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hmm, Teslas still have the best range for long runs – even the top end brands are a bit disappointing.
This belongs on the EV thread really but no they don't. They are decent but not the best overall. Tesla tell bigger porkies about range than some other manufacturers do, and they allow you to charge to 100% which deteriorates the battery so their range comes at a cost.
https://insideevs.com/reviews/443791/ev-range-test-results/
Porsche got much better range than the WTLP, an astonishing 35% more in one case.
Could he be a massive genius? If he wants to take Tesla private again - sell all your shares whilst it’s outrageously high, use some of that money (and other peoples) to buy another, very public company and systematically ruin it and by association decrease Tesla’s stock price. When the time is right, buy all the stock back, restore normal service to Twitter and he gets Tesla back, can sell or keep Twitter and has hundreds of billions extra too.
Or is he a massive idiot?
Or is he a massive idiot?
Occam's razor
It’s still quite hard for the automotive industry to let go of its embedded ideas and processes. That’s not to say that Musk wasn’t just lucky picking a technology that was going to take off anyway and somehow had a team that wasn’t completely hooked on automotive industry thought patterns (which may have predated Musk, I’m not sure).
The Tesla Roadster was based on a Lotus design. Tesla's chief designer was hired from Mazda. He apparently worked for GM and VW before that.
When it comes to high-quality mass-production, Tesla need to look at industry leaders and learn how they do it.
Interesting to see a lot of US brands at the top. Not something I was aware of. Always thought the likes of Toyota, Mazda etc,. were up there but they seem fairly poor in that measure.
kerley
Free Member
Interesting to see a lot of US brands at the top.
Indeed. Some of those brands at the top used to be at the bottom. My scepticism senses are tingling.
A lot of the Top US brands are utility vehicles with a lot less to go wrong and when they do go wrong, it doesn’t stop the vehicle functioning, so it’s still doing its job. Also a lot of lease vehicles in the US are returned after the 3 year lease when the vehicle is out of warranty. Also, many US brands only warranty the power train. Tesla are 4 years and more comprehensive.
My scepticism senses are tingling.
The problem with car quality comparisons is that only the manufacturers have detailed information about their own vehicles. AFAIK J.D. Power uses customer reports of faults, but a critical fault and a minor one both count towards number of faults per vehicle. Cars with complex infotainment systems are apparently more likely to be reported as faulty than simple ones. However, somebody paying 50K for a car does not expect to find bodges like this.
https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/314871-tesla-model-y-owners-confused-to-find-wood-bracing-car-components
might help if you actually provided some context to that chart!When it comes to high-quality mass-production, Tesla need to look at industry leaders and learn how they do it.
The “problems” recorded are surveyed from owners and include - and also seem to give equal weight to - things like the wheels falling off but also niggles with the infotainment system, driver aids and “driver experience” whatever that means (but sounds subjective!). They specifically point out that [i]all[/i] BEV cars have more of these issues than ICE cars and when you consider just these, Tesla are actually better than average (226 PP100 for Tesla vs the average of 240 PP100 from non-Tesla manufacturers)
They also point out Tesla are improving year-on-year, here is the up-to-date chart… you might notice Teslas now have [i]less[/i] reported issues than some of STWs most beloved brands - Audi, VW, Volvo
[img] 
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might help if you actually provided some context to that chart!
The “problems” recorded are surveyed from owners and include – and also seem to give equal weight to – things like the wheels falling off but also niggles with the infotainment system, driver aids and “driver experience”
You mean context like the explanation I gave in the post just above yours that said basically the same thing you said?
A lot of US cars are of very basic construction so they don't go wrong at first, but later in life they do. Remember that survey is subjective, not a methodical analysis of actual reliability.
Remember that survey is subjective, not a methodical analysis of actual reliability.
Yes, as I discussed above. However, it is a reflection on customer satisfaction - customers are reporting things that they believe should not have happened.
apolgies, didn’t see your much-later follow up post after you’d already realised you were wrong 😉You mean context like the explanation I gave in the post just above yours that said basically the same thing you said?
Going back to twitter, looks like Elon's decisions may be enabling the Taliban to legitimise themselves on the platform now.
https://www.theregister.com/2023/01/17/twitter_blue_taliban/
Tesla tell bigger porkies about range than some other manufacturers do, and they allow you to charge to 100% which deteriorates the battery so their range comes at a cost.
Not a fan of Musk, but I'm not sure you're correct on that.
Back when California was struggling with power issues they did an over the air update to unlock the cars to higher capacity. Which infers that the standard range quoted doesn't use all the capacity.
This is funny, but the underlying problem isn't - Bluechecks used to indicate a confirmed person so you knew who was posting and whether to trust them. That's gone now so Twitter's value as a news aggregator is probably going to fade as it gets overrun with fake celebrity accounts promoting fake news, or just running scams.
https://twitter.com/benjaminwittes/status/1642362345614606336
Came across this article today and then noticed this thread as popped up again so it must be fate:
I remember reading that Tesla was going camera only a few years ago and thinking, 'That doesn't really sound feasible' but at the time I thought Musk still might be relatively smart and not just a ego manic fantasist.
So maybe my understanding of AI and data-processing was letting me down (which was weird because with my background in AI systems I actually tend to be more optimistic than most when it comes to self-driving technology).
Good to know my instincts weren't that far off.
Yes, it reminds me of when Apple tried to go fanless on Macs and they had overheating problems. AFAIK, Steve Jobs demanded they make a completely silent computer and the engineers were too scared to tell him they couldn't do it.
Not surprised they tried, I had one of the CRT iMacs and you could hear it in ten next room.
Whilst these stories sort of help push my Anti-musk schadenfreude to new heights, none of it really changes the fact that the guy is still in post (X3).
If I was an investor in any of the companies he's cuckooed his was into operating I'd be demanding his replacement or pulling my investment out while there's still some pumped up value to recoup.
Twitter doesn't really matter, he's doing what he was always going to do, turn it from a "social media" app into an electronic loudhailer for wealthy individuals and corporations, it was always going to die, Elon has just sped that process up, let's reserve it a spot next to 'myspace' in the interweb graveyard...
Tesla? Have squandered their headstart by focussing on tech-bro toys and neglecting build quality and/or affordability, the lumbering dinosaurs of the motor industry are catching up, and China is coming in strong to steal their lunch, that's why the US is about to double down on protectionism for native companies...
Space X? If you divorce the company from Elon's Martian escape fantasies they're a viable company, they've got various contracts with the US government and commercial companies want to use their services, they just need the CEO to SFU (or stand down) and let them crack on...
Basically he's a liability and I wouldn't want my money tied to him...
If this is true
I'd call that a rapid unscheduled disassembly of your business model
https://twitter.com/jdan/status/1649466728542347266?t=p4S768PTfsKYj-VBgsXf_w&s=19
https://twitter.com/oneunderscore__/status/1649553480946786304?t=DX7xdi7gz5twG2ND6q3JTQ&s=19
Wtf he launched it on 4/20 to please all his pothead fanboys?
https://twitter.com/Tazerface16/status/1649443447164776450?t=Ca0vbrkgGJlbjmVIB24sUw&s=19
Power Mac Cube looked amazing though.
It did, it looked amazing. I don't think customers complained about the visual design side of things.
Wtf he launched it on 4/20 to please all his pothead fanboys?
Lucky it was delayed by two days...
Christ, what a freak.
Hes gone full george soros antisemtic conspiracy theory today..
which wasnt the play I was expecting
https://twitter.com/washingtonpost/status/1658488899923222533
None of his fans or supporters want to comment on the fact that Elon's Twitter feed is essential one long ant-Semitic far right conspiracy theory crack-pipe then?
I genuinely think he smokes too much weed
Why is it that whenever Elon uses the word humanity, Dr Strangelove comes to mind?
When it comes to floating and leaning into conspiracy theories he is the new Donald Trump.
Last week, after the Texas mass shooting he was responding to false flag conspiracy theories with responses like; "Oh really?"... "Sounds interesting"... "We need to know more" and suchlike.
The man is scum.
I genuinely think he smokes too much weed
no way would he be down on working from home or as animated if he did. Perhaps he’s not smoking enough?
He just seems like a massive dickhead. Not dissimilar to Steve Jobs. Egotistical, narcissistic man child who takes credit for the genuinely hard work of others.
Can anyone name a ridiculously wealthy / powerful visionary etc that doesn’t have flaws?
I think it is par for the course.
From what I know about him - I’d rather have him on this planet than not.
His concerns about AI are interesting.
Can anyone name a ridiculously wealthy / powerful visionary etc that doesn’t have flaws?
I think it is par for the course.
A lot of highly successful people are unpleasant, or so I gather. Musk is much more than just unpleasant, he's an utterly unprincipled **** who pretends to care about free speech, etc. but cozies up to murderous tyrants when he thinks it will be profitable.
Also, I think his accomplishments are overrated by his fanbois.
I have a couple of pals who come out with the same nonsense as Elon, different social circles but what they have in common is spending all their spare time on 4chan smoking the strongest weed they can get.
Today I've learned that some folks are buying a blue tick and then uploading hours and hours of footage, of their dog roaming around in the park, their kids, football matches, whole telly programmes, porn you name it.. to Twitter...The cost of which to Twitter to store obviously vastly exceeds the price of the blue tick.
Online storage for as much data as you you want for as little as 0.30c a day. He's a genius, that Musk
Can anyone name a ridiculously wealthy / powerful visionary etc that doesn’t have flaws?
Sure I can forgive pretty anybody's taste in clothes or music or even the people they date, or how entitled they act. What shouldn't be ignored that his views and outpourings on Twitter are at the very least signalling to the very worst sorts of scum who wouldn't mind at all if the US was turned into a wasteland so they can live in a white entho-state.
That's not really a "flaw"
I have a couple of pals who come out with the same nonsense as Elon, different social circles but what they have in common is spending all their spare time on 4chan smoking the strongest weed they can get.
Equally I know plenty of folk who smoke too much weed that don't come out with the sort of shite he does. Because they're not massive ****s.
The undeniable fact that people are flawed is a very strong argument about the fetishisation or even existence of the billionaire class. It's outrageous that a handful of such people have the ability to determine the course of wars and otherwise interfere so massively in society based on whatever their latest whim or favoured conspiracy theory happens to be.
The fact that one or two of them turn out to be mostly ok (I'm thinking Gates) is in no way sufficient compensation for the harm that they collectively wreak on society.
It's not even that they have particularly rare and important talents, most of them just got lucky in various ways. Musk is obviously a prize **** as has been clear for years, perhaps decades. He's burnt billions on twitter, which was entirely predictable from the outset.
I genuinely think he smokes too much weed
I've heard from people who've met him that he canes it surprisingly hard (and is just really, really odd) - boozes a lot too
The thing about how he sleeps at work is true apparently - he'll get his buddies, commandeer a couple of offices, get on the tequilas and party it up on a Tuesday night in a Tesla factory somewhere. Then he'll sleep it off under a desk, and that office will be out of commission until some time the next day. He could literally employ some people whose sole job it was to carry him to a limo and get him to the Hilton, but he prefers to be the guy that sleeps in the office
Sounds like a wheeze! Top laughs! If you're 23. But he's a fifty-something father of ten. It's all a bit sad.
Equally I know plenty of folk who smoke too much weed that don’t come out with the sort of shite he does. Because they’re not massive *.
+1
Smoke a lot myself, or at least used to. Have friends that "cane" it, but not one of them is an out and out **** jobber.
In my experience it's those on the powder that talk the most shite.
Either way, with most people who talk crap they haven't the audience nor the clout that Musk has.
The fact that one or two of them turn out to be mostly ok (I’m thinking Gates) is in no way sufficient compensation for the harm that they collectively wreak on society.
Gates is a bit of a prick, if the published reports about him are correct. However, he does put his money towards useful purposes. Also, he's a bit of a prick whereas Musk seems to think that racist conspiracy theories are just a jolly jape. Order of magnitude difference there.
Ive not seen anything to suggest he thinks racism or anything like that are a jape.
I can understand that giving people that spout **** is dangerous but the problem is that boundaries are not black and white and so removing freedom of speech from people who push those boundaries is also dangerous.
Who decides the boundaries? Who knows. Boundaries today might be different from boundaries in 10 years.