That’s got to be the weakest argument ever. Petrol costs me the same amount as it does our CEO, doesn’t mean I deserve the same wage as him/her.
Do you both undertake self funded travel around the world in order to earn your money? Do hotels and airlines discount prices for women?
As as I said before. It’s a bigger achievement for a bloke to beat 500 competitors, than for a girl to beat 100 competitors. so prizes should be linked to the size of the field.
Even if the majority of the mens field is made up of fat middle aged weekend warriors and the top 10 womens is the best going? (and yes blokes and girls - nice level of respect there....)
As as I said before. It’s a bigger achievement for a bloke to beat 500 competitors, than for a girl to beat 100 competitors. so prizes should be linked to the size of the field. Trailwagger than said what if the blokes brought more revenue etc etc
But you are confusing modern professional sport with amateur sports. Its a business, its about generating income and making profit. No-one cares how many people someone had to beat to win, they only care about how much they can sell an advertising slot during the half time break. That depends on audience size, not field size.
But if the women's field is likely to be fewer competitors than the men's (and let's be honest, that 's almost always the case) then the winning woman is likely beaten a significantly larger proportion of her field than then winning man has potentially done. No?
So if you're going to have prize money based on numbers of competitors, then at the very least it should be proportionate. so in that case, there's potential for women to be paid more in prize money....
I don't think the number of competitors beaten is significant. If an elite race has the best 1% in the country in both mens and womens races, the winners have beaten the top 1% regardless of whether the race has 20 racers or 50 racers. If it's a mass start race we are talking about then beating 490 odd wannabes isn't significant either. Beating the top 9 is though and that applies to both men and women.
...also, makeup is REALLY expensive.
Do you both undertake self funded travel around the world in order to earn your money? Do hotels and airlines discount prices for women?
Everyone I know pays for their own travel to and from their place of work. Why should a sportsperson be any different? Do you think the lower ranked men stay in the same priced hotels as the top ranked players? Or travel the same class?
…also, makeup is REALLY expensive.
Hahahahahaha
Here's one...would you offer a cash prise to the first woman to win a F1 race?
Why should a sportsperson be any different?
Your one fixed place of work?
http://www.atpworldtour.com/en/tournaments
62 Events in 31 countries, if you had to work in all those places would you pay for your travel?
Here’s one…would you offer a cash prise to the first woman to win a F1 race?
I think they already have one, in fact the whole idea of 'Grand Prix' is sort of based around winning a Big Prize 😉
62 Events in 31 countries, if you had to work in all those places would you pay for your travel?
No, but then the tennis players are free to work elsewhere, they are not employed by the ATP world tour are they?
So tennis players make a valid point and you chase around until you think you can get out of it?
I think they already have one
above the normal prize money?
So, say you're the new Bernie Ecclestone, and you've decided that you want more female drivers, so to encourage teams to attract female drivers, you offer £20million to the first female driver to win a GP, and £20million to the team, fair?
Here`s another one. Why, where there is no physical advantage to being a male, cant the women compete in the same event. Then prize money has to be the same no matter who wins. (snooker)
So tennis players make a valid point and you chase around until you think you can get out of it?
What? No, I am contesting that they have made a valid point in the first place.
(snooker)
Men have longer arms and bigger hands innit!
they are n<span style="font-size: 0.8rem;">ot employed by the ATP world tour are they?</span>
They sign contracts, to play in "x" numbers of tournaments a year, promote advertisers, sponsors and so on...so while they're not employees, they face significant penalties if they don't play, or choose other events rather than ATP events.
(and yes blokes and girls – nice level of respect there….)
Really?
You know what, that’s really annoyed me more than it should. That’s how the vast majority of people I know refer to themselves, so that’s the language I use, also saves repeating the same words over and over. Should I now tell them to only ever refer to themselves as Males and Females?
so yeah, gentlemen should get paid more if they’ve beaten more chaps than the slags have beaten sluts.
Snooker is open to men and women
Wow! surprised there isn't a thread on here about that "Steve Davies says women are no good at snooker cause they have babies!"
Wow! surprised there isn’t a thread on here about that “Steve Davies says women are no good at snooker cause they have babies!”
That'd be interesting.
62 Events in 31 countries, if you had to work in all those places would you pay for your travel?
Ah, so you think the losers should get paid as much as the winners then. Seeing as they have to do the same travelling. Only fair innit.
Ah, so you think the losers should get paid as much as the winners then. Seeing as they have to do the same travelling. Only fair innit.
As my nine year old daughter would say "Oooosh, you just got shrecked! "
But back to the serious stuff, it is a good point. Maybe the ATP so pay for travel and accommodation for the whole field, and deduct it from any prize fund?
If equality is the ideal why is there a separate women's chess championship. Are their brains different?
Why is there separate curling competitions when physical strength isn't an issue.
If equality is the ideal why is there a separate women’s chess championship. Are their brains different?
Why is there separate curling competitions when physical strength isn’t an issue.
And what about sports where men simply are not allowed to compete at all? Synchronised swimming, rhythm gymnastics?
You know what, that’s really annoyed me more than it should. That’s how the vast majority of people I know refer to themselves, so that’s the language I use,
Should I now tell them to only ever refer to themselves as Males and Females?
Well Men and Women, Boys and girls? One suggests an adult the other a child, carry on if you want but if people kept on saying Ladies and boys how would you feel?
and yes blokes and girls – nice level of respect there
Clearly the purpose of this little dig was to try to emphasis the point that you are a sexist pig and thus to discredit your argument..
Like you I rolled my eyes when I saw it..
if people kept on saying Ladies and boys how would you feel?
Do you both undertake self funded travel around the world in order to earn your money?
What is your point caller? Is that my colleague who does half the work of me deserves as much as me because it cost us the same to get there? Its not a great argument.
Shirley the best solution for everyone, including spectators, is to equalise the prize money, but keep the girls on best of three and add a couple of rounds of oil/mud wrestling.
Once they finish their shorter game they should have time to do a bit of cheerleading/promo work to top up their wages.
women getting more added than the guys?
I was going to pick up on women/guys for a laugh earlier... then ... 😆
That’s got to be the weakest argument ever. Petrol costs me the same amount as it does our CEO, doesn’t mean I deserve the same wage as him/her
You don't do the same job as your CEO, do you?...
You don’t do the same job as your CEO, do you?…
Prize money is the incentive, the commission. Sponsorship etc is the salary, so it could be that he does earn the same incentive as his the CEO.
I'm pretty sure his bonus is not the same as his CEO....
And if you're saying sponsorship is the salary, do you really think Simona Halep earns as much as Federer?...
Prize money should be proportionate to the revenue generated for the event simples. So if men get 10% of the revenue as prize money, then women get 10% of the revenue that their event generates.
This is how it works anyway.
Let women enter men's competitions if they want to win the big money.
Anyone want to try with mine with a colleague[ ie same job as it is with tennis] so why not try and explain that please. Two colleagues one is PT one is FT so one 4 hours per day one 8. The premise is that both deserve the same pay as it cost them same to get to work. Does anyone actually want to defend that ?
Its not an argument i would wish to try to defend.
And if you’re saying sponsorship is the salary, do you really think Simona Halep earns as much as Federer?…
No, I'm aware that it's different but that's not what we're talking about on this point, is it?
This is how it works anyway.
Not for the Grand Slams, it doesn't.
Like tailwagger, you're creating an artificial separation of men's and women's "events" that doesn't happen in the real world. The organisers of (say Wimbledon) don't put on men's and women's tennis that jut happen to be on the same day, they just have one event: Wimbledon...It has budget for prize money, and that's divided equally.
Tbh, I don't really care, argue away! 🙂
You don’t do the same job as your CEO, do you?…
No I don't and that's why he gets paid more than.
If a salesman generates double the sales of his peers then doesn't he deserve to get paid more? They all do the same job, but his performance makes more money for the company.
Federer generates more ticket sales/broadcast rights and advertising funds than any of the women, so why shouldn't he get paid more?
Not for the Grand Slams, it doesn’t.
Like tailwagger, you’re creating an artificial separation of men’s and women’s “events” that doesn’t happen in the real world. The organisers of (say Wimbledon) don’t put on men’s and women’s tennis that jut happen to be on the same day, they just have one event: Wimbledon…It has budget for prize money, and that’s divided equally.
I don't know how that would work out. No doubt women's beach volleyball tickets are more valuable than men's.
Let the market decide worth.
Like tailwagger, you’re creating an artificial separation of men’s and women’s “events” that doesn’t happen in the real world. The organisers of (say Wimbledon) don’t put on men’s and women’s tennis that jut happen to be on the same day, they just have one event: Wimbledon…It has budget for prize money, and that’s divided equally.
Just because its the same tournament, the mens and womens finals are still separate matches played on separate days to separate audiences
But the organisation, tickets advertising and so on isn't. and once the revenue for the whole event is sorted out, there's no reason not to just divide the prize money equally (which is actually what they do)
cool, huh?
But the organisation, tickets advertising and so on isn’t. and once the revenue for the whole event is sorted out, there’s no reason not to just divide the prize money equally (which is actually what they do)
Like the warmup act gets the same cut at concerts as the main attraction?
Oh wait...