This seems worth pointing out here:

darryl-cunningham.blogspot.com/2010/06/homeopathy.html

(It’s a comic, but significantly better than most ‘proper’ science journalism. There’s also a linked comic about MMR which is quite good.)

For the past 10 to 15 years or more athletics bodies have been researching herbal remedies, however this research has been ignored by the health service.

My point was that not enough research is being done into herbal remedies or homeopathy. I haven’t studied homeopathy so don’t know about it! However since no research is being done by the NHS into herbal remedies I have to wonder why a massive resource is being ignored? We could easily research herbal remedies and work on the process of developing the substances!

What I’m saying is unless they can process it and make it into a product they control it is by and large being ignored.
Yes a lot of substances come from plants but if the majority of herbal remedies are being ingnored then why is that?

Sorry but there are a few sweeping statements here; I think you need to name your source.

Seriously, how can you possibly know what is and isn’t being researched throughout every NHS trust, university, and teaching hospital in the UK? Not to mention the scores of consultants and GP’s who regularly contribute peer assessed and published research. I need to know how you know this. I may not sleep tonight and resort to some spurious herbal remedy.

Ben Goldacre on Homeopathy

Sorry but there are a few sweeping statements here; I think you need to name your source.

Kaesae’s source is his own active imagination 🙂

A man walks into the doctors and say’s ‘I don’t feel well’. Doctor sends him for Homeopathy.

If there is no Homeopathy does the doctor say P*** off theres nowt wrong? No he sends the man to get drugs or some other treatment. There is no cost saving.

A man walks into the doctors and say’s ‘I don’t feel well’. Doctor sends him for Homeopathy.

I’d have thought that the doctor might first want to treat the man properly before even thinking about homeopathy. I know that’s what I’d prefer if it was me.

If there is no Homeopathy does the doctor say P*** off theres nowt wrong? No he sends the man to get drugs or some other treatment.

Well again I’d have thought that the doctor might be a bit more tactful than that but I see nothing problem with saying “there’s nothing wrong with you” if that is indeed the case. Why on earth would a doctor give someone treatment if there is nothing wrong? Isn’t that unethical?

I am obviously shortening the process here but the doctor will work through a pattern of treatments. If Homeopathy is not in the mix then something else will be at that stage of the treatment pattern.

Well it’ll surely be a case of trying say 9 things instead of 10. It’ll mean that the ‘there’s nothing more we can do’ talk will be brought forward, that’s all.

I am obviously shortening the process here but the doctor will work through a pattern of treatments. If Homeopathy is not in the mix then something else will be at that stage of the treatment pattern.

Nope. That isn’t the paradigm we work to.

Much of what we deal with is self-limiting illness (the kind a homeopath would treat – and then claim the credit for the cure). Homeopathy – in its purist form – is very mechanistic and far from holistic – with an emphasis on a remedy-for-every-ill and failure to confront psychological elements of illness other than by giving placebos.

have i seen people who have been harmed by Homeopathic practitioners? yes definately. I can recall one patient who was treated by a homeopathic practitioner for a treatable cancer with a wholefoods diet. This patient returned to the NHS once his cancer was causing him unbearable pain and was untreatable. Yeah this is the patients choice but his treatnent was dangerous, unproven and led to the early death of this patient. Yet unlike with doctors there is no comeback on this dangerous quack- If he was a doc he would be struck off. but who cares it’s only herbal.

Unless tt’s evidence based it should not be available- end of!

This much can be said for it:

Homeopathy keeps cetain types happy that they are being ‘treated’ for comparitively little outlay, otherwise they’ll revert to bed-hogging, which is far more costly long-term.

How much does the NHS spend/waste treating people who smoke for smoking related illnesses? Gotta be a few quid they could save there by making them pay for their own treatment.

Dr Nick – rather a mix of herbal, homeopath and nutritionist there 🙂

I thought I had seen some data that suggested NHS homeopathy saved money for exactly the reasons jp-t853 said.

I can’t find it now however.

its obvious quackery I have to say.

I’d have to say in my end of the NHS very little research is been done – largely due to the fact that we have far too much worked to do with too little resource – TBH research in to treatments is largely done through academic institutions and drug companies then the NHS its self
As to the whole homeopathy thing for me one of the issues is the academic snobbery that agues that only randomised control trials is valid evidence and that only evidence with a numeric value is valid. While this type of research is generally the best at looking in to the effectiveness of medication it is not the whole story.
I’ve no doubt that homeopathy fair quite badly in RCT and quantitative research, however should the inquiry look in to the subjective experience using more qualitative measure then a different may emerge
The NHS spends Billions of pounds on medication each year and to be fair some of the evidence is not hugely convincing then I see no problem with the use of homeopathy

How much does the NHS spend/waste treating people who smoke for smoking related illnesses?

May as well add fatties, anorexic’s/bulimics, drug addicts, alcoholics…….oh and idiots who fall off bikes and hurt themselves……………….

At least smokers are taxed to the hilt for their habit (in addition to paying NI etc) and effectively pay for their treatment.

oh shush!

people should be encouraged to participate in sport – it’s all part of a healthy lifestyle.

and you never know, someone still engaging in sport in their 70’s might still have sufficient bone-density / mobility / co-ordination in their 80’s to avoid having ‘a fall’ and the associated broken-hip…

how much is a packet of fags these days? £5? – the fact that people still buy fags at this price shows the tax isn’t high enough.

Nice one Lifer, I was going to chip in with dr Ben Goldacre and the badscience column – proof that ‘here, this is a sugar pill, it’s made out of sugar and nothing else’ will invoke the placebo effect if it’s handed out to a doctor

the only reason people think they feel better after a homeopathic remedy is that they are rehydrating themselves cos they’re drinking water the digestive system knows it but they don’t realise !!!!

Is the NHS a major researcher anyway? Surely it’s done by companies and unis mostly?

ahwiles

I quite agree and I certainly wasn’t encouraging smoking, simply pointing out that there are many ‘activities’ which cost then NHS money which could be termed as self-inflicted. Smoking is one of the few bad habits where the participants are net contributors to the NHS, and by quite a high margin.

Let Dara O’Briain take it home…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIaV8swc-fo

Is the NHS a major researcher anyway? Surely it’s done by companies and unis mostly?

AFAIK Doctors have to write papers and contribute to research as part of their on-going training. MrsGrahamS has certainly contributed to several papers and conducted clinical audits.

absolutely graham s. it’s(research) an essential part of modern medical specialist training.

However the scary thing about medical research is the way the multinational drug companies hide -ve data such as with arcoxia and rosiglitazone

Gotcha.