for a long time. The only one's who kept yapping were 4 travelling lads playing cards & some asians who turned their music up.
Respect to those who respect.
I went today, mostly for the uncle I never knew who died in Korea.
I wear a poppy, and not just for the dead.
My great uncle is now 94, and still living with PTSD caused by spending a lot of his time in service working on the Burma Railway as a Japanese POW. He also has to live with the guilt he feels about being one of the lucky few to survive the experience.
The pain has stopped,
For I am dead.
My time on earth is done.
But in a hundred years from now, I will still be twenty-one.
My brief, sweet life is over,
My eyes no longer see,
No summer walks,
No Christmas trees,
No pretty girls for me.
I’ve got the chop, I’ve had it.
My nightly ops are done.
Yet in another hundred years, I’ll still be twenty-one.
[i](Epitaph from ""Ode to an Airman" by Sgt R.W. Gilbert, M/UG on Halifaxes with 158 Squadron)[/i]
Epitaph from ""Ode to an Airman" by Sgt R.W. Gilbert, M/UG on Halifaxes with 158 Squadron)
Brought a tear to my eye as i remember a long lost uncle A D-DAY VET.
WILLIAM LANE
Plus my farther RIP .ROBERT TURNER.
WE WILL REMEMBER THEM.
Rode down to the local cenotaph today as my nephew was carrying the flag for his cadet unit. I was pleasantly surprised at the turnout (reckon a couple of hundred people) in what isn't a military town.
Restored a little bit of faith in my fellow man particularly as so many are ignorant of the sacrifices made. My great grandfather survived the First World War but my great uncle died aged 21 as a sergeant pilot over Germany in World War Two.
I won't forget
http://flt-sgt-wh-good-not-forgotten.weebly.com/index.html
If anyone is interested in his story follow the link above.
the best tribute you could have to the war dead is to stop the arms trade, of which britian is a massive contributer. not this jingoistic nonsense we get every year.
At 11:00AM I was standing silently in the middle of the Beacons. I wear the poppy proudly, thankful that because of others my family has a peaceful life. I am a teacher and regularly get asked to act as a referee for youngsters wanting to join up. It really is thought provoking.
the best tribute you could have to the war dead is to stop the arms trade, of which britian is a massive contributer. not this jingoistic nonsense we get every year.
There was another thread which would have been more apt for that kind of comment, you should have posted on that one..
This one if for those who chose to remember..
Please be respectful.
edit, infact i canny even be bothered.
what's the point in preaching to the converted?
This isnt the thread for that, this isnt what this ones about.
Please be respectful.
Ive nothing further to add.
Goodnight.
The trolls are out in force then? The armed forces past, present and future deserve our unwavering respect, regardless of political issues - they should not detract from rememberance day. This day is to remember those who have sacrificed all for the protection of our country, and the upholding of values we rightfully want (world or nationwide).
Okay, you and others asked for this - what about remembering all the war dead - that I feel so many are forgetting. Oh but we must put our armed forces up and on a pedestal and bask in their glory, anyone who doesn't is akin to a paedo.
What about all those massacre's that the British Army are known for? What ****ing values did the Para's in Bloody Sunday uphold again, what values did the British soldiers involved in the Mau Mau uprising uphold, what values did our soldiers uphold in the Boer war, what values did our soldiers uphold in the Opium War? Oh but they deserve our unwavering respect regardless, we must all bow down to social pressure. Just about the only truly just war in the past 5 centuries has been WW2 and arguably a few of the Balkan shit throwing contests.
Check out the last Tommy's views on the poppy and perhaps Robert Fisks grandfathers, both of which held very similar views to my veteran grandparents and uncles. http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/commentators/fisk/robert-fisk-do-those-who-flaunt-the-poppy-on-their-lapels-know-that-they-mock-the-war-dead-6257416.html.
Here's a thought - just because I have opinions, and some of them are deeply held, there might be occasions on which it would be respectful and appropriate to keep them to myself. Too many people nowadays think that just because they are entitled to an opinion, they must ram it down throats whenever possible.
Yeah that would be a start, maybe some of the more jingoistic poppy wearers should shut it as well. It's like living in the bible belt of America - wear your proppy but I don't want to hear your views rammed down my throat on the news, in the papers, in public, or at parties.
P.S The pics for all the red faced angry patriots that will now post that they want to knock me out and defeat the original interwar point of the poppy. Also, I donated to the RBL but I won't be caught dead wearing poppy seeing what I feel it's come to represent.
[img] 
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This one if for those who chose to remember..
I chose to remember, others in this thread have clearly made opinions about how remembrance should be done. If you guys didn't want someone to dispute that, it shouldn't have been posted.
Fisk's article is rather histrionic, imo.
It's perfectly possible to wear a poppy [i]and[/i] grasp the complexity of history. Just as it's perfectly possible to honour the memory of the dead [i]and[/i] despise the ease with which politicians send soldiers to war. If Fisk feels he has to stamp his own views on it, in a tone of almost [i]Daily Wail[/i] outrage, that's his [s]business[/s] paycheck.
Heartened to see that nobody gives a ****what bwaarp thinks ! 😆
Who?
I choose this time to remember members of my family who fought to defend their people when the invaders came, and fought to resist them when they stayed, then they fought to liberate themselves when the imperialist arrived and displaced the invaders, then they fought to free themselves of the imperialists and the invaders came back and they fought for their freedom once more. Eventually, after many years of sacrifice, they were given back their country. Many died for this freedom, I chose to remember them.
From my 7 year old yesterday while watching the remembrance ceremony on the telly:
"Daddy, if they're all so sad about people who die in wars, why do they keep starting them?".
esselgruntfuttock - Member
Was working on F wing this morning, came over the net that there'd be a 2 minute silence at 11 (a prisoner had already written it on the board, 'shut the **** up at 11 for 2 minutes' or words to that effect) At 11 when it came over the net I shouted, '2 minutes silence please!' I was surprised when 2 games of pool stopped mid stride, 4 black lads playing dominoes kept playing but didn't speak & placed their dominoes down quietly (instead of slamming them down, as they do) & the wing went quieter than I'd heard it for a long time. The only one's who kept yapping were 4 travelling lads playing cards & some asians who turned their music up.
Respect to those who respect.
When i read the first couple of lines, I thought "he works in a jail", then I realised I was wrong and you were talking about the local youth-club. 😉
4 black lads playing dominoes kept playing but didn't speak & placed their dominoes down quietly
Well, that's good to hear.
The only one's who kept yapping were 4 travelling lads playing cards & some asians who turned their music up.
Respect to those who respect.
I think it might be a strange situation for such a group. It seems that Remembrance is for remembering the British and Commonwealth servicemen who died in the wars. In such a situation, they might have felt excluded. I mean it would depend if they were from a Commonwealth country or not. But it must be a complex situation, with complex emotions, in which an occupying force recruited locals to fight to maintain their position over the local population.
My grandfather was called up as an 18 year old conscript in WW2. He served in the north Atlantic and mediterranean convoys. His destroyer torpedoed by a U-boat, surviving only because he dived off the side and was picked up by another vessel. He has a piece of shrapnel in his side to this day. He was on the ship that relieved Changi jail, when his navy officers shot Allied POWs in the head to put them out of their misery.
He thought (sadly, dementia is now too advanced for this sort of conversation any more) that WW2 was mainly frightened young men doing what they were told and that Remembrance Sunday is a load of jingoistic nonsense that glorifies war.
Of course, other veterans feel differently, but I suspect my grandfather's view is more common than one might suppose from media coverage of Remembrance day.
On my 18th birthday I was chatting to one of the old regulars in the local football club where I worked as a barman. On my next shift behind the bar he showed me a faded picture of him on his 18th...in the picture he was a skinny, grinning lad wearing shorts and holding a rifle. He signed up when he was 17 and ended up in North Africa, he got a bit emotional when he was telling me about the other people in the picture. They were all of roughly some of the same age, mostly volunteers, but many of the people in the picture ended up buried by him and the rest of his squad somewhere in Africa.
I have the greatest respect for people who make the sacrifices that the armed forces do, particularly those who fought in WW1/WW2.
My maternal grandfather was in the Royal Artillery in WW2, and his wife was in the Auxiliary Territorial Service stationed in France. According to my grandmother, after the war my grandfather was never the same...she believed this is due to what he saw after being involved in the liberation of Bergen-Belsen.
In response to the 'anti-remembrance brigade'; I have absolutely no time for people who are using the sacrifices of the armed forces to further their own political agendas*.
*to answer the inevitable [i]"what about the political agendas of Blair/Bush and their war-mongering"[/i] - you're missing the point.
Before the inevitable flaming starts, I would start by saying that I lost my paternal Grandfather on the Somme, and my family is still dealing with the aftermath of that to this day. My wifes father was a Japanese Pow during WW2 and her side of the family are likewise still dealing with that.
Personally, and with very limited exceptions, I think the best way to honour our war dead is to turn upon any Government worldwide that rattles sabres and looks to resolve disputes through force with one voice and villify them, impose sanctions or whatever else we can do other than start a punch up. I think that is at the nub of the issue regarding militaristic celebrations of our war dead. There are those, myself included who do get a tad uptight about anything that seems to glorify, justify or nullify the horror of warfare, which fairly often these rememberance day things can do.
I would not however, choose that day or indeed some poor sods funeral to put that view forward.
