I saw that video of the Police Disco towing. The numpty had the tow point on the lorry about 18" higher than his towbar which meant his rear end would have been lifted off the floor under load and become very unstable. Luckily, judging by how often the rope went slack it only needed a gently nudge to get it moving. Often the force needed to get grip is tiny and once moving it is surprising how far you can get on a slippy surface. It is almost always the starting, stopping and turning bits of low friction driving that are the problem. That, and other traffic 🙂
Attempted for 6 hours to get into work yesterday due to the demand working for an insurer, before finally i had to admit defeat. Here in Norfolk, it is nearly all HGV that have caused the road closures and problems, not there fault as they are trying to get job done, but lorries breaking down and jack-knifing closed both main A-roads.
- Personal favourites were lad on a moped, road off drive that his dad had cleared, hit road, fell off, got up, got another 3 feet, fell off, got up and tried again, unsurprisingly fell off and damaged moped, then got bitterly cold and gave up as he was wearing a tracksuit!
- Complete knobber in Jaguar F-type, gets stuck, people including me push him out, gets stuck again as he insists on keeping flooring it, gets pushed again, and again floors it slides and leaves it perpendicular across the single lane road, he gets out and he is wearing leather soled office shoes so proceeds to fall ar*e over apex much to the amusement of all those that have been pushing him who he forgot to thanks to, he then abandons it blocking the way for everyone else, so it got pushed out of the way with a tractor..
- The numerous Range Rover types, who realise that they have a 4x4 and a big engine so they feel they can go anywhere, forgetting the have low profile road tyres on.
But on the flip side, there were some great people about, numerous FB posts and people in proper 4x4 and tractors offering to take NHS staff in, pulling out the plonkers and keeping rural roads open. 60 volunteer farmers who had their tractors fitted with snow ploughs doing the job the council couldn't manage and people sharing food and drink when the main road got shut and people were stuck on dual carriageway.
Was almost pleasantly surprised how my old Astra estate did with proper winter tyres on.
Best 3 cars I've ever driven in the snow are...
My old Mini pick up with studded tyres.
My (ex) wifes 1983 Fiat Panda with Town & Country's
My 1600E with Michelin XZX's all round.
Worst was my Sierra diesel estate. It was so bad I had to carry 4 3'x2' paving slabs in the back when there was 1/8" of snow. & it was still shit.
The main type round here is the 4x4 hero.. Just seen two (Macan and then an XC90) fly past the house at about 40mph (it's a blanket 20mph in the town we live in and there is a generous amount of the white stuff up in the NE). Both of them inches away from the poor chap walking along the road in the opposite direction. Complete and utter tosspots the pair of them. I can only hope that when they inevitably crash they don't take any unsuspecting poor souls with them.
Few people in M-Sport beemers with low profile tyres generally getting stuck.. Best I seen was a 640d auto clearly on summer tyres. I cannot think of a much more unsuitable car. Idiot. These people want a good **** knockin oot.
I've ridden to work today on a slick tyred mtb towing a baby trailer. Only encountered sensible and courteous drivers on very quiet roads. Hurrah for snow!
I have full-on Alpine ready winter tyres on the van, shall I go out later for the bants?
I must say re unsuitable cars, i was very surprised to discover just how pants in the snow my Citroen c3 Picasso thing was yesterday.
Its traction control gently ground us to a halt on my parents’ flat culdesac.
I used to have an old automatic 5 series beemer (don't go judging; not my choice but it was free - what's an inverse snob to do?). Big fat tyres on it too (summer tyres, too, but then we've have snow on the roads round here for a total of about 36 hours in the past ten years)
Traction control on that involved braking the spinning wheel rather than doing anything creative. Was a bastard in the snow. It could get around but losing momentum at any point was almost guaranteed to be fatal so very dependent on other drivers making sensible progress too. I never quite got marooned but was touch & go once or twice 😀
Its the ones who leave all the snow on their bonnets and their roofs and just clear a little porthole in the windscreen. Do you really think thats safe? Do you?
Supporters of ice-is
There's a thread on the owners' forum for my car which has split completely into 2- one group declaring it to be useuless in the snow because it's "too powerful" (Mondeo ST220) or "too torquey" (Mondeo ST155) and the other going wtf, it makes as much power/torque as you request via the noisy pedal, and it has a gearbox, and ti's a bloody Mondeo ffs, it's not too anything except too big to fit in a tesco parking space.
Predictably, suggestions of sensible tyres- not even necessarily winters, just not 888s or whatever- for your family estate car are not going down well.
Gave my sister a lift to work late yesterday (I was out anyway and she was stuck after a train terminated early) - she is a nurse and going on shift. Golf R on winter tyres, lots of slalom to get round stuck things but I was amazed at how capable it was, the only thing stopping it was the bottoming out issues when we got into properly thick stuff but it made it all across town and back then up and down a decent big hill then into a narrow drive. I've got a lot of snow driving experience (I lived in the Alps and drove every day) but the tyres definitely were the difference. Loads of average driving examples mainly speed related (too fast for conditions) and inability to brake properly.
However, when i got home a furniture lorry took on our street and it passed the house going backwards at pace before destroying a grit bin and collecting the church wall, took a bit of skill to get that one out.
Best car I have driven in snow was a 2cv. amazingly capable - not enough power to break traction and the thin tyres cut thru
I'm getting this bus from now on
Super skilled driver outside my house now, narrow steep road absolutely packed with snow and ice underneath. HIs land rover discovery is now perendicular across the road jammed between my wall and the wall on the other side. His outrage is measurable that his offroader couldn't simply drive up it. I watched him and went out to tell him to go back but he told me to f-off ! I suggested that the driver was the issue not the car and i thought he was going to have a meltdown. I've let the cops know as sometimes people will come down and there is no way to avoid it. God knows how he will get it out, he made some noises that perhaps I could help but not much I can do and frankly hes such an utter bellend I hope he maybe learns a lesson.
Golf R on winter tyres,
I lived up on the moors in Belmont and commuted to Lancaster, so about 10 miles of NSL A-road then about 40 of motorway. In the big snows of 2009/10 I had a Golf GTI on normal tyres. First day of the snow, and we had about 10 inches, the only people who made it to work in my village were those with Defenders, me, and my wife. I only went as my wife worked for the NHS in Wigan so if she got stuck I wanted to be there to help.
Golf was surprisingly excellent, and following its tracks my wife’s little fiesta worked ok. Closest I came to an accident was discovering that “road closed” signs aren’t reflective from behind. Turns out the moors A road was shut, they just didn’t bother telling those of us who lived in a place where in ice that’s the only way out of the village.
On my return in the evening there was a plod sat in his Disco who helpfully pointed out the now visible road closed sign. I simply told him where I was going, that I had come from there this morning, that I was prepared, and that I’d rather a three mile walk at the one big hill than a six mile walk from there and he let me though. Aforementioned hill took a bit of a run up, but made it home easily enough.
Wife stayed with friends and I worked from home for the next few days. I’m conclusion, take other people off the roads and most cars will do ok if you know when to have momentum and when not to! The commute only took 10 minutes longer than usual as it was only those 6 miles that were deep, and the motorway was mostly clear of snow and traffic.
1
@ramsey: Nope, windows etc all cleared. Wife given no choice about work by her boss, so didn’t really have a choice.
Edit: strange edit
@zokes : I was trying to quote and reply to an earlier comment but that didn't work so I gave up but couldn,t delete totally . New forum is a struggle for me 🙂
Got stuck in Falmouth yesterday, one knob in a BMW estate tried getting down the hill I’d got stuck on, only missed taking out the front wing of a 308 that a lovely lass had managed to get through and park on the path, only prevented by a van driver who was also stuck grabbing the front wing and shoving, while I pushed the back end away, then kept spinning the back wheels as he slid into the front of a Transit also stuck out into the road.
He managed to get into a side road, then came back out and tried to get back up the steep hill he’d just slid down; unsurprisingly he got about six feet before spinning to a halt and sliding backwards. Arse!
Even a big 4x4 tractor couldn’t make it more than a few metres up the hill, wheels spinning, albeit towing a Luton box van!
He did manage to get the van out another way, along with the Transit, and me and my work colleagues, after four hours, but it was so bloody slippery, the only cars that successfully negotiated the hill were an old Vauxhall Frontera, and a Mitsubishi 4x4, who’s drive I’d managed to get the car onto, but both had serious off-road tyres, and were going very, very slowly!
Less than three miles away, there was hardly any snow at all, Truro had none.
Might be a bit different now...
My Mrs said she saw two cars in bushes on her way home, both Chelsea tractors.
I was trying to quote and reply to an earlier comment but that didn’t work so I gave up but couldn,t delete totally . New forum is a struggle for me 🙂
No worries. The forum remains a mystery to most of us I think 😀
Have we mentioned cars being driven through blizzards without any lights on? If they can't work that out (auto lights not on i guess) goodness knows how they compute the variables of friction, mechanical grip and momentum.
Yep the amount of cars with no lights on today amazed me. "But it's daytime, why on earth would I need lights?"...
Ironically one of them nearly drove into the hoofing great van I was driving, she was so close that I could see the sudden panic as she noticed I was there. I couldn't help it, I shouted out the window at her; "It's a four ton truck Tyrone!"
Zokes I think you made a good point in your post about 2009/10.
I am able to get around safely with a reasonable amount of certainty and competence in the type of weather we've had down in south central today given an absence of abandoned and sideways moving metal. I know what challenges I'm likely to win and when to not try.
However if you chuck in normal traffic volumes for the south I don't want to be going anywhere in a car unless there's a dam good reason.
Two reasons (1) there are some weapons grade cretins out there and (2) I don't want to add to the problems of those who must travel.
From what I've seen of the traffic reports in Hampshire today and this evening I am truly grateful for the quality of my employer's remote working tech that's allowed me to work effectively without bother and without travelling anywhere.
[i]Northwind wrote:[/i]
“too torquey” (Mondeo ST155)
Lolcopters - I checked the spec (as you do) and it seems that has a whopping 10% more torque than my Mondeo! Don't seem to have had much of a problem getting around in the snow in mine - not even last time when I drove past lots of other people struggling (today has been a complete fail for me regarding this thread - almost everybody driving carefully and sensibly). Mind you whilst I have summer tyres, mine is a base model and when I replaced the tyres I fitted slightly narrower ones - probably helps not being on rubber bands.
I'm not all that surprised to see lots of people on here coping, because excepting totally unsuitable machinery it's mainly about the driver and clearly we're all driving gods (not meant totally ironically - I suspect most people commenting on threads like this are somewhat above average drivers - fundamentally we're actually thinking about our driving which is more than most people do).
Best car I have driven in snow was a 2cv. amazingly capable – not enough power to break traction and the thin tyres cut thru
My old mark 1 renault megane was similar, narrow tyres, not much power, plenty of toque from the diesel low in the rev range, a dirty great anchor of an engine over the driving wheels, and not a lot of electronics to confuse, you could pretty much chug everywhere in 3rd.
By comparison my new(er) 407sw is a horror in the snow, auto gear box that won't lock into gears, snow mode does nothing at all, abs/tcs cut in when you neither need or want them too, and the back end is like a pendulum. Unsurprisingly, it's stayed on the drive this week.
I'm not even bothering with the MX5 and its summer tyres.
Parked at the end of a no through road where hopefully noone will crash into it at least.
Am wearing my sex goggles and riding my hardtail instead,
Have we covered off those taking pictures while driving with dashboard and speedo reading visible and then posting pictures on social media yet?
(not meant totally ironically – I suspect most people commenting on threads like this are somewhat above average drivers – fundamentally we’re actually thinking about our driving which is more than most people do).
I might get a bit of a shoeing for this, but I suspect most on STW are better than average drivers in these conditions, primarily because we're mostly mountain bikers and therefore have a reasonable understanding of how to read surfaces in front of us, which lines to pick, and what to do if grip is marginal or non-existent.
primarily because we’re mostly mountain bikers
😂
This type: I’ve got a suitable car(4wd) with suitable tyres(winter) on my car and I’m not driving anywhere today..
I’ll certainly not be taking my 1 series out on it’s summer tyres, but I’ll be doing a few rounds of the elderly locals later on to make sure they’re ok, or see if they want to come sledging! For that I’ll take my 4x4 with winters and snow chains. Not unstoppable but it’ll get through the local tracks!
see if they want to come sledging!
Don't be surprised if they do want to go sledging. Client in her 70's rang last week and booked her summer holiday then let slip that she was a bit tired from skiing that afternoon somewhere near Kingussie.
Had to get my son to hospital for an urgent eye appointment yesterday. Knowing what it was going to be like we set off at 7.45 for a 9.15 appointment to drive what normally takes about half an hour. We live at 1300 feet, and the roads can be pretty dodgy, especially the steep hill down to civilisation. Hilux, plenty of weight in the back, driving in 4wd, with descent control on for the steep downhills. The journey took about ten minutes longer than expected. All of the drivers we saw between Scapegoat Hill and Halifax were driving sensibly, some perhaps a little too cautiously, but better than binning it and blocking the road. We got to the hospital 3/4 hour early.
The journey home? Well, by now they'd all got up and headed onto the roads to cause mayhem hadn't they. We turned round a couple of times 'cos the roads were blocked by cars and trucks. We got back onto the steep uphill to the village, and could see that although the road was sort of clear, there were places where it drifts, and boy was it drifting. We had nearly made it to the 90 degree bend at the top of the hill when some old fella appeared in his little red hatchback. God knows what he was thinking, but he came at us out of the airborne drifting snow sideways on our side of the road, having completely failed to lose speed on the bend. I had to brake, going uphill, and he managed to fishtail it across the front of my car with inches to spare. Certainly cured my constipation.
Declared after that that it would take quite an emergency to get me back out in the car.
BMW 4X4's are ok though aren't they?
primarily because we’re mostly mountain bikers
Well yes, I do appreciate that was the most tenuous part of my argument
some old fella appeared in his little red hatchback ... he came at us out of the airborne drifting snow sideways on our side of the road ... fishtail it across the front of my car with inches to spare
either Mr Queef or ... "him", perhaps. Regardless, sounds like a boss !
On zokes post about us all being super driving god's...I think there is probably some truth about the impact of using a vulnerable method of transport on our roads and having an appreciation of traction, grip and half decent observations that influences your approach to motoring even before you take into account the do unto others bit of not close passing and understanding blind bends etc.
If you asked me to pick the 10 people I feel safest as a passenger in the car with all but two would be or have been regular cyclists. Mainly because they seem to spend less time distracted and plan ahead better. My social circle is not 80% cyclists...
I think that bmw via show the difference between tyre more than anything else! I’ve seen a Range Rover stuck on a tiny incline of very slippery clay due to lack of traction on its stupid low profile summer 22” rubber. There no way I’d say a Range Rover is a poor off road car, just kitted our badly.
We're right on the edge of where the snow got to yesterday in Surrey / Hants borders......bit of lying snow but only a few miles west and there are people stuck in their cars. Expecting more later, so not going out today.
I took the wife and her friend out last night - it was deemed that Sarah Millican @ Guildford is essential travel - and roads were slippy but my skills in my clapped out SMax with all seasons tyres coped admirably.
Only difficulty I had was due to someone else, and probably more correctly their inability to use their ****ing head properly*. We picked the friend up from her house which is on a residential / vaguely grid shaped housing estate road on a hill, which is a convex shape - starts off flat and kicks up at the end. Two roads away running parallel is a main road / bus route, which is a steady gradient the whole way up, ending at the same height where another main road runs perpendicular and across the top of the estate. I'd have thought it obvious that if you want to be in one of the side roads, you go up the main road and then gently down to where you want to be, but not the numpty fishtailing furiously up towards me in his 3 series.
* Although in fairness when we went up the main road my wife did ask me 'why this way?' and when told admitted she wouldn't have thought of it.
Same on my estate, which the local big employer uses as a spare car park. One steep road up into it, or you can drive a tiny bit further from town and loop back at a shallower gradient. Cue lots of people spinning out on the steep road...humans are creatures of routine and habit.
It seems all our local routes are clear, the lane at the bottom of my cul-de-sac (which links to a very busy thoroughfare) is clear..and in my bit the snow is only 2” deep and easily passable..
Ive just cleared my bit, and my driveway, and honestly shouldn’t have bothered as it’s easily drivable..
It is mighty cold though, the ice on my windscreen was about 3mm thick all over.. took ages to squirt/chip/squirt it off..
Im not so sure essential services will be that stretched down my bit, the roads are clear and seems everyone , bar one (who owns a large van rental business) , is staying inside and watching tv.
I have to admit I ventured out today in my FWD car, had to dig out the wheels to get moving and was doing alright aside from the knobs stood in the middle of the road, or indeed on a roundabout to take pics. Got Wifey to first patient but stuck on the way back. Couple of people helped push which was great, felt the need to explain why I was driving as it just looked stupid.
She had to hike back to her office now carrying a huge bag of dressings and stuff.
There's currently a Range Rover Sport (old type, big blingy wheels and ditchfinder summer tyres) and a Citroen C2 polishing the snow while stationary outside my place. They've been doing that for the last 1/2 hour.
Best car I've had for snow driving? A 950cc Citroen AX as it had skinny tyres and no power to get them spinning. Second best was an old '84 Audi 80 as it had skinny tyres (winter ones as it was a cheap winter beater) and a heavy lump of an engine right over the front wheels. Third best was my '04 KA for the same reasons as the AX.
There's someone currently clearing the snow off their Shiny, new M4. That should provide a bit of entertainment while I eat some toast.
I'm less than convinced by the abilities of modern 4x4s. The electronics seem to kick in just after you've lost traction. And the lack of road feel from all these disconnected systems mean it's hard to judge your traction by feel. I'm much happier driving a front wheel drive Skoda with snow tyres and chains than I am a massive heavy Mitsubishi