Answer - Hughes is far from a top class manager. Granted he made a couple of decent signings but I thought we got a pretty good run given that he was not the new regimes man. Agree the sacking could have been handled better.
If the City manager's post was vacant there would be a queue of real top class managers applying for it. Get paid millions and inherit a good squad plus funds to add players. Only managers with a real rapport with their current team - e.g. Jurgen Klopp - would not be tempted.
Having said that, the special one was paid off £25 million to * off having achieved more than any Chelsea manager for an eternity, and he'll be back there next season. Potentially he could do the same again. Ker-*ing-ching!!!!
I doubt Mancini will be walking away into abject poverty with 4 years left on his contract. Who's the mugs here? The managers? Hardly! The owners sacking them? Hardly! The fans who through the season tickets and TV subscriptions are paying for the pay offs?
You do realise, that staying in a management job as long as fergie isn't the norm?
Bayern have been through 4 or 5 managers in as many years, most top clubs only seem to keep their managers for a few years. How many of the top European clubs still have the same manager they did 4 years ago? Chelsea are very trigger happy and seem to average about 2 managers a season, city haven't done that.
And their is still nothing but press speculation that he will be sacked. Although it is looking likely, and I expect they wanted to wait till the end of the season before conducting business, these things do get out, just like fergies retirement (and Utd are famed for controlling the media).
There was nothing really bad in the way that they sacked hughes, just fergie took it as an opportunity to try and play games by calling it so.
Rich men's playthings only in this case (mostly) they happen to be other men. The only question they have to ask is whether the ultimate and inevitable humiliation is worth the flirtation, the brief moment in the light and, perhaps most importantly here, the pay check/redundancy award. There are plenty, for whom the answer is yes. It was ever thus.
Will be interesting to see if Moyes lasts past Christmas...
Would you, as a top class manager, want to go to a club that has just offloaded their manager in this manner?
Yes of course they would
The fans who through the season tickets and TV subscriptions are paying for the pay offs?
the personal fortunes of the owners are paying for all of this City and Chelsea operate at massive losses.
The Premiership average of 2.07 years is the highest according to this.
How can it be Fergie gives you 26, Moyes 11 and Wenger 15 so that is more than 20 x 2.07 or 40 years basically.
If you ignore them I bet the average is close to 1 year FWIW
Junkyard - lazarus
How can it be Fergie
Article doesn't go into enough detail to say either way, id imagine its accurate
Well I just named three managers alone give you more than that average and that is ignoring 17 managers 26+11+150/20= 2.6 years
That is the point it is clearly wrong as for the figure I dont know what it is but it is higher than that but skewed by those three
There was nothing bad about the way they sacked Hughes? Seriously? I'd love to see your definition of lack of respect then? He was walking out to the technical area of a critical premiership game. The press had been informed that he was to be sacked at the end of the match, so all the crowd knew, yet the management had omitted the simple courtesy of letting him know.
How do you think they could have managed that worse? Ignoring the fact that Mark Hughes is a legend, how can you treat anyone like that?
Would you fancy strolling into work tomorrow to find out that all your colleagues and clients knew you were going to be sacked, its just nobody bothered to let you know?
Real classy, that! 🙄
Hughes's sacking may not have been handled well - but I think the only person who could have possibily been surprise was Sparky himself. He may have made a coupkle of decent signings - but he also squandered a lot on money of players that were rubbish. He didn't built a team, have a lot of strategy.
And that has also be seen to the teams where he has been moved onto ...
Citeh (and Chelski) need to learn from the ManYoo and Arsenals of this world - get a good manager and allow them time and space to develop a real team. As we showed so clearly on Saturday, get a load of prima donnas together, and when it doesn't go well, they don't play their hearts out.
With the Mancini issue - neither side has behaved well - Mancini spoke about how he nearly left at the end of last season ... so maybe catalysed the owners looking elsewhere just incase he did the same , this season.
Bob the Manc has done a lot of good, but he does suffer the obsession of bringng in highly strung italian players into a league taht is not overly kind to the tempremental talent of Italy. He has also made some weird tactical decisions this season and seemed to be ok about the inconsistency - and pointing to the players. The Nasri issue should have never gone public, nor should fistycuffs with Mario.
It would be good to see him stay - and the communication of a long term plan from both sides about the future. They have been as bad as each other. But, at the end of the day it is big business - having won the FA Cup, then the league (in a scrabbley fashion), this year had to be the next step up.
As a Citeh fan of 40 years plus, second in the league is a great result (hell, I can remember when winning the play offs was like winning the champions league)but with squillions invested "they" want more
The comments about Barca and Bayern are ponient - both are far bigger than just the manager
As a blue I am massively disappointed at the way this has been handled - Peter Swales could not have handled it worse.
+1. As a City supporter, this appears to be par for the course at City. It's bizarre that they cannot look 2 miles across town and see the fruits of long-term stability, and how the United board, when forced to change manager, have planned for it in advance, and opted for the same model again.
Pellegrini may well be the best thing since sliced bread, but it's another season wasted as he reconstructs the squad to his vision. Whether he can attract decent talent is another matter, given that many of the best players also value managerial stability and owner loyalty.
If Mancini is genuinely shocked that he's being lined up for an exit, with his successor already in place, then he's got a pretty short memory. As its just a replay of his own appointment. And he didn't seem to mind when he was the beneficiary. I don't think he's that naive. Its now just politics.
I thought City would stick with him, to be honest. With the 5 year contract at the end of last season. Unfortunately it looks like they're going to be the same as Chelsea. An expensive plaything for an individual who isn't used to hearing the word 'no', and get whatever they want, without exception, and with not a care about the fallout for others. I want a Champions League Trophy! Why can't I have one!
You could be the best manager in the world, but a failure to deliver immediate results means you're out. The most honest thing Abramovic ever did was appoint Rafa as 'interim' manager. Every manager at Chelsea should have had that title. It'll be a shame if City goes the same way. Lets be honest. Its hardly healthy for football. Despite us losing last season, it was the best end to a Premiership season ever. Going down to literally the last kick in the last minute. Unlike this one that just sort of petered out
Peligrini has denied that he is going to city.
Is there anything more than media hype to all these rumours? They went after Wenger earlier in the year, then hounded Benitez, now it's Mancini's turn. I wonder what will happen to Moyes once a few results go against him, will the media be as deferential as they have been to fergie.
If it was just the media a quick and clear statement to quash the rumours would stop it all hence why Mancini said this.
twit is clear there is some truth to it
Ps lovely use of distraction (and largely untrue) re fergie he would be proud of such a tactic.
There is a great article in The Guardian which sums up what many City fans - including me - feel at the moment.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2013/may/13/manchester-city-fans-mancini
I'm not a fan of the sacking culture in football, but to me, Mancini hasn't cut it. He's proven to be woefully inadequate at man management, never came close to challenging for the title this season, and was embarrassed in the Champions league and the cup final. It's not good enough considering the resources he's had available.
He might not have achieved what was expected this season but last year he achived more than any City manager in my lifetime so he will always be a hero 🙂
"We always lose at home and we always lose away, we lost last week and we lost today, we don't give a f*ck cos we're all pissed up, MCFC OK."
Just when as a City fan you start to get used to winning the Man City of old appear - snatching defeat when it's least expected!
Just when as a City fan you start to get used to winning the Man City of old appear - snatching defeat when it's least expected!
I get the feeling that's the way it pans out. It's set in the runes. Whilst Manyoo always get the extra time and score and win we always snatch defeat from the jaws of victory
Whilst Manyoo always get the extra time and score and win we always snatch defeat from the jaws of victory
apart from last season of course when you scored and won the title in extra time.
still, let's not have reality get in the way of a good old hard luck story.
Yeah, the ref was as mixed as Robiniho was ... he thought the other Manchester team were playing 😆
Hell, it was our turn, and boy what a day it was !
apart from last season of course when you scored and won in extra time.
Pretty Steve Bruce's goals came pretty late when Utd first won the premiership...
& to be fair our goals against Gillingham in the division 2 play off final we quite late, almost as late as Utd's goals against Bayern in the same year..
With Man Citys team a bullish 1st Division manager could have done better. I'm sorry, I'm out. I wont be investing.
With Man Citys team a bullish 1st Division manager could have done better. I'm sorry, I'm out. I wont be investing.
Lets start the campaign here for Neil Warnock or Ian Holloway.
Yup definitely Ian Holloway.
& to be fair our goals against Gillingham in the division 2 play off final we quite late, almost as late as Utd's goals against Bayern in the same year..
I remember it well. I'd already switched the radio off and had to be rescued from a solitary sulk by the news it had gone to extra time...
Points for recruitment:
1. English as first language
2. No nonsense approach to characters within the team
3. A history of youth development
4. Continuity and protecting key players from overuse/injury week in week out.
So....
I remember it well. I'd already switched the radio off and had to be rescued from a solitary sulk by the news it had gone to extra time...
That
And thats where I was last year, as well!
New management at 3 of the top 6 this summer.
Possibly up to 5 ( I don't see AVB going, But Arsene could if they're 5th)
Plus Real, plus Bayern.
It's a good summer to be an available manager. There's gonna be a bit of fighting over the top ones.
My tip - Rafa to City.
Has experience, titles, and can spend big money fairly well.
With City's cash, he'd build a team to beat Utd for a good few years.
Would be quite amusing too, with his rivalry with "small club Moyes".
probably end up at Real though.
Finally put out his misery http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22507128
how much comp?? 😯
It was going to be capped at a years salary. But I guess it depends how much fuss he makes ( which will be a lot)
Sad to see it happen - but no building on last years and the Hart/ Lescott/ Balotteli / Nasri issues were all really poor man management. How long did he let Balotteli behave like an arse for ?
Whilst he may been poorly treated - he has recieved no worse than he dished out TBH.
Christ - I hope nobody is that desperate that they will consider Rafa. I would rather have Mark Hughes back ...
He's got four years left on his contract - why should he settle for less than that? If he'd buggered off to Real or Barca after an outstanding season I imagine City would be after substantial compo.
How long did he let Balotteli behave like an arse for ?
I'm amazed more of the squad didn't become misbehave after this and Tevez. Then again- it looks like it did, player/team moral?
The Tevez saga was ridiculous - forget the 'oh he came back and scored goals though'. After shoving him down United's throat it royally showed them up didn't it?
Guaranteed remuneration in finance = pure evil
The same in football = par for the course
I wonder what fans would really think if they knew the full details of players/managers contracts. Bonuses for this, that and the other including tying your own laces. Hard to imagine such a pi22 take in any other walk of life being tolerated by so many, for so long. Such a beautiful game!
Caio Bob, enjoy the well-earned (?) pay off!!!!!
He's got four years left on his contract - why should he settle for less than that?
Because he was sacked?
Why should he get any compo for not achieving the targets his employer set?
None of us would, that's for sure!
The term 'sacked' gets bandied around a lot in football, but I'm not sure it's the same as you or I getting dismissed for breaching our employment contracts. If his contract stated that 2nd in the league, CL qualification and FA Cup final was a sackable offence, compensation wouldn't be on the agenda at all.
He's getting replaced under a mutually negotiated agreement, so he will receive significant compensation. My view as a city supporter is that if the club wants the luxury of swapping around managers after what most clubs would deem a relatively successful season, then it should be prepared to pay heavily for that.
Agree but I don't think it was finishing runners up I think it was his decisions/management style this season?
If it was sooo close and just bad luck they wouldn't have heaved him.
Remember Chelsea - AVB? He made some pretty shocking decisions didn't he there?
Never mind all that. What I want to know is what the hell is a holistic approach to football?
[i]City said in a statement last night. “This, combined with an identified need to develop a holistic approach to all aspects of football at the club, has meant that the decision has been taken to find a new manager for the 2013-14 season and beyond.[/i]
Sounds like the management consultants have taken over the boardroom then. And we can look forward to the spouting of that kind of [s]twoddle[/s] well-thought-through analysis from now on. Which I personally think has been sadly lacking. I look forward to Alan Hanson and Lawro deconstructing that on MOTD 😆
[s]Binners[/s] Plastic Manc, start worrying if Chelsea don't get the special ****..... I don't think Utd would see the title for two years 😉 Saying that if Chelsea get the special **** you wont see the trophy for two years.. 😆
Well its got to be more interesting than this season, hasn't it? It says a lot that all the fuss is about Fergies retirement, and Mancini's sacking. As there's not much interesting been happening on the pitch
I think that the footballers agents will presently be rubbing their hands with glee, as the new/returning managers at City and Chelski flex their cheque-books
He's got four years left on his contract - why should he settle for less than that? If he'd buggered off to Real or Barca after an outstanding season I imagine City would be after substantial compo.
I dont understand why they dont put something in their contracts tbh it is disgusting what these millionaires get tbh and he wont even be out of work that long
Guaranteed remuneration in finance = pure evil
The same in football = par for the course
Well only one person has defended it i assumemost of think it is indefensible
I wonder what fans would really think if they knew the full details of players/managers contracts.
I know some contacts at Liverpool and the wages they play the reserves is staggering - they cannot get rid of them as they get paid so much never mind what the team get paid. I got told the wages were "much higher" than the media state.
Surely you commend them all and the free market for delivering this wonderful system as the market is never wrong - why not try and defend that rather than suggest other are hypocrites? Will i get some analogy now about a two footed studs up challenge for replying 😉
I shall claim I was simply Nani and there was no intent
TBH they way they all act I really struggle to follow football these days - it is all about money no matter what club and very few players actually love the club they play for and when they do they get treated like Lampard.
Possibly an interesting season with so many changes at the top.
Would go for the Special one tbh and Chelsea next year
Benitez to city would be funny but unlikely - he has gone up in my esteem this year he has done well at Chelsea IMHO
Moyes - has potential but he is stepping up in terms of challenge and he is untested territory re Europe and the pressure of challenging for things
Surely you commend them all and the free market for delivering this wonderful system as the market is never wrong - [b]why not try and defend that rather than suggest other are hypocrites? [/b]Will i get some analogy now about a two footed studs up challenge for replying
What a seriously odd comment. As you are well aware, the football analogy refers to when people chose to ignore the argument (the ball) in preference for attacking a person. I welcome challenges to arguments and would in this case. But for that to happen, you would need to focus on what I have said rather than making up a point (in his case a suggestion that people are hypocrites) for the sole reason of arguing against it. That is simply pointless (if you will pardon the pun).
The idea that football is a free market is patently absurd. As is well illustrated in this case, football is a massively uncompetitive market (in the business sense) with artificial barriers to entry created in ways that are of varying degrees of morality. Blimey, even the dozy organisation that runs the game can see that.
Junkyard - lazarus
I know some contacts at Liverpool and the wages they play the reserves is staggering - they cannot get rid of them as they get paid so much never mind what the team get paid. I got told the wages were "much higher" than the media state.
It not just the amount but the structure of the contracts that I find staggering. The hidden list of bonuses (eg, for simply playing in matches irrespective of performance or result) is breathtaking. Of course, in free markets all of this would be transparent leaving true fans with the opportunity to make their own assessment of just how real the "kissing the badge" gesture really is!
But for that to happen, you would need to focus on what I have said rather than making up a point (in his case a suggestion that people are hypocrites)
You would like to argue that post is not claiming folk are hypocrits [ call bankers names ignore overpaid footballers], good luck with that it seems to be your only point tbh and repeated throughout
Ah the nothing is really a free market defence 🙄 as that is true of every market though so you can always use it. Preyty sure the excesses in terms of wages,contracts, ownership and pay offs are down to supply and demand rather than say state intervention/legislation.
Well one of us needs a refresher course in what markets are or mean - you decide. If you want to claim that football (and the chronic mess that it is in from a business perspective) is an example of free markets then so be it. But excuse me, if I advise students not to follow suit. NB, there is no such thing as the, "nothing is a free market" defence. It is not an argument, merely a truism.
Who am I calling a hypocrite, really? I pointed out that the idea of fixed remuneration in one sector is often quoted as being the cause of the crisis (and termed evil) and yet similar structures (equally opaque BTW) are accepted in others. Thats not hypocritical, merely illogical.
It is hard to imagine a system for transferring wealth from the masses to a relative few (in an obviously regressive manner) than football. But if people want to make that choice, then so be it.
Does every thread need to be the same economics debate? 😉
Ok, my take on the economics.
The bookies agree with you, Rafa's 16-1 unlikely, whilst Pellegrini's 1-4 likely.
But I think it's out of those two myself, with Mourinho between them in the odds but going to Chelsea.
Interesting rumours about Pelligrini to Barca, with Tito's health probs meaning they're recruiting too this summer. Whatever the money offered, I'd say that's a far more enticing option if it's true.
[i]What I want to know is what the hell is a holistic approach to football?[/i]
Simple, they want an effective youth team set up so they don't need to buy so many players.
I've had my bet 🙂
Edit: Rafa's just come in to 8-1 as i typed. 🙂
