Childless people... if us parents didn't have kids there'd be no-one to fund your pensions, care packages and wipe your back-sides when you are pensioners!!
I find that reference to this graph and a request that *their* little darlings pop around tomorrow morning with some Andrex generally shows up the lies in that sort of statement.
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and it's growth in society is a vile trend.Not only does it perpetrate the myth that having kids can only be a lifestyle choice for the well off but it is also a very short termist selfish attitude to take.
Perhaps there are things that are important and need to be respected, going away for a week isn't one of them.
the-muffin-man - MemberFFS - It was a comedy statement
Oh yes, I missed the smiley face you put in......
Hey Weeksy - some people with six year olds will be actually at work on Christmas Day, not just on call 🙂
shifter - MemberHey Weeksy - some people with six year olds will be actually at work on Christmas Day, not just on call
Rubbish in-laws too hey 🙂
First come, first served here, booking is no more than 6 months in advance unless for "special circumstances" that mean it needs to be planned further ahead than that (weddings generally, not much else has passed that test). Very few parents are unreasonable about this, those that are get very short thrift.
Like a few others on here, I don't have kids but am married to a teacher so I have the some restrictions on holidays, I see no reason I shouldn't have equal rights to those dates.
Bemuses me how people make it through days at a time without bbeing battered senseless... I can only assume they're not as arrogant in real life.
I suspect many people use STW as an outlet for their frustrations with life and as a place to smear their unhappiness where their real life friends and family won't have to witness it.
Should be sympathetic, but it's hard when some seem determined to be dicks about everything.
I know it's obvious but if people did not have kids then this country is up shit creek. Who is going to pay for your pensions, public services etc when you are too old a decrepid to work.
Or... If people didn't have kids then the planet might not be screwed. Bandying children around as if they're part of some noble sacrifice for the good of society is fairly ridiculous.
Perhaps there are things that are important and need to be respected, going away for a week isn't one of them.
"Going away" has nothing to do with it. Spending time with your kids has everything to do with it. It can be at home, or abroad or wherever.
Or... If people didn't have kids then the planet might not be screwed.
True, but it would also have no people on it.
this attidude...is a vile trend
No it's not.
Breeding is selfish.
If you wanted kids for altruistic reasons, you'd adopt.
what is this, rag week?
there's some selfish sods in here.
well you aint wrong there buddy.
I wanted mine just for picking up chicks at coffee mornings.
as somebody once said in an office I worked in if you want all the time off your kids do, be a teacher. 8)
weeksy - Member
I wanted mine just for picking up chicks at coffee mornings.
Living in Spain when my eldest was born - I got BANNED from going anywhere with her on my own....
Never seen a better way to be surrounded by lots of gorgeous women 🙂
Not even the Andrex Puppy comes close!
Why can't everyone just try and get along nicely?
That's what I try and teach my kids 😉
if us parents didn't have kids there'd be no-one to fund your pensions
I fund my own pension thank you very much
Imagine my surprise when I once had a minion ask me for time off to let his progeny ride a fat bike. You couldn't make it up.
As a general rule if "traditional holidays" need to be covered then it should be on a rota for everyone. For a lot of people christmas holidays are a time to catch up with family (parents etc). booking the year out on day 1 before anyone else gets a shot at the calendar is out of order too. Sob stories should also be reserved for real emergencies
This, FCFS is nonsense.
The fact your parents made sacrifices, financially, emotionally and physically is the only reason you even exist today !
It wasn't a sacrifice, it was what they wanted.
Breeding is selfish.
If you wanted kids for altruistic reasons, you'd adopt.
Can't fault logic like that!!!!!!
Crazyman 😆
It wasn't a sacrifice
Says the man without kids 😉
If we're getting into silly hypothetical scenarios. I wouldn't care if I'd never been born, because I would never have existed which is a prerequisite of caring about stuff.
I'm grateful to my parents for bringing me up but not for creating me in the first place.
a vile trend.Not only does it perpetrate the myth that having kids can only be a lifestyle choice for the well off but it is also a very short termist selfish attitude to take.
Steady on. I don't think nobody should ever have any kids. And I don't think I ever suggested it should be a lifestyle choice for only the well off.
I just don't happen to think the fact that somebody has chosen to have kids means it's more important that they get to go on holiday at a time that suits them. I don't feel that I or anybody else needs to make any allowances for that beyond simple courtesy that I'd hope would be extended whatever the circumstances.
I just don't happen to think the fact that somebody has chosen to have kids means it's more important that they get to go on holiday at a time that suits them
They don't necessarily go on holiday due to expense, however due to their child not being at school, they still have to take the time off either way at that particular time.
If you wanted kids for altruistic reasons, you'd adopt.
Want to explain that a bit more and tell me a bit of your understanding of adoption?
they still have to take the time off either way at that particular time.
I'm not aware of a legal requirement to take time off work when kids are off school, you need to organise their care but that's it.
I'm not aware of a legal requirement to attend the classics.
Having said that going on holiday minus the children does sound tempting.
Why the problem with people who 'choose' to have kids? You only exist because someone chose to have you. Being a parent is important, that can't be ignored. The country SHOULD damn well make an effort to support those who care for infants/children (e.g. parents).
I don't agree that holidays should be given to parents just to save them a bit of cash during expensive periods though. However I feel they should be given priority over 'normal' holiday requests if there are genuine childcare issues such as being unable to find someone to watch the kids during a particular period. Much in the same way that anyone with genuine pressing needs should get priority.
Exactly both are things people would like to do, not everyone gets what they want.
you need to organise their care but that's it.
@ £300-400 a week that's quite expensive though.
It's something to consider, especially as you would be very lucky to get the 13-14 weeks of leave to cover all the time your kids are off. It still doesn't mean you can have priority over somebody else for holiday time. Save the must have requests for when it's really needed.
@ £300-400 a week that's quite expensive though.
Not just that though is it? The school hols are the ONLY time of the year that parents will be able to go on holiday, or spend a decent amount of time with their kids. They are going to get shafted on pice to do so, but it's literally their only chance.
When nippers at school, you can be damn sure I'll be booking my hols on the 1st january.
A couple of points:
1) Re the OP
apparently its discriminating against those with children
is clearly nonsense and in fact the opposite is the case - the assertion is that the childless have less "dibs" on those dates so if there's any discrimination going on, its against the childless.
2) There seems to be a lot of confusion in this thread conflating the need for parents to book leave during school holidays and "going on holiday" with comments about how much that costs. Do those making those comments not understand that, for younger kids, the need to be on leave may well have nothing to do with "going on holiday" and everything to do with the fact that the kids can't just be left at home alone to fend for themselves and so, in households were all the adults are in work, someone's going to have to take leave to look after them?
Same with the comment a page or two back moaning about parents needing time off at short notice if their kids have "a sniffle" or something - what are they supposed to do? If the school sends a seven year old home poorly, they need an adult there, don't they? You can't just tell the school no one's coming to pick them up until normal time because work are being a bit sniffy about it. And lots of schools have policies about not allowing kids back for a certain period. If my youngest pukes in the dinner hall today, they won't let her back in school tomorrow. Either me or the wife is going to be at home tomorrow then. Employers have to be reasonable about this (legal requirement).
None of which goes anywhere near justifying banning of leave for the childless during school holidays, as appears to be the OP's situation btw.
Steady on. I don't think nobody should ever have any kids. And I don't think I ever suggested it should be a lifestyle choice for only the well off.
That is what is implied in the statement made which basically boils down to "you had 'em so they're your problem".
Having kids is part of society and our society should be set up to enable people to have children. I'm not suggesting it's not at the moment. And the balance has obviously been skewed the other way in the OPs scenario.
But threads like these bring out the most vile options from some people and it apprears to be a gowing antisocial trend and therefore deserves to be spoken about in harsh terms.
Like anything else - consideration is where it is at. Being thoughtful and flexible should be our default mode IMHO. As a parent I wouldn't suggest that parents should come first with holiday requests and haven't expected that myself. I can honestly say I've walked the walk on this one.
People without children might want to consider that without parents and children the economic and social systems would grind to a halt. Choosing to be a parent isn't necessarily a selfish choice - it's a more often selfless choice that requires a lot of sacrifice. Every time you use a service you are being served by someones offspring. Without these future adults who will look after you when you are in your dotage...?
Be considerate. Be thoughtful. Care about others and their needs as well as your own. Life is honestly better for all of us that way.
Parents know best
Close the thread, that's all we need to know.
jfletch - MemberThat is what is implied in the statement made which basically boils down to "you had 'em so they're your problem".
You can't extrapolate from this that "having kids can only be a lifestyle choice for the well off", that's just nonsense.
but it's literally their only chance.
They could choose to take their kids on holiday in term time. 😉
They could choose to take their kids on holiday in term time
You seen the fine you get for that ?
They could choose to take their kids on holiday in term time.
Naughty man!
You seen the fine you get for that ?
Is it more than the money you'd save by getting cheaper flights etc? 🙂
Bloody oversensitive bed-wetting breeders.
Choosing to be a parent isn't necessarily a selfish choice - it's a more often selfless choice that requires a lot of sacrifice
No it isn't.
Volunteering to work in an old folks home yourself would be selfless.
Breeding your own little Mini Me, as part of some global Ponzi scheme of ever increasing population, is not.
Someone has daddy issues.
People without children might want to consider that without parents and children the economic and social systems would grind to a halt. Choosing to be a parent isn't necessarily a selfish choice - it's a more often selfless choice that requires a lot of sacrifice. Every time you use a service you are being served by someones offspring. Without these future adults who will look after you when you are in your dotage...?
ok I'll admit it. I'm not a parent. not by choice, shit happens sometimes.
But the people I know who are parents (including my own, strangely enough), in the most have not had children [i]to provide for the rest of society, hoping that the rest of society will provide for them, in their later years[/i], but simply because they [i]wanted to have[/i] children. For no other reason than that.
(And in some cases, the children are happy accidents for people that hadn't planned on having any, but that's another story)
back to the OP as we've all gone way off topic here, I don't think it's fair of an employer to give first dibs on holidays to either parents OR non-parents. It's up to you and your colleagues to be fair [i] to each other first, before[/i] putting in any holiday requests.
