Agreed it's a variation on a theme
And another interesting example of something that has supporters across the political spectrum. And then the actual politicians bugger it up
Getting back on topic to the more pressing issue for Comrades Jezza and John, and Len, and Dianne... [url= http://news.sky.com/story/len-mccluskey-maintains-he-still-backs-corbyn-after-quit-prediction-10715702 ]They're definitely having trouble getting the piano up the stairs[/url]
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No doubt all the fault of plotters, traitors, Blairites, and those right wing bastards at the Daily Mirror
I probabiy wouldn't bother to work at that level.
Considering you work in finance I doubt that'd be a great loss 😉 The 20k figure is just a guess. I suspect it would be much less than that. Working out the amount is the hardest bit. It will take trial and error, and radical policies to control inflation, especially regarding rents and property prices via price and credit controls.
then the very harsh reality is we need less people.
Totally agree. But again that's not a policy that you can bring in overnight, unless we go back to totalitarian government and start banning procreation and killing undesirables. It's a known fact that richer societies have less babies. If you want to reduce the population, then a UBI could be a useful indirect tool with which to achieve it.
Totally agree. But again that's not a policy that you can bring in overnight, unless we go back to totalitarian government and start banning procreation and killing undesirables. It's a known fact that richer societies have less babies. If you want to reduce the population, then a UBI could be a useful indirect tool with which to achieve it.
All you need to do is to reduce the subsidies that parents get for their children (tax credits, etc ) - the parents themselves will then regulate how many children they have.
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the parents themselves will then regulate how many children they have.
Yes, of course they will. 🙄
Dazh, exactly I wouldn't work for fhe greater good of society. I would wear my altrusim medal with pride. 🙂
DrJ ultimately all the "work" could be done by robots abroad and we do absolutely nothing. How does that work, where does the money come from ? As for my population comment it's really just a logical extension of natural sustainable population levels. An "out there" thought but one of thise big issues we do need to think about.
Robots won't do everything by a long way. But they have and will continue to destroy old school factory jobs. Instead employees will need even better soft skills, along with creative and analytical skills if they want a job.
There is already a perceptive piece on this subject - Fragment on Machines by Karl Marx 🙂
exactly I wouldn't work for fhe greater good of society
I don't doubt that for a second! However the UBI isn't about that. It's about working for the greater good of yourself. Some people will only be interested in accumulating money and buying stuff, and they will continue to be able to do that by doing whatever job they can get which pays them the most. Many people however, will be more interested in quality of life enabled by having a more equitable balance between work, home, and leisure. The UBI creates the opportunity to do not just that, but also to find work which is interesting and fulfilling, rather than just paying the highest wage. The key thing is that you and everyone else will have a choice as to what sort of life you wish to lead free of the fear of falling into poverty. I guess that's crazy utopian rubbish though isn't it.
The key thing is that you and everyone else will have a choice as to what sort of life you wish to lead free of the fear of falling into poverty.
I've always wanted to lead a life lounging around at home doing nothing apart from occasionally trimming my toenails. This sounds ideal to me, as someone will pay me for it! ORSUM!
🙂
I probabiy wouldn't bother to work at that level.
I bet you would think of all that extra hot money looking for a place to make good returns, there would be mega money to be made.
I've always wanted to lead a life lounging around at home doing nothing apart from occasionally trimming my toenails. This sounds ideal to me, as someone will pay me for it! ORSUM!
Did you read my mind ? Who would have believed there'd be two of us ?
BTW I thought I'd do some cash in hand work, maybe some winter and summer holiday type work abroad too
I've always wanted to lead a life lounging around at home doing nothing apart from occasionally trimming my toenails. This sounds ideal to me, as someone will pay me for it! ORSUM!Did you read my mind ? Who would have believed there'd be two of us ?
BTW I thought I'd do some cash in hand work, maybe some winter and summer holiday type work abroad too
Works for me, too!
I guess I'm fairly close, I collect and deliver cars for a living, I'm transported to each delivery, except the first one, which is a car I take home in the evening.
The driving makes up about half of my working day, which can sometimes be up to sixteen hours, but the rest of that time I'm mostly napping in the back of the team car.
Easiest job I've ever had! 😀
And yes, middle class people will pay for it, one way or the other, whether they like it or not. That will be the price of their good fortune.
I'm sure all the teachers, nurses and doctors will react with unbridled joy at that suggestion.
I'm sure all the teachers, nurses and doctors will react with unbridled joy at that suggestion.
It's OK, I will be polite and thank them profusely for their efforts
Are you allowed to start businesses n shit? Or is the daytime TV while having a sexbot clipping your toenails compulsory?
Doesn't matter if you are allowed you'd just do it on the QT. Work abroad. Cash in hand, barter. Do that design work for a free bike, holiday ....
I'm sure all the teachers, nurses and doctors will react with unbridled joy at that suggestion.
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With all that time on your hands you may be even inspired to check some facts and get a clue!
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jan/03/finland-trials-basic-income-for-unemployed
All you need to do is to reduce the subsidies that parents get for their children (tax credits, etc ) - the parents themselves will then regulate how many children they have.
No they won't - they will continue to have children but have less money so the children suffer even more.
Sad fact is, there is more to stop you getting a cat from a re-homing charity than there is to bringing a child into the world.
Dr - I am sure that you had a rye smile at the political persuasion of the party introducing the Finnish trial!!
Back to poor old Jezza, with Fabians like this who needs enemies?!?
It's too early in the day for a rye smile - at this hour I usually content myself with a wry smile.
Those Fabians are just defeatists, next they'll be saying we need Blair back. Sod the principles we need to win. Corbyn has more chance than people realise, good portion of what he is saying will be supported by voters and the tory government is bound to mess up Brexit. Its the media that are against him and now surprisingly McCluskey. Mind he'll say anything to keep his job int union living of the backs of the members.
Bloody apple spell check Doc!
I know mt life's not fair is it - biased media, party, polls, unions etc. Why is it so hard to stay on message?
I read this last night, perhaps I should get out a bit more 😉
Can't win , can't be wiped out. The last part maybe optimistic as we've seen in Scotland, maybe not in 2020 but by 2025 ? Labour in a mess over Brexit and Tories taking votes from all the other parties. Low scenario of 140 seats and Labour typically underperforms mid term polls in actual elections.
Never a good strategy to rely on the other side messing up.
Anyway what would a mess up of Brexit look like? I can't see Corbyn coming up with the answers even if things are going down the drain. Mind currently FTSE100 is up and manufacturing sentiment is up, so things are looking okay.
Amazing what a large devaluation will do!!!
Labour might be in a mess re Brexshit but doesn't matter as mud will stick firmly with the Tories rightly or wrongly
Never a good strategy to rely on the other side messing up.
Have you missed the last 40 years of politics? The difference this time is both sides are messing up. I wouldn't be half surprised if neither May or Corbyn fight the next election. What odds on Balls vs Osborne in 2020?
What odds on Balls vs Osborne in 2020?
Very long ones
May is doing just fine, it's only amongst Labour voting Remainers she's unpopular.
I thought Corbyn would be gone after the Scottish elections, third place to Tories wasn't terminal though. Maybe he will struggle on till 2020. Hope so.
Its the media and voters that are against him and now surprisingly McCluskey.
FTFY
May is doing just fine
Give it time. She's making the same mistake as Corbyn, in trying to navigate a path between the two sides on brexit. Her party is far more divided than labour is on brexit and this will start to create huge problems for her very soon. Add to that the huge questions on her competence to manage such a complex problem (red white and blue brexit?), and her flimsy majority, she's on a hiding to nothing. At least labour are thrashing out their internecine demons early on when it doesn't matter, the tories haven't even started yet.
What voters are against him? He aint been put to the test yet. Scotland don't apply as they are side tracked in nationalism. Pity that as them seem to have some of the best politicians who can actually lead.
Hoping a divided Tory party will rescue Labour is 2020's version of banking on UKIP hurting the Tories in 2015.
The Tories are only divided on Brexit in terms of the type but in reality they all knows we will be leaving the Customs Union and THE Single Market. The Remainer Toires where the short termists just looking at the 2020 GE
Scotland don't apply as they are side tracked in nationalism. Pity that as them seem to have some of the best politicians who can actually lead.
Indeed. Shows what happens when people are offered credible politicians to vote for, instead of the usual sock-puppets. They've even got a likeable Tory. And I never thought I'd type those words.
There was a great quote from Ruth Davidson in the paper last week as one of the quotes of the year. On being told she was to be on Question Time with Angela Eagle, said "What? Are you sure they want two shovel-faced lesbians?" 😆
oh god - you're making the mistake of believing headlines. It's spin. If you read what he actually said, he was trying to defend Corbyn. He has since sought to clarify on twitter, but unfortunately all the media do these days is trawl for comments that they can spin against people.ts the media that are against him and now surprisingly McCluskey
Hoping a divided Tory party will rescue Labour is 2020's version of banking on UKIP hurting the Tories in 2015.
And the tories hoping that labour continues on it's current course isn't the same?
A lot can change in a couple of years. Brexit is a poisoned chalice. May is already looking completely out of her depth and nothing has happened yet. Labour doesn't need to hope that the tories tear themselves apart, they just need to sort out themselves, and I still believe they will before the next election. May is making a huge mistake in not going for an early election. In a couple of years we could easily see a new populist labour leader with a resurgent and united party behind them against a tory party who are still bickering about whatever fudged brexit deal they manage to squeeze out of the EU and whose fault it is.
Daz I don't think the Tories are thinking that. They are keeping quiet so Corbyn remains in place then they will give it the maximum Tsunami force tidal wave in 2020.
What? Are you sure they want two shovel-faced lesbians?"
That's brilliant and she's great. The more you see Thornburry and Abbott on TV the more ****ed you know Labour are. I've mostly lost my Sarf London twang but they are both far posher than me.
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I don't know why we bother with elections when polls are so reliable.
Jez 2.0
That's the Huffington Post headline. Apparently tye re-brand includes him dropping his insistence on freedom of movement. Principals eh and what will Diane say ? Postive on Brexit possibilities too.
If true, then shame on him.. He did at least have conviction on this issue but the nail is well and truly in the coffin of conviction politics now (if that ever existed beyond the soundbite). If these articles are to be believed, then they are in a total mess on the issue, more so than the Tories.
Srabbling about in the gutter and at the feet of the xenophobes is a sad and desperate development. Shame.
TMH
Srabbling about in the gutter and at the feet of the xenophobes is a sad and desperate development. Shame.
Says a Tory lol. Election pledge for migration down to 100k? Ring any bells?
I dont see anything in those articles that gets near to xenophobia.
Jamba
Apparently tye re-brand includes him dropping his insistence on freedom of movement. Principals eh and what will Diane say ? Postive on Brexit possibilities too.
Seems a logical position to me just turns the screw on the Tories everso slightly.
"those are my principles and if you don't like them.. well I have others"
It seems that Comrade No. 1 can't even follow the right Marx.
😆
Jezza's gone full barmy 😯
He is going to propose a maximum National Wage ! As Sky says how will that work in the Premier League (or Formula 1, Tennis, Golf ?)
As I have said the quickest way to improve income inequality is having all the rich people leave, Jezza seems to have taken up my suggestion.