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Was describing what gravel bikes are to my wife this eve and the concept of a kind of 'do it all' bike. To which she answered 'what, you mean a hybrid?'
Great put down. Even if she's slightly missed the point.
I'm just investigating the whole endurance\adventure\hybrid thing. There is much scope for confusion.
Hybrids usually have flat bars and are more like Mens for the road whereas Gravel/Adventure bikes are Road bikes for offroad 😉
Gravel bike = drop bar hybrid. Anyone who thinks otherwise is incorrect 🙂
Gravel bike = drop bar hybrid. Anyone who thinks otherwise is incorrect
I am waiting for the flat bar gravel bike to come out, for those times when you need a bit more control than drops can give you. And maybe downsizing the wheels a little, for a little bit more strength.
Bit like this really.
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And being as everything in cycling is cyclical, when do we get a new version of the Tioga/sugino tension disks???
Gravel bike = drop bar hybrid. Anyone who thinks otherwise is incorrect
So true
am waiting for the flat bar gravel bike to come out, for those times when you need a bit more control than drops can give you
Already here, any mtb with 35mm tyres on
Gravel bike = drop bar hybrid. Anyone who thinks otherwise is incorrect
Agreed. And I've had 2 of them. But theyd be far more capable with flat bars and decent brakes.
am waiting for the flat bar gravel bike to come out, for those times when you need a bit more control than drops can give you
There's loads of them about. My wide has a 2-3 year old Ridgeback X3. It's literally exactly what this thread is about.
I am waiting for the flat bar gravel bike to come out,
This is basically what the first 29ers were. Willits, Bruce Gordon, DB Overdrive etc. 700x45ish with flat bars, rigid forks.
I am waiting for the flat bar gravel bike to come out
'92 Alpinestars Xross.
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Specialized crosstrail....a flat bar heavy suspension gravel bike
I am waiting for the flat bar gravel bike to come out, for those times when you need a bit more control than drops can give you. And maybe downsizing the wheels a little, for a little bit more strength.
You mean like a 650b hardtail with a double chainset and forks you can lock out?
There's loads of them about. My wide has a 2-3 year old Ridgeback X3. It's literally exactly what this thread is about.
But they aren't being sold as a new niche yet, just waiting for the marketing to start pushing them as something revolutionary.
Gravelax
Slack, skinny tyres, flat bars. New pointless niche
If I put drops on my boardman hybrid it would be a gravel grinder
Your wife speaks the truth
These gravel bikes are just touring bikes, with knobbly tyres and disc brakes and without mudguards or racks.
People have been riding off-road on tourers for years, they work quite well as a do it all bike.
CraigW - Member
These gravel bikes are just touring bikes, with knobbly tyres and disc brakes and without mudguards or racks.
People have been riding off-road on tourers for years, they work quite well as a do it all bike.
Away with your sensible, non-marketing driven opinions you. How will the industry ever survive 😆
Hipster hybrid is what mine’s called. Great bike. I don’t get all the fretting that goes on about the bikes or the riding people do on them. Get out and enjoy it, or choose not to.
If I put drops on my boardman hybrid it would be a gravel grinder
What’s the max tyre clearance on it though?
Anyhow, I thought gravel bikes were just rebadged CX 😉
Nothing new Peugeot were making dedicated gravel bikes in the 50/60/70/80's under labels like "demi course" and "randonneuse" fat tires guard rack mounts and some with 650 tire size you can pick them up for a song on the french version of gumtree etc its called https://www.leboncoin.fr/ got one in the back of the stable lovely soft riding frames and not heavy even by today's standards.
Well, I'm sure mrmo enjoyed having his point repeated back at him.
Maybe there should be a tongue in cheek emoji for clarity.
drac has missed an open goal here
Well, I'm sure mrmo enjoyed having his point repeated back at him.
😆
Dunno jonni I've got 35mm and guards on so it would fit bigger, bit my shand took 42mm and o preferred to run it 35mm other wise it was a skinny 29er rather than a gravel group grinder, and if I used 32mm it was a gnarmac or something 🙂
I ask because a lot of gravel tyres on sale are around the 37-42 mark. People may shy away from buying a ‘gravel’ bike that only fits up to 35c tyres
I did see a s****y Mason Bokeh built with a flat bar recently.
They are indeed jonni I just found if I needed bigger than 35 I'd be as well on a 29er with skinny 29er tyres still fast enough on tarmac but much better in the rough stuff
^^this. I reckon Firestarter has it nailed right there.
I am waiting for the flat bar gravel bike to come out, for those times when you need a bit more control than drops can give you.
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[url= https://www.shandcycles.com/bikes/daunder-rohloff/ ]Daunder[/url]
Sneer all you like, but 'gravel' is a better descriptor than 'hybrid' IMO.
However 'gravel' bikes need fatter tyres, 2" at least (again IMO).
So don't worry, once the term gravel is accepted, we won't run out of sneerability objects - because when 2" gravel bikes happen a new round of sneering can start:
"They're not gravel bikes, they're 29ers".
🙂
Tbf I had a drop bar singular swift years ago before all this gravel nonsense and it was just a drop bar 29er 🙂
Edit. Infact I was told I couldn't use it on the 3peakscx as it was a mountain bike
These gravel bikes are just touring bikes, with knobbly tyres and disc brakes and without mudguards or racks.
And lighter to. So somewhat different.
I'm not sure I've seen an advert claiming these bikes are a new thing anyway. Can someone show me one?
No idea why everyone's frothing about this. Maybe they are trying to show how clever they are?
Aren't hybrids just mountain bikes with bad or no suspension anyway?
molgrips - Member
And lighter to. So somewhat different.
Mine's not.
In fact, it is a tourer.
See, labels are unhelpful.
I'm not sure I've seen an advert claiming these bikes are a new thing anyway. Can someone show me one?
No idea why everyone's frothing about this. Maybe they are trying to show how clever they are?
Maybe we've got to the stage where labels and genres only exist in the minds of marketing folk and those who are unsure about the possibilities of an ordinary, everyday bicycle.
Which is what 'g****l' bikes are.
Having seen epicyclo's posts before, whatever he says on the matter I agree with....
I swap between drop and risers on the bike I use for gravel riding. This is made very easy due to lack of needing to mess around with brakes so I can literally swap in a few minutes before going on a ride.
So dependent on which bars I use that day changes my bike from a gravel bike to a hybrid, interesting...
How do you swap the brakes and gears?
I have a rigid (flat bar) 29r and a gravel bike (arkose).
They do completely different things for me.
I prefer "gnar-brid" to gravel bike http://a-pic-a-ride.blogspot.co.uk/2017/09/gravel-riding-into-past.html?m=1
I swap between drop and risers on the bike I use for gravel riding. This is made very easy due to lack of needing to mess around with brakes so I can literally swap in a few minutes before going on a ride.
Interested in this setup. You must have some moustache drop bars that take MTB levers rather than the more usual drops?
molgrips - Member
Interested in this setup. You must have some moustache drop bars that take MTB levers rather than the more usual drops?
If you're happy with a shallow drop akin to the old North Road bar, then the Satori Minotaur bar may interest you. It takes mtb sized levers.
It's also sold as One23 Bullbar. I'm sure it has many other names. Just the job for a multi purpose bike like a gravel bike. They're just the job for a 50/50 mile gravel/road jaunt being neither too low or too high.
[url= https://farm1.staticflickr.com/529/19735654471_73aca593ce_b.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm1.staticflickr.com/529/19735654471_73aca593ce_b.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
Alternatively Dia Compe make levers that will fit old diameter road bars as well as mtb by the use of a shim. I think it's in their Grand Compe range. If you can't find them on their website I'll dig mine up from the depths of the shed to give you the model number.
I put 35 knobblies on my hybrid. I ride it on gravel now.
[url= http://www.velosolo.co.uk/tech99str.html ]These levers will work on 22.2 and 25.4mm[/url], but they're not the same as I mentioned earlier.
Having seen epicyclo's posts before, whatever he says on the matter I agree with....
In the extreme cold, he rides in a string vest and sandals.
I'm out.
See wallop i put 32mm on my stoater and turned it into a road bike 😉
tourergravelaudaxcommutercanalpotteringhybrid
[url= https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1713/24479917835_0a6ab2058c_b.jpg [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/DicYGT ]cidImage_FOTBDCA.JPG" target="_blank">https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1713/24479917835_0a6ab2058c_b.jpg [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/DicYGT ]cidImage_FOTBDCA.JPG"/> [/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/91703444@N06/ ]20ston[/url], on Flickr
ton wins...
Nobeerinthefridge - Member
'Having seen epicyclo's posts before, whatever he says on the matter I agree with....'
In the extreme cold, he rides in a string vest and sandals.I'm out.
It gets worse. I didn't always wear sandals. I'm in my warmest flipflops there. 🙂
Pic from my hill running days long time ago when I had hair to keep me warm.
[url= https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8069/8254162643_4205253230_b.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8069/8254162643_4205253230_b.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
Has anyone mentioned that a gravel bike with flat bars would be very similar to early mountain bikes?
No worries if they have, I'm sure noone will mind the point being repeated every other post 😀
I consider my Wazoo as a flat bar gravel bike, or at least it could be, if I regularly did much else off-road besides the track between Northam Bridge and the boardwalks by Horseshoe Bridge! 😆
In this part of the world there are a lot of unsealed roads.
They are often pretty smooth but not always. Head not too far out of Melbourne and you can notch up 100's of Kilometers on them quite easily.
Tires around 35-38 seem to make plenty of sense here.
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Sometimes there can be rough patches where bigger tires might be blessing but they are normally over pretty quickly.
There are quite a lot of mixed terrain Audax run on them, a bit of quiet tarmac and gravel sections. You see all sorts of bikes from road bikes with 25mm tires, Hybrids, tourers and lots of CX/adventure/gravel bikes and the occational hard tail.
Consensus seems to be, just from numbers seen that 35mm is optimum for the job.
May be different elsewhere.
Youtube of such riding. Not mine BTW.
How do you swap the brakes and gears?
I don't have any but that is not the point. The point is that if I swap my bars it doesn't change the purpose and use of the bike or change any name/style applied to the bike.
Consensus seems to be, just from numbers seen that 35mm is optimum for the job.
Where I live (New Forest) there are miles of fire roads which are compacted gravel with a few looser areas of gravel. I also ride singletrack stuff too.
I also find that around 35c is optimum. When using larger it feels more sluggish/mountain bikish and when using narrow it feels skittish and less comfortable.
kenneththecurtain - Member
Has anyone mentioned that a gravel bike with flat bars would be very similar to early mountain bikes?...
And every bike was a gravel bike up until the 1920s and 1930s because most roads were not surfaced.
And sometime around 1920 or thereafter the category of Path Racer.*
[url= https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4073/4925820939_125f7cabfe_b.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4073/4925820939_125f7cabfe_b.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
*I don't know for sure, but the earliest I have seen that term mentioned in the cycling press was around then.
Next year's TdF takes in a bit of gravel... I expect they'll manage just fine on their usual bikes.
If you're happy with a shallow drop akin to the old North Road bar, then the Satori Minotaur bar may interest you. It takes mtb sized levers.
Hmm. Yeah could be good, but for me a huge advantage of drops is the multiple hand positions.
Next year's TdF takes in a bit of gravel... I expect they'll manage just fine on their usual bikes.
It is only a couple of K's though, and pretty benign, so yes they will manage just fine.
Gravel riding, as we know it in this country, requires something a bit meatier.
And I still prefer the term "Rough Stuff" in reference to that crazy lot from the '50's
Gravel riding, as we know it in this country, requires something a bit meatier.
I don't think we really have much gravel riding here!
ransos - Member
Next year's TdF takes in a bit of gravel... I expect they'll manage just fine on their usual bikes.
Aye, but those riders could do that backwards one legged on a unicycle.
jobro - Member
... I still prefer the term "Rough Stuff" in reference to that crazy lot from the '50's
Hey, we're still at it.
But these days if you say you're a member of the Rough Stuff Fellowship you may attract the wrong sort of interest and be offered a Tory seat.
'Gravel' riding sounds more socially acceptable. 🙂
Well I dunno, there's lots of fire road around the place. Tends to zig-zag annoyingly through woods though instead of going somewhere...
Well I dunno, there's lots of fire road around the place. Tends to zig-zag annoyingly through woods though instead of going somewhere...
That was my point really - they seem to combine the least enjoyable aspects of road and mountain biking. Gravel roads in the US or Aus actually go somewhere, so there is a point to them.
molgrips - Member
Well I dunno, there's lots of fire road around the place. Tends to zig-zag annoyingly through woods though instead of going somewhere...
You need to move up here. (Highlands)
It's dead easy to stitch together 50 miles+ of gravel, and you do end up somewhere - often Wtfami. 🙂
I'm well aware of that.
Although last time I tried I ended up in a gigantic bog and had to back-track.
[url= https://www.wired.com/2016/07/cash-strapped-towns-un-paving-roads-cant-afford-fix/ ]New gravel roads are fairly likely to be arriving in the UK in the next couple of years[/url]
molgrips - Member
...Although last time I tried I ended up in a gigantic bog and had to back-track.
Ah, you found Wtfami 🙂
The gravel bikes drops are a better position for out of the saddle sprinting/climbing, so if your primary purpose of the bike is for fitness training it is preferrable to have the two effective positions to switch between.
I don't have any but that is not the point. The point is that if I swap my bars it doesn't change the purpose and use of the bike or change any name/style applied to the bike
No gears I understand but I'm guessing you have brakes?
Gravel roads in the US or Aus actually go somewhere, so there is a point to them.
They do down south. Taken on yesterdays ride; near hants/ wilts border.
[url= https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4509/37848237682_4d4288a51b_z.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4509/37848237682_4d4288a51b_z.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/ZEw7s7 ]IMG_4750[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/24645633@N08/ ]thom1984[/url], on Flickr
It's just a choice, isn't it? A comfier cross bike, and an alternative to an XC bike with fast tyres on, to do much the same job in a way that'll suit some people and not others- just like a road bike vs a hybrid. Always good to have choice, it's just weird that it's been made such a fuss of lately as if it's a whole different sort of riding rather than just rediscovering simple pleasures
ibnchris - MemberGravelax
What?
GRAVELAX is evolving!
Congratulations! Your GRAVELAX evolved into GRAVELPOON!
it's just weird that it's been made such a fuss of lately
It has? Most of the fuss seems to be people on here whinging about the fact it's nothing new.
Personally, I'm happy to see a wider range of bikes in shops. More better choice than previously.
molgrips - MemberIt has? Most of the fuss seems to be people on here whinging about the fact it's nothing new.
Maybe it's just that when grit.cx leaks over here it annoys me 😆 But it definitely does get talked about as some new exciting thing when it's almost exactly what I used to do in the 90s, back when we had no idea how to mountain bike so we just pelted up and down dirt roads.
That Shand Daunder looks tasty-- and quite similar (barring drivetrain) to the flat bar Stoater we built up for the Mrs last autumn. Works really well with 35mm semi-slicks on Highland estate/forestry roads and out on the back roads, yet happily completed a road Tour de Mont Blanc in the summer with light packing gear and 28mm road slicks.
I suppose I have two bikes that sort of fit this niche- an old flat bar On-one 29er, rigid, with strong wheels, decent brakes and a 3x9 triple; shod with 2.2 summer tyres, it is happy on those long tracks and smoother trails as well as roads. It's recently done a 120+ mile day from Oban to Angus, taking in various bits of off-road on the WHW and accessing Glen Lyon.
A fair bit lighter and livelier is the CdF, which with 35mm semi-slicks does an annual run from Angus to Lossiemouth on road, then a day on duty at the Speyside Way Race before coming home the next day over the ski roads. Again, flat bars, decent brakes, in this case a 105 triple. It's all good and by simply changing tyres, I can use these two for any long rides; on 32mm slicks, the CdF completed a 202 mile day on roads and grit cyclepaths last weekend.
I much prefer the control of a flat bar bike when travelling or training, road or otherwise. With stubby bar ends in nearly the same hand position as hoods, I get plenty of leverage and better control than any drop-bar bike can offer. That's pretty important when you're tired after 10 or 15 hours in the saddle. Everything around bikes is a compromise and my two both represent a good and adaptable balance for me. But I'm in no hurry to get a drop bar bike, I just think if you're not actually racing on it, the whole position is wasted for normal riding, commuting or training. I'm not saying that they're entirely wrong. But watching folk ride these nervous handling drops off road can be quite fun...
But it definitely does get talked about as some new exciting thing when it's almost exactly what I used to do in the 90s, back when we had no idea how to mountain bike so we just pelted up and down dirt roads.
So what though?
It's different to what a lot of MTBers or roadies have been doing recently, so to most of them it IS new. And the bikes are different. You can call them drop bar hybrids but such things were pretty uncommon until recently.
But that's what magazines have to do - sound enthhusiastic. What kind of mag articles would you like?:
"Passing fads: Gravel bikes, we've seen it all before"
"How to look down on youngesters and neophytes"
"Top ten ways to set up a bike to ride light off-road without buying a 'gravel' bike cos you hate marketing"
😆
But it definitely does get talked about as some new exciting thing when it's almost exactly what I used to do in the 90s, back when we had no idea how to mountain bike so we just pelted up and down dirt roads.
That's it really - and we used to ride 7-15 miles to a place to ride our MTBs, do a loop then ride home. But now MTBs are so off-road biased that 15 miles of tarmac is a drag. What we had then were ATBs, they felt fine on road. I had Scott AT4s to help make it a better all-rounder .. er, hybrid 😀
What we've got now on a gravel bike is a 650B x 1.9 or 700x40-45 semi-tread so we're back to a similar terrain mix, just the drop bars for covering road more easily and 'cos of hipster stuff (Fixed>CX>bike camping and gravel etc)
and we used to ride 7-15 miles to a place to ride our MTBs, do a loop then ride home
I still do. That's why I built my Salsa. It's not a gravel bike though 🙂
You can get more or less a continuous spectrum of bike applications now - this is a good thing.
jameso - MemberThat's it really - and we used to ride 7-15 miles to a place to ride our MTBs, do a loop then ride home. But now MTBs are so off-road biased that 15 miles of tarmac is a drag. What we had then were ATBs, they felt fine on road.
My own mountain bikes are like you say but it's not like you can't buy an XC bike any more and pretty much any hardtail today would be better at the job than older bikes...
it's not like you can't buy an XC bike any more and pretty much any hardtail today would be better at the job than older bikes...
The bars it'll come with will be a bit too wide, IMO. 660mm on my Salsa.
Who could forget the Specialised Rockcombo
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Or the incredible GT Tachyon, now this had a "flip Flop" stem that you could demount and flip quickly, and sliding front fork dropouts to change your trail offset:
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That ones 650b(!)