[Closed] iDave Diet Joinee

"I'm saying eat carbs all the time in generous quantities not just after intensive training sessions"

The worlds leading authorities on sport and endurance performance would say that's incorrect. You may do that, good for you. You may think that because you do it and your slim friend does it then your thoughts on how we metabolise different food types is 'right'. You'll find that the people who are performing at the highest level in endurance sport are not doing as you do.

double post

An ironman winner lived in my house for six weeks to benefit from the climate and training conditions, I know exactly what he ate. His day started with the biggest bowl we had in the house filled with mûesli covered in half a pack of cheap sweetened yoghurts. It continued with what we were eating but even larger quantites of pasta. You'd be hard pushe to find a higher level endurance athlete. Madame, the lady in the pic is an ex-French winter triathlon champion BTW.

Sorry, what does that prove about your thoughts on how we metabolise different food types? You know a triathlete who eats muesli so insulin acts differently on carbs than would appear to be the case? Skier eats bread and is slim so leading pro cycling teams should re-think their nutrition?

EDIT: I see you haven't even read the iDiet instructions before looking for scientific evidence.

Ive been trying to establish exactly what diet information there is, it appears theres more than ive already been offered.

Oh, 🙄

Edukator.. for the 50th time.. we're all different. Michael Phelps eats tons of crap and is not fat, so what?

You're not adding anything useful to this thread.

You'd be hard pushe to find a higher level endurance athlete.

I think iDave knows some.

So the iDave diet is what leading pro cycling teams do? I think not. If you have the nutritional plan for a pro cycling team then post it up.

Ever heard of "4:2:1"? We don't stick to it religiously but it was the basis of French olympic squad nutrition years back and suits us fine. I have paper copy soemwhere.

4 parts carbs
2 parts protein
1 part fat

In calorie terms. The protein is then divided between meat, vegetable and dairy proteins and the fat between dairy and vegetable. Plenty of scope for bread, chocolate and yum, yum.

iDave promotes carb intake before and after strenuous activity. Im sure an IM counts as strenuous.

(struggling to think of French olympic champions..)

Ever heard of "4:2:1"? We don't stick to it religiously but it was the basis of French [b]olympic squad[/b] nutrition [b]years back[/b] and suits us fine

Highlighted the important points for you.

iDave promotes carb intake before and after strenuous activity

er, no he doesn't.

I suppose you've joined the happy band of commentators who post "facts" based on their own prejudice, but without having taken the time to read the source.

er, no he doesn't.

I suppose you've joined the happy band of commentators who post "facts" based on their own prejudice, but without having taken the time to read the source.

Sigh.. here we go again.. the annoying prick

This argument about knowing someone who did something different and still succeeded is the biggest load of bollox going, and by that i don't mean that i don't believe you, but it's anecdotal and doesn't substantiate a thing, where's your control?

Think pataphysically, Chutney. Don't eat too much chutney though, mostly fast sugar, now that will upset your insulin balance.

To train for an ironman you maintain a level of activity most would define as strenuous six days a week so why wouldn't carbs be the main source of calories every day, SlimJim? My friend averaged a half ironman a day for the time he was with us (edit a bit more in the pool and on the bike, a bit less on foot).

I used to do 12 000km on the bike, a couple of thousand on foot, a few hundred swimming (I'm a lousy swimmer) and a serious volume of X-C skiing through the Winter. Cutting carbs quickly resulted in grinding to a halt though fatigue, illness or minor injuries.

Creo que podría estar en lo cierto, Don Simon 😉

Now where's that bloody matador smiley....

"Cutting carbs quickly resulted in grinding to a halt though fatigue, illness or minor injuries."

iDave diet isn't based on cutting carbs. Just changing the type of carbs. Duh. You really don't know anything about it do you?

Also the French Olympic team don't use 4, 2, 1 and haven't done for a long time.

Still, keep reading the magazines.

By the way, one of the top ranked UCI world tour teams didn't have much pasta or muesli on show at their training camp - job opp there for you.

You do know that you can't complete an ironman fueled just by carbs don't you? And that taking carbs too close to the start will limit fat burning during?

job opp there for you.

😆

Finally I wrote many times in magazines and books about the importance of eating loads of carbs for endurance performance, and eating a low fat diet for weight-loss and guess what? I was wrong.

Well post it up then, iDave, especially the diet plans you have from pro cycling teams. If you are in favour of eating generous amouts of bread, müsli and pasta on a regular bassis (not just after intensive training) then I will agree I don't know about your diet and will leave the thread.

If you refer back to my early posts on the thread I make it clear that I consider bread, pasta and müesli an important part of nutrition. I am promoting their use as fuel for athletes who want to feel good, perform well and maintain their "poids de forme" (racing weight?). You seem to be against these foods. Sorry if I've misinterpreted, the debate can continue if I haven't.

iDave - Member
"Cutting carbs quickly resulted in grinding to a halt though fatigue, illness or minor injuries."

iDave diet isn't based on cutting carbs. Just changing the type of carbs. Duh. You really don't know anything about it do you?

the pwnage is strong with this one

Sarcasm, irony and mockery don't work in type as people have no idea what you really mean, iDave. Is ther eanything usefull in those two lines or would they best be ignored?

"I am promoting their use as fuel for athletes who want to feel good, perform well and maintain their "poids de forme" (racing weight?)"

Where are you promoting their use? Do you know how different carbs result in different insulin responses and what the consequences are for energy delivery and fat storage? If you don't WTF are you trying to argue for?

Who are your successes in either weight-loss or sports performance?

Well post it up then, iDave, especially the diet plans you have from pro cycling teams

I've never posted pro team info DS, it belongs to the teams. They paid for it see.

I don't think idave has said it's a non carb diet, just to stop eating certain carbs. I've done this for 5 weeks now and shifted 5 pounds, not great you might say in weight loss but that's not what I wanted, I'm happy with my weight but hate the feeling I get when eating stoge. I find the rules easy due to the fact I'm a chef and don't tend to eat rubbish anyway, but I've found since giving up anything sweet I've being fuelling up in a different way and that is eating more food, which my PT is happy about as I never eat enough. So more food equals less body fat, I'm happy at that.

Could you answer the questions in my previous post please, iDave:

"If you are in favour of eating generous amouts of bread, müsli and pasta on a regular bassis (not just after intensive training) then I will agree I don't know about your diet and will leave the thread." Well are you?

"If you refer back to my early posts on the thread I make it clear that I consider bread, pasta and müesli an important part of nutrition. I am promoting their use as fuel for athletes who want to feel good, perform well and maintain their "poids de forme" (racing weight?). You seem to be against these foods." Well are you for or against?

Think pataphysically, Chutney.

'Pataphysics isn't exactly going to help me decide what to have for my tea though is it? Is it big word tuesday?

Do you know what schizotypal means?

If you refer back to my early posts on the thread I make it clear that I consider bread, pasta and müesli an important part of nutrition.

I suppose you've joined the happy band of commentators who post "facts" based on their own prejudice, but without having taken the time to read the source

for
more
than
60
minutes,
take
on
board
30
grams
carbs
per
hour
during
the
exercise.

more
than
90
minutes,
take
on
board
30
grams
carbs
90
mins
before
the
session,
and
30
grams
per
hour
during
the
exercise.''

(cut/paste fail)

Fairly conclusive in my eyes that carbs are recommended on the plan, no?

Careful, you'll be getting the rolling eyes.

it appears bread, pasta and muesli in large quantities makes you argumentative. have an onion bhaji, edukator

I'm against generous amounts of grains, pasta, rice, potatoes etc. Yeah. Very much so. Exception would be in the first main meal after a long hard session, but there are much better choices.

So you answer my question - do you understand insulin responses to different types of carbs? You might be asked at your interview with the pro/olympic teams.

@iDave, The insulin part youre talking about,Is that part of the krebs cycle ?

Ever heard of "4:2:1"? We don't stick to it religiously but it was the basis of French olympic squad nutrition years back and suits us fine. I have paper copy soemwhere.

4 parts carbs
2 parts protein
1 part fat

Though as I understand Mark Allen (who's won the odd triathalon) follows

4 parts carbs
3 parts protien
3 parts fat

So carbs only make 40% of his diet. Seemed to work ok.

Fairly conclusive in my eyes that carbs are recommended on the plan, no?

So I have understood, and we disagree. I've seen some graphs of insulin responses to different types of carbs. They've convinced me to reduce my sugar intake but not grains, pasta, rice, potatoes etc. They also mean I favour avoine (porridge grains) in the morning (hence the müesli) but nibble little sandwiches on the bike during an effort. Potatoes being reserved for an eveing meal. You were talking about pro cycling teams, well I've seen pro cyclists sat around the table eating pasta and salad with my own eyes (and not long ago).

Challenging iDave is bound to create waves, CaptJon. The insults on the last couple of pages aren't from me. iDave is also remaining civil. He is not the only nutritional expert and there is no concensus among endurance atheltes that the iDave diet is the best as he implies.

The iDave diet as used here by biffers isn't and never has been for elite level endurance athletes in the form it has been given away here. But elements of it are very valid are are used. The last plan I wrote, just last week, was for a 2 x rainbow jersey holder.

I've seen pro cyclists eat pasta too. Can you base your argument on evidence based knowledge rather than what you've seen some people do? I've probably seen more pro athletes have meals than you have. Breakfast at an Olympic games is quite busy.

The iDave diet as used here by biffers

"Biffers"? I don't think that's a compliment.

"evidence based knowledge" so evidence as seen with my own eyes doesn't count, but yours does.

Keep up the guru work.

I once saw a pro rugby player drinking beer. Will drinking beer make me a 190cm, 110kg egg throwing athlete? 'kin huge he was too, I thought he was drinking halves until I got up close!! 😯
Edu, you still haven't answered my question.

If you could eat something that gave you the benefits of the bread, pasta and muesli but without the crap that offers no benefit, would you still eat the pasta, bread and muesli?

Edukator you do know he's a professional top level coach don't you?

I was going to come back with more arguing but it doesn't seem to be necessary.

more than what?

you should eat enough not to be hungry

Hmm, today it was 2 boiled eggs for breakfast, 0.5 litre of ratatouille/bean stew (I.e a flask full), 0.5 m&s £2 bag of mixed nuts (almonds/brazil/hazel/walnut), some peppered mackerel (75g?), 1/2 pepper and some peas. Glass of red (dulls the hunger).

Sunday was 2 boiled eggs and 2 big plates (5-6 ladles full) of lentil/split pea soup. Might have had a couple of carrots and .5 tub of hummus. 2 glasses red.

do I feel hungry? Yeah I guess I do. But not ravenous. It was not feeling hungry is what got me here in the first place!

Yes, Molgrips. And?

Easy on the nuts metalheart - they can very quickly sabotage weight loss, I've been there. Donm't have more than a couple of modest handfuls a day imo.

I've eaten well today, plenty of slow carb food but I still feel hungry. My problem on this diet is eating a lot and still feeling hungry yet not at the same time.

Yes, Molgrips. And?

Well, it seems a bit odd that you are citing what you've seen people eat as evidence in an argument against someone who trains top athletes for a living. Doesn't it?

Where does it say that carbs are not permitted or not recommended on the plan in general?

are you getting confused between complex and simple carbs?

Did you know David Millar used to drink a litre of coke after every ride? at least i think it was him.

Where does it say that carbs are not permitted or not recommended on the plan in general?

here:''No [b]white [/b]carbs

It says no white carbs, there are other kinds. You can (and indeed probably should) eat as many of those other kinds as you like.