let the members of the public go about their lawful activity.
Which is fine, but if you're a min. wages security and some dickhead dressed all in black with a balaclava and sunglasses comes to your site and sticks a camera in your face, and refuses to stop filming after being asked to stop ( not illegal, sure, but basic curtesy?) then it's going to only go one way isn't it?
You'll have noticed, no doubt that this (very right wing) govt wants to make it a chef constable's sole discretion about what defines public protest. (which could be just one person) I'd imagine that if they keep doing this at places like cop shops, then the rights they say they're "protecting or upholding" will pretty rapidly get restricted for the rest of us.
Had one on a site I worked at ~30 years ago on a grad training scheme.
He used to come by about once a month and take photos and tell security that we were killing the planet (it was a chemical factory, so we probably were) and he would take photos to prove it and no one could stop him. You can't see much from outside, so no one cared much. Worst thing about him was that he'd see someone leaving and follow them, telling them how evil they were.
Anyway, one morning we turn up at work and there been a plausible terrorist threat to blow up a chemical factory. And we have thousands of gallons of highly massively explosive chemicals on site. So they've got police in doing enhanced security checks on new starters (me), no more day passes if you forget your security card, all contractors sent off site, extra security around the site. But not the normal guys, it's either armed police or military. Big blokes with guns, bullet proof vests and helmets.
Few days later this guy turns up with his camera. Starts ranting at the front gate.
Within about 90 second he's cuffed, face down on the floor, with large guys pointing machine guns at him. And then the area being cleared while his bag was inspected. From what I understand, he was held for a few days under whatever passed for the terrorism act in the early 90s until they could work out who he was and what he was doing and who he was connected to. Absolutely zero reporting of anything except "man arrested at chemical factory".
They eventually found the bomb at another factory.
Unsurprisingly, he didn't come back again.
The jackpot is when they manage to be objectively unpleasant while technically remaining just the right side of legal, and making some poor sod look/behave poorly.
Speaking as a former STW moderator, this approach is not uncommon. 😁
in the majority of the videos I’ve watched, the attitude and winding up is initiated by the jobsworth who approaches the auditor
Did you actually watch the video posted by Robocock? One of the closing comments by the filmers is how effective a headbutt is.
Who audits the auditors that’s what I want to know.
The guy in the blue hi-vis who got assaulted three separate times by the 'auditor' as soon as he rolled up with a camera.
We’re all coming at this from different positions/viewpoints.
I'm a (shit) amateur photographer, I know a bit about where you can and can't photograph, and about related jobsworths who don't. Several other posters likewise. I have little patience for "you can't... [do something I've just made up]"
But rolling up on private property videoing and wearing a goddamn balaclava is antagonistic at best. Why does he need to cover his face? "To help with editing" according to that video. Bollocks, that's not normal behaviour, he's a threat to the operational security of the site and potentially at risk of reasonable suspicion under the Terrorism Act.
I take the point here, and agree to an extent, but squealing about personal space and shoving people around when you've intentionally put yourself up in the grill of a security guard, when you're dressed as a burglar and your hero mate with a camera is egging you on to 'stand your ground,' he's lucky he didn't get tasered. Or perhaps unlucky, that'd probably have been quite lucrative for him.
That guard in the video showed remarkable restraint, I'm far from a fighter but the first time that little prick laid hands on me I'd have taken the opportunity to knock him into Thursday on the grounds of self defence.
This phenomenon started off in America
Aye.
I wish I could find it again, but a couple of years back I watched a video of some kid "exercising his second amendment rights" or some other such twaddle, walking through a city centre with an assault rifle on his back. The police were called and attended, they asked what he was doing, he replied "exercising my rights" and the police went "OK, sure, but you're scaring people, and if you want to swing by the station at the weekend we'll give you some training on how to use it."
Who audits the auditors that’s what I want to know.
The guy in the blue hi-vis
I think you miss my point.
Did you actually watch the video posted by Robocock?
Ya cheeky beggar!
Factually correct though.👍😁
I’m not sure what videos you’re talking about Cougar but what I saw looked like public road outside a site. If the idiot was inside of course the guard has the right to eject him using force if necessary. If outside, the guard can do jack shit and should know that if he’s been trained adequately.
So, i offered him to come inside and he could have a brew and one of the lads could give him a tour round if that’s his jam
That’s an inspired idea. No doubt he was upset that he didn’t get his confrontation.
Was he the guy with the drone?
Who audits the auditors that’s what I want to know.
Susan.
And you most definitely do not want to **** with her.
Who else?
Boyle? She doesn't look like someone out would be wise to pick a fight with
Wasn't my first thought but the threat of #analbumparty might put some of them back in their box. Or give them something else to do. Whatever.
I’m not sure what videos you’re talking about Cougar but what I saw looked like public road outside a site.
Eventually.
In any case, if you walked in my general direction and I shoved you repeatedly in the chest, would that be OK? Regardless of any rights of access it was the YouTuber who escalated from verbal to physical and does that not cross a line?
Regardless of any rights of access it was the YouTuber who escalated from verbal to physical and does that not cross a line?
As the police officer who dealt with the case explained when I was assaulted by a driver, you can shout and holler at each other as much as you like, but the first one to touch the other generally loses legally.
As the police officer who dealt with the case explained when I was assaulted by a driver, you can shout and holler at each other as much as you like, but the first one to touch the other generally loses legally.
Aye, at that point you've potentially commited common assault. Also if others witness you actions you could also be looking at affray.
In any case, if you walked in my general direction and I shoved you repeatedly in the chest, would that be OK? Regardless of any rights of access it was the YouTuber who escalated from verbal to physical and does that not cross a line?
If you march right up to me and get in my face then I'm fully entitled to push you away. Your behaviour in these circumstances is already an assault (which does not require contact, merely reasonable fear of it) and pushing you away is a reasonable way to maintain distance (NB in the vid the auditor was also backing away, but the guard was marching up aggressively and persistently).
Your behaviour in these circumstances is already an assault (which does not require contact, merely reasonable fear of it)
Hmm.
Perhaps the gentleman had a reasonable fear that the balaclava clad person in question posed a threat. You would have to be pretty naive or stupid to think a balaclava doesn't have the capacity to intimidate.
That's the key if I recall. As long as your response to a perceived threat is reasonable then you're on steady ground.
Certainly been the case on the few occasions I've had to throw hands with bellends.
Shame these sorts are out there, must have very shallow lives to need a rise from others to feel a purpose or point to their lives.
You could certainly try arguing that squirrelking, but the video that I watched a bit of showed balaclava man backing off and trying to keep a distance between them, the guard was the one confronting. You can make up whatever you want about something that may have happened prior of course.
The thing is captain, you appear to be the only one seeing this in that video. Pretty much everyone else sees an absolute dickhead, hiding his face and purposefully antagonising somebody who is just trying to do his job. What does this tell you?
I posted earlier, and I’m no internet warrior and am more than capable of looking after myself, I would’ve beaten the ever living shit out of the guy as soon as he touched me. Maybe make him think twice about being a dickhead.
What it tells me is that most people don't understand the law (or don't care to) and allow their dislike for someone (someone's behaviour) to over-rule the facts and law as they actually apply. Which isn't a particular surprise, though it's always disappointing to be reminded of it.
You sound like a lovely person.
So you've watched the opening 30 seconds or so and completely ignored the rest then? Because none of us are speculating anything. He was being deliberately provaocative and brought that on him self "GET BACK HERE!" well here he came and big brave balaclava ran away like a scared wee boy. Play stupid games win stupid prizes.
The manager should be credited with not lamping the **** right there as he clearly knew better.
As the police officer who dealt with the case explained when I was assaulted by a driver, you can shout and holler at each other as much as you like, but the first one to touch the other generally loses legally.
Well, they were wrong. Maybe aside from the "generally" part, anyway.
You can't do that as much as you like at all. If someone's behaviour puts you into a position where you feel in danger, even if they don't physically touch you, it can still be considered to be an assault.
If you march right up to me and get in my face then I’m fully entitled to push you away.
No you aren't. Two wrongs, and all that.
You may well be if, as you said yourself, you felt under threat of imminent violence and were acting in self-defence. That was very clearly not what was happening in this particular case. PJ and Duncan were increasingly desperate for the guard to lose his cool and lamp them one because they'd have dined out on it for months.
You sound like a lovely person.
thanks, I am generally. But I wouldn’t put up with abuse from an absolute throbber wearing a balaclava and acting the big man. I’d just go a bit far in defending myself from a bully. A case of be careful who you pick on.
So just to update this thread and as previously explained (from my perspective as a UAV pilot that films for commercial reasons) - the CAA are currently putting drone rules yet again under consultation - with a particular view on under 250gm models that currently enjoy freedom to fly many public places with few restrictions.
Partly - because of all of these dumb ass Auditors creating chaos by testing these laws on unsuspecting business which are now complaining to the CAA en masse.
Police time is being spent on contacting the CAA in such circumstances too. So it's being noticed.
So this isn't looking good now for sub 250gm models. I bet you this now gets dumbed right down in UAV future regulations.
Haha, I missed this @rone. I once took a trip to Avonmouth as I thought it would be a good place for some photos. But yeah, it was pretty dull.
Spent quite a lot of time at Avonmouth, actually Royal Portbury Docks. And yes, really pretty dull.
Always welcome in the morning – there will be a tea and grub trailer in there somewhere.
There’s actually a proper cafe just on the edge of Avonmouth, but yes, you’re not wrong - the industrial estate I used to work on has a decent little cafe and a van that brings orders around to businesses, and another just along the road from me has an excellent kebab trailer permanently set up just as you drive in, just off the A350, and does lots of trade, including from me. 😁