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Repairing storm dam...
 

Repairing storm damage - how would you do this?

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[#13100063]

In the middle of storm Henk last night there was a loud clack noise in the garden and looking out this morning I can guess what it was. The big metal swing bench appears to have flown across the garden and wobbled the balustrade.

[url= https://i.postimg.cc/0ybpRccc/Fallen-Bench.jp g" target="_blank">https://i.postimg.cc/0ybpRccc/Fallen-Bench.jp g"/> [/img][/url]

Please ignore the weed. Any bright ideas on taking this apart ready to reconstruct it?

[url= https://i.postimg.cc/mZ9LqMYC/Fallen-Wall.jp g" target="_blank">https://i.postimg.cc/mZ9LqMYC/Fallen-Wall.jp g"/> [/img][/url]

The glass sheets are just about liftable individually but cannot be removed from the aluminium whilst it is twisted and under tension. I also do not want to break the expensive glass. The balustrade was bolted in place with bolts going about 1.5 bricks deep. The nearest bolts have been pulled out of the 2nd layer but further away you can see it pulled the second layer of bricks off as well.

I am thinking that if I can lift the broken wall, balustrade and all, back on top of the remaining wall then I will be able to deconstruct it more easily. Any ideas how to do that, or any better ideas?


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 11:45 am
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I spot Bambi and claim £5


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 11:52 am
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Haven't we been here before??

[or was that not you?]

Trolley jack under the bricks to lift them back up and shuffle onto the wall and then dismantle and rebuild with new brick and aluminium?

Or leave it where it is and angle grinder along the side of the aluminium to ease it's grip on each sheet of glass to make it easier to remove - then remove the bricks/aluminium and start again?

Please ignore the weed.

That's a really big ask!


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 11:52 am
Murray, fasthaggis, retrorick and 3 people reacted
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Cut the aluminium base where the glass meets so you only have to deal with x4 smaller sections?

Is attaching to brick ever going to be strong enough though? The glass is very heavy and the leverage on 1.5 bricks will be massive.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 11:56 am
thols2, fasthaggis, fasthaggis and 1 people reacted
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Can you get a small hoist, like and engine hoist on the end with the paving. You might be able to then move the hoist back and pivot the glass with bricks back on top of the wall?

Good luck and be careful.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 11:56 am
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Trolley jack is a good shout. I was thinking of a plank and leverage. [url= https://i.postimg.cc/xTt4Pfsh/Lift-Falled-Wall.jp g" target="_blank">https://i.postimg.cc/xTt4Pfsh/Lift-Falled-Wall.jp g"/> [/img][/url]

Cutting them into 4 might work but would look shit when I put them back together.

Have we been here before - Yes. It turns out that when the wall checked to see if it was strong enough, it was only checked in one area and that was bricks onto solid concrete. Unfortunately the rest of the wall base was not.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:00 pm
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Can you buy a team of rugby players some beer in exchange for putting it back?


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:04 pm
oldtennisshoes, retrorick, retrorick and 1 people reacted
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+1 on get some folk around to help in return for beer tokens....


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:06 pm
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Have we been here before – Yes

I thought he was talking about the ones out the front of your house that got smashed to buggary when he asked that (or maybe that wasn’t you).


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:07 pm
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i like the idea of a trolley jack under the end bricks while someone is at the same time pushing the top of the glass back towards the wall where it should be.  The problem with the plank is that there are two directions of force.  One is lifting the brick up but the other is also pulling it away from the wall.  At a minimum if you use a plank you want to screw in some sort of stop to avoid the glass/bricks sliding further down the plank as you apply force

I had always wondered if 1 1/2 bricks in was enough for the fixings especially as you don't know if the bottom half of the fixing is gripping properly if it hasn't been cleaned out well.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:12 pm
gt900uk and gt900uk reacted
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Cutting them into 4 might work but would look shit when I put them back together.

I'm not sure the aluminium channel is going to be reusable - it may be - depends on whether it has twisted.  I've only handled this type of balustrade before, am i right in thinking the glass effectively just drops in and is held by the seals?

while someone is at the same time pushing the top of the glass back towards the wall where it should be.

Sounds like a sure way to either bend the aluminium channel or break the glass - I'd be pushing/ pulling at brick level.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:13 pm
fruitbat and fruitbat reacted
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That was never going to work think applied mechanics and moments, if you never did this subject you may not have a clue what I'm on about but that height of heavy glass against one bed of mortar that looks like it's been infested by bugs and vegetation is like putting a heavyweight boxer against a flyweight boxer

I'm not a building engineer but served my time as a bricklayer and have an o grade in app mechs 


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:13 pm
Murray, fruitbat, fruitbat and 1 people reacted
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Smash it all up and chuck it away and it won’t be a bird strike risk ever again.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:18 pm
nt80085, ratherbeintobago, roger_mellie and 3 people reacted
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And for the rebuild, 1m of threaded rod fixed with resin into the new concrete foundation for the new wall. It might be worth redesigning with gaps between or under the glass panels to reduce the wind loading a bit.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:27 pm
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Can you break the bricks off the bottom, or would that risk the glass? I assume there's not a bolt through every single brick (?), so most should tap out quite easily just breaking the mortar. Just have something ready to catch the glass when the counterweight's suddenly removed!

Failing that, just move the swing to the other side and wait for a storm in the other direction.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:39 pm
fettlin and fettlin reacted
 5lab
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what are your plans for reconstructing it? I'd argue a baastrade that collapses when weight is applied is worse than no balastrated. I'd be calling the home insurance and getting someone to construct something thats better engineered


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:42 pm
fruitbat and fruitbat reacted
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Cutting them into 4 might work but would look shit when I put them back together.

I’m not sure the aluminium channel is going to be reusable

This ^^^ +1, chop up the rail (remove what bricks you can first as per Ossify) saving the glass, then buy a new rail is going to be the 'best' option. I've picked up one of those a panes, they are flippin heavy, so would not be looking at doing it alone. I'd support the whole lot (not just one trolley jack) before you even think of starting & TBH this seems like a recipe for another WCA spectacular.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:51 pm
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Why was there a bus shelter in your back garden?


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:52 pm
crossed, thols2, geeh and 5 people reacted
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Posted : 03/01/2024 12:56 pm
crossed and crossed reacted
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Aluminium channel isn't too warped as the glass has held it straight

Glass just drops into the channel and held in with spacers. There is a slight bulge in the aluminium where the support wedge in the middle of the section is under max load.

The balustrade was absolutely firm when put in, and for at least a year afterwards, I think that the gentle but repeated rocking in the wind cracked the mortar allowing the brinck to seperate, It is a little worrying that this is meant to be safe for use up to 3m off the ground.

The challenge with doing any pushing from the other side is that the ground is 5 feet lower and the bushes block access.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:57 pm
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I think the best approach is basically several people.
Something will break if you only lift at one point.

The other option might be that now you can get rid of your swing seat, support the glass and you've got a ready made, contemporary garden recliner.

Adobe_20240103_115600


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:57 pm
Murray, fruitbat, fruitbat and 1 people reacted
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Cutting them into 4 might work but would look shit when I put them back together.
just grow some more weeds to cover up the base


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 12:59 pm
thols2, ossify, leffeboy and 3 people reacted
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The rebuild will be something more solid. The bit that was checked before install was brick faced wall with concrete filling behind and soldiers laid flat on top. That was absolutely solid but appears only to have been used for the wall along the side of the garage. The rest was made with cheese. We had the wall along the drive professionally rebuilt when that collapsed, the bit by the garage was fine, so this is the only remaining original wall section.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 1:00 pm
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How about repurposing the glass into one of these?

What could possibly go wrong?


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 1:03 pm
nuke and nuke reacted
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It is a little worrying that this is meant to be safe for use up to 3m off the ground.

Probably is if installed properly - but if bolted to some shonky brick-work then I'm amazed it lasted that long!


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 1:05 pm
leffeboy, fruitbat, fruitbat and 1 people reacted
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Did you honestly think 1.5 bricks deep was going to do the trick? Was it it actually the storm or did one of your squirrels fart next to it.

That needs actually design to be safe not just half arsed*.

*I am aware of the futility 😁


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 1:06 pm
hightensionline, ossify, nt80085 and 11 people reacted
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Aluminium channel isn’t too warped as the glass has held it straight

But your turning it into a mammoth task, just trying to save the price of a (comparatively) cheap ali rail, stop being daft. Even chopping it up, is going to be fraught with danger (this assume some level of bodgery)


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 1:10 pm
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I’d get a piece of angle iron and put it on the underside outside edge of the bricks and lift/push that so you’re pushing it as a whole and not adding more twisting forces to the aluminium/bricks.
Jack the angle iron up maybe one panel in from the end nearest the camera and wheel/pry forwards to shimmy the whole lot on to the wall for dismantling.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 1:16 pm
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Most importantly, please video the operation from multiple angles for post injury analysis on here.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 2:58 pm
thols2 and thols2 reacted
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Hmm, got any old mattresses? Big duvets? Large bean bags? I'd be trying to roll that lot back over onto higher ground. Suction cup lifter thingy onto the glass panels, then ratchet straps back to the house/Porsche and inch it back over towards the swing. A couple of well positioned cushiony things to take the load as it goes over-centre and lie it down. at least that should take the twist out of the rail and you could slide the glass out.<br />But as others have said, that looks like beer tokens need to change hands, if nothing else as to have somebody on hand with A&E on the phone while somebody else stops the bleeding!


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 3:33 pm
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I would consider having the glass held in place by 'H' posts, which reach deep enough into the ground to counter the bending force from wind, and are as tall at the glass itself. I would not have the bricks taking the weight  of the glass, as the glass is essentially acting as a lever. Aesthetically you can still have the aluminum base in place but I would not attach it to the brick.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 3:48 pm
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That's ugly as hell as well as not fit for use.   I'd bin it.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 3:52 pm
crossed, nt80085, fruitbat and 5 people reacted
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Why not take the opportunity to replace that eyesore with some decent timber posts and stainless steel cable/rope so it's less of a bird killer. What a completely pointless bit of glazing.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 4:05 pm
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What a completely pointless bit of glazing.

But it shelters the chair/swing from the wind...


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 4:15 pm
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I'm afraid you've gone form over function with that balustrade.

Going for a frameless system might look slick but it would have been stronger if you had fitted a 'standard' balustrade with vertical posts between the glass panels and a top rail.  The vertical posts could have been mounted on the face of the wall which would have been much stronger than mounting on the top as has been done.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 4:21 pm
thols2, Murray, thols2 and 1 people reacted
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I think I probably said this when you were asking about fixing it down in the first place - don't assume that any brickwork joint can take a tension force. Even if it's good brickwork. It's the weight of the bricks that holds it together. You need bolts going down far enough that you have enough weight tied together to resist the wind (although in practice it would have help to fix the swing down too!)


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 4:23 pm
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I think you’re wasting your time trying to restore as is. I’d be looking to stabilise/secure the glass eg have timer frame to facilitate support/safe lifting/setting aside. I’d also be looking to remove the top course of bricks - replace with maybe a reinforced concrete wall into which the rail fixings are secured? I’d also be getting someone to work out some wind load calcs and finding some suitable fixings with a 200% load factor.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 4:25 pm
Murray and Murray reacted
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It looks like a bit of finesse wouldn't go amiss here. What about hiring the chap in the video here?

Christie Clock


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 4:28 pm
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The thought of you sticking two cars together to make one fills me with dread!!

😉


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 4:37 pm
 timf
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How about a scaffolding gantry, some of those glass suction devices that are seen on grand designs when they dangle huge pains of glass from a crane and some chain and winch devices to connect the gantry and suction devices and some careful co-ordination of the winching.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 4:49 pm
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Beaten to it by @toby1
Oh well.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 4:50 pm
toby1 and toby1 reacted
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Why not take the opportunity to replace that eyesore with some decent timber posts and stainless steel cable/rope so it’s less of a bird killer.
you are presuming this is supposed to be a wildlife friendly garden 😂


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 5:09 pm
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For the bird watchers or those worried about birds hitting the glass, loo just a little behind the glass in the second photo, the glass is transparent which might help, and you will see a tree and a load of squashed bushes. The bushes in the lower garden grow up above the brick work and the lovely little birdies flit about in them. That is one of the reasons we fitted the glass, to actually see them. In the 22 years we have lived here and the 10? years we have had the balustrade, there have been no observed bird strikes or dead birds found other than one pigeon that flew into our upstairs bedroom window pane. No, I am not moving to a solid brick bungalow on the off chance a sparrow flies into a pane of glass.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 5:49 pm
geck0, toby1, geck0 and 1 people reacted
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Is anybody bored enough to watch me...

 moving a solid brick bungalow on the off chance a sparrow flies into a pane of glass.


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 5:58 pm
reeksy, nt80085, kayak23 and 5 people reacted
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No, I am not moving to a solid brick bungalow on the off chance a sparrow flies into a pane of glass.

Based on the outside wall.. are you sure it's solid?


 
Posted : 03/01/2024 6:03 pm
fettlin, nt80085, nt80085 and 1 people reacted
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