Welcome to c!

A weekend of nothing for me, between family events and DIY I didn’t get to sit on the bike, so back to it this evening. Planning on joining a group ride and seeing if I can keep up with the pace for an hour…
Plan to do more endurance training so I can deal with the races better, plus at some point I want to hit the big hills. Am I right that you have to be level 12 before you can ride Alpe d’zwift?

one trick for the Alp is to use “join rider”

Pick someone who’s doing a REALLY low speed, the odds are they’re on the Alp. Then roll down to the bottom and you can do the climb even if not at the level 🙂

I like that hack Weeksy…cheers! 🙂

read a bit more. Zwiftpower classifies you based on your last three races. my last three (2.72/2.56/2.48) put me over so I get bumped.

I had a fun but ultimately pointless race, but I expected it before starting. Small field, most random riders not registered etc

Race was a slowish pace, fun last 800m ended with 4 of us within 2 bike lengths over the line. My screen looked like I had 2nd, but results had me in 4th.

I went in with tired legs from Saturday so wasn’t expecting much if a race

All this racing talk sounds awfully serious and complex!

I’m 7 weeks into Zwift/Smart Trainer ownership, and I’ve just completed the ‘DIRT DESTROYER’ 6 week programme. My only Zwift use has been these sessions so I’ve nop done any free riding or events/racing.

I’ve never managed more than a couple of hours (cumulative) on a turbo before through sheer mind numbing boredom so this is some acheviement and also a big credit to Zwift.

I’ve really enjoyed it – and I’d recomend it. It does seem quite well tailored to MTB, lots of slow bits, lots of speed variations. I’d reccomend it.

I started in December on my first ever short FTP ramp test at 239W. I have no idea if thats good, middling or rubbish. However I’ll try to a test tonight or tomorrow to see if there are any changes!

What should I do next though?

(Maybe go for a ride outside is the right answer!)

Maybe go for a ride outside is the right answer! – riding IRL is always the best answer.

But on Zwift you should really try racing. You’ll never work yourself so hard and be so focused on your riding as when you are in a race. It really is where the most intense fun is to be had.

As for your FTP – well the key factor in Zwift is FTP W/kg, so work that out and based on that you can chose a category A-D for racing. In reality you will feel like you are comparing yourself to others in the same category, but with the proviso that if you choose too low a category to be one of the best you will soon get kicked up to a higher grade based on your performance in the fist few races.

As for what a race is like, my experience, shared by others on this thread is:
– starts are brutal, the first 2-3 minutes are usually well above your FTP as subgroups form
– you can’t ride at above your FTP for long, so you do need to pace yourself based on the race length, especially keeping something in hand for hills and a final sprint
– on the flats your raw power and making the maximum of drafting is key. 239W is middling, but not bad, you’ll find a group you can hold on to but it probably won’t be the front one.
– for hills it pretty quickly shakes out based on W/kg.

Work out your category, choose a race, give it a go and have fun. You’ll learn quickest by doing.

i think the key with racing on Zwift is forget about absolute position, especially in the lower categories. There are so many ringers that you’ll never be able to hold onto the lead group. race what is around and just in front/behind you. its much easier now you can only see the people in your race.

however, if you can hold onto the lead group long enough to get yourself up the road a bit, can give you a real advantage.

@snotrag try a short TT like that 1725 Tempus Fugit ~18Km, out and back very flat course, it will likely take you just over 20mins. No drafting, all about pacing yourself, don’t forget to “buy” a virtual TT frame.
https://zwiftpower.com/events.php?zid=322236

This particular event has no boundaries, all do same event, no separate A/B/C/D/E races.

A number of TTs don’t get listed as TTs on Zwift Companion or at Zwiftpower, they show under “race.”

This will give you a ballpark 20min FTP for racing.

Join Zwiftpower if you want to race for rank points.

read a bit more. Zwiftpower classifies you based on your last three races. my last three (2.72/2.56/2.48) put me over so I get bumped.

Noop, best 3 in the last 90 days.

First proper ride on the Directo. On same ^^ dirt destroyer plan. Looks more interesting that FTP builder I did last year. Initial thoughts are ERG is more sensitive than Flux, and the trainer feels smoother. It also feels easier to get to the same watts.. however I did change the original press fit BB Bearings which were square so probably too many variables.

I need to get back to one of the group rides that normally nearly do me in and see if they feel any easier.

No ride/race today. Allowed myself to break my low carb diet for first time since Christmas last night.

Woke up a bit hungover and felt dehydrated and bloated all day.

The positive is it reminds me why I’m on the diet as I’ve felt s*** all day!

Stage 6 tomorrow evening at some point.😁

Had to be sensible today and resist the urge to race, legs covered in metaphorical concrete, two blocks of 5min upper zone 3 and two very short z5 surges were more than enough to severely test the quads.

Still to try Richmond stage 6 tdz race, did short social the other day, hoping legs will be up for some hard work tomorrow.

As for what a race is like, my experience, shared by others on this thread is:
– starts are brutal, the first 2-3 minutes are usually well above your FTP as subgroups form

Took me a little while to realise you just have to go flat out on the gun. In my experience the start of a Cat C race is pushing 450-500w for a sustained period before it settles down. Managed to win my first one recently, but before that I was always playing catchup from the start and it’s just impossible to bridge the gaps. If you can stay at the front until it settles, and you can recover from the initial effort, then you can probably hold your position for a while.

It doesn’t help that you have so many people well above their category. It seems most people at the front of Cat C races are pushing close to 4W/kg despite the cutoff at 3.2.

one trick for the Alp is to use “join rider”

Pick someone who’s doing a REALLY low speed, the odds are they’re on the Alp. Then roll down to the bottom and you can do the climb even if not at the level 🙂

haha that is great, could’ve done with that kind of thinking last year when I road the Alpe MANY times to unlock the Tron bike (still never got the wheels or whatever it was from the wheel of fortune at the top 😭)

Anyone doing Stage 6 race (or ride) later? Just read that the rides have Double Draft which is probably why I found it impossible to catch up to the group after getting dropped last time 😂😂. Not done many DD events; it makes a big difference!!

It doesn’t help that you have so many people well above their category. It seems most people at the front of Cat C races are pushing close to 4W/kg despite the cutoff at 3.2.

well… it does help (a lot!) if you let them drag you along at the start; at some point they’ll drop you but it means they’ll get DQ’d and you won’t!! tbh I don’t pay much attention to the numerical ranking any more (due to aforementioned sandbagging!), I just try to do a bit better each time!

Tempted to try the 1710 stage 6 race as there are 124+ riders listed for B, but then I’ve spotted a 25.5Km TT race at 1810 on the Crit City Bell Lap (so ~13 laps, the ~15Km races are 8 laps) hidden under “race” events on Zwift Companion.

The TT has team points too. Stw could try and mop up the categories 😉

However, not sure how my legs are… Just done a 54min z5 interval workout that beat my legs up a bit, might be able to sustain ~260W for 20-odd mins.

Going to log on and do the 18.10 Stage 6 in a bit, D. So actually starts at 18.13.

I’m frustratingly I’ll. Desperate to ride but feel like crap!

19.10 race for me tonight. Legs still sore from the run on Sunday … how hard can a 17km be?

That hurt.

Felt bad from the off. I’ve started doing leg stretches before and after Zwift to help with a bit of knee pain. Forgot to do it today and the outer part of my quads felt like taught elastic bands. Not sure if the lack of stretches was to do with this??? Never had my legs feel like that right at the start of a ride, that I remember anyway.

By 6k had been dropped by the 2 big blobs and just tried to hang on with the occasional passer. I was actually grateful for the hills as I could just spin my legs and tried to hold on to 200w or there abouts. Just hoping that was enough to hold of the riders behind me. “Luckily” had a couple of other riders catch me up that gave me a bit of pace too.

By inside the last 1k I got overtaken by a couple of riders again and I couldn’t hold on to them but I also had a big enough lead over the rest behind me. Just held on from there in.

Bimbled over the line with a cursory “sprint”.

Oh, you get 2 power ups, thought you only got one. Doh.

Glad that one is over.

60th out of 98 on Zwift.

Zwiftpower is down at the moment.🙄

Zwiftpower not just down for me then! 😀

Well today has been a good cycling day for me when I wasn’t expecting such things…
My anaerobic capacity 1/2mins workout hurt
Then out of nowhere managed 309.5W average for Richmond stage 6 race at 1610, raising my FTP and still need to confirm if that’s the first time I’ve ever done a 4W/Kg+ 20mins (one of my random cycling goals)
Short break and then managed 275W average for that 25.5Km Bell Lap TT race, which really tested my legs physically and my mental resolve as I was hurting after ~20mins.

The bad news is… I have to work tomorrow, with Weds usually being the hardest shift of the week.:lol:

The 19.10 B cat race was a relatively tame race till the start of first climb.
There were no big efforts until the first climb.

A group of about 10 went off front and strung out about 5 of us stuck in between a group of about 10 chasing group behind. There was too big a gap between us strung out riders to get together and work to keep gap – so by time I got to last climb the chasing group caught me, and I came in 22nd on Zwift companion. Averaged 4.1 w/kg so getting closer to being the slowest A cat rider again!

Then out of nowhere managed 309.5W average for Richmond stage 6 race

I managed 197w!😁

Nice work there mate. Just Richmond was enough for me.

Averaged 4.1 w/kg so getting closer to being the slowest A cat rider again!

That would be a dream come true for me.Lol

3.84w/kg at moment with increases in last 3 races (last 3.89w/kg) – Can be a nuisance because you try and stay with the front group of an A race … blow and get shelled, and then sit up for the chasing B group to find you had gone into the red too soon and legs not want to play again!

Updated weight. Was still down as 11st 1 lb … back up to an honest 11st 4lb (weighed in work yesterday and was 11st 7lb fully clothed (no shoes), so figure 3lb for trousers/shirt/jacket.
That safely keep me at B.

Always enjoy reading the race reports. Makes me almost want to do one. Careful use of the word ‘almost’ there 😉

I need to do a new FTP test. I’ve calibrated the Directo and it’s spot on so would be a good time as I’ve not done one for a year (had a few boosts from Zwift based on some hard group rides).

What’s best the ramp or the 20 min? And if I do the 20 min, can I choose the course? Would much rather have something flat so I can concentrate on watts not gears..

Well done chaps…all doing so well and there are results here I can only dream of. I keep getting urges to do more races and will soon, definitely going to have a go at Richmond stage 6, but just trying to work on riding and being able to keep a good solid pace at the moment.

#Alex – Just do a short race of about 30 minutes and that’ll give you a FTP ;0)

You don’t need to worry about the course on an FTP test as the 20minute ones make it a flat profile so it’s just about you picking the power and gear you want to be in. Your head might prefer to be on the flat or going uphill.

tomlevell

Member
#Alex – Just do a short race of about 30 minutes and that’ll give you a FTP ;0)

Stage 6 is spot on for that. Short, sharp shock! Lol

mooman

blow and get shelled, and then sit up for the chasing B group to find you had gone into the red too soon and legs not want to play again!

How do you judge how much you can “hold” as it were? By wattage or heart rate? Or both of course.

Trying to get a better idea of how to judge the same for myself.

#Alex – Just do a short race of about 30 minutes and that’ll give you a FTP ;0)

Right then, I’m stupidly competitive so it’ll be my best value. Or I’ll be falling off the turbo after 10 mins.

3 nasty hills after around 12km. Nice and short so people go full metal jacket right from the off.Lol

How do you judge how much you can “hold” as it were? By wattage or heart rate? Or both of course.

It comes with practice at sustained efforts and for me, it’s a bit of both. I know I can sustain ~170-175bpm for 20mins+, the unknown for me is how do my legs feel at the time trying to hold ~260W+ due to fatigue from recent days or sessions earlier that day.

Yesterday in the stage 6 race, last minute I chose my Tron bike over my Cervelo R5, because I fancied trying to keep with the lead B group for at least the first 5mins. I was surprisingly able to stick with them, I even briefly had the #1 spot several times on the flat (I should have take a screenshot 😆 ), so I kept setting myself short goals like try and stick with them until 10mins, 15mins etc. and at that point I commited myself to trying to keep 300W+ until 20mins regardless of race position consequences come the finish line.

Today my quads are completely dead, work was painful but probably did them some good, the cycle home up Cobden Ave and especially “Bitterne 13.5%” was agony compared to normal! But stage 7 is here, I’ve had ~2 hours rest, so maybe I’m mad enough to do a “recovery ride” sportive effort around Yorkshire UCI at 1700.

My rocky intro to Zwift racing continued last night in Stage 6. It was a very short race and I held 2.8w/kg for the race so have been upgraded to C on Zwift Power and my result didn’t count, which is fair enough. Mind you I came 41st in D according to Zwift, so in C I’m going to be right at the back. Hopefully the people at the back with me will be the incentive to keep trying to put out as much as I can, even if it is for the glory of 91st place.

What’s best the ramp or the 20 min? And if I do the 20 min, can I choose the course? Would much rather have something flat so I can concentrate on watts not gears..

Ramp tests are a lot less unpleasant, take the whole pacing thing out of the equation and take less out of you as well. Personally I’d just do a ramp test unless you’ve done something really bad and deserve to suffer. If you’ve done something even worse, take out a SF subscription and do the 4DP test 🙂

The other thing is that because the ramp test is a lot less painful until the very end, you’re more likely to do it regularly.

Poopscoop

Subscriber

How do you judge how much you can “hold” as it were? By wattage or heart rate? Or both of course.

If its 25k or less I just try to stay with the front group until I start falling off back and my legs tell me they at max but watts showing low numbers.
I can kinda tell where HR is without looking, and in short races it not worth pacing because they generally just go hard till you blow anyways.
In longer races I will try to stay in front group – but towards back of the group waiting for it to split … if it gets strung out I wont push too hard and wait for a group to come by to get on because the bigger chasing group will hoover up the strung out riders easy enough, and the fast front group will be doing their own race … generally the weight dopers or the serious fast guys; both of which are pointless trying to stay with.

bluebird

Member
My rocky intro to Zwift racing continued last night in Stage 6.

Great effort mate! You signed up to Zwiftpower too? Well worth it if you are racing. Though I don’t fully understand all its metrics yet.

mooman

Found that on stage 6. Big group went off the front and didn’t see them again basically. I then tagged on with the odd couple of passing riders but they/I just got swallowed up by following group/s.

I think I might be suited to longer rides/races… which is a shame when I look at the Yorkshire course, riding that tomorrow evening….

SATURDAY, FEBRUARY 8TH
5:00PM GMT
Andre Greipel Fight ALS Mega Ride

Anyone doing this on Saturday?

Zwift trying to break the group ride record and will be donating to charity for each rider, erm, riding.

It’s an hour at 2-2.5w/kg I believe.

You unlock a new kit too. Just saying.

Yorkshire should not be tougher than Stage 6 because non of the climbs are grinders, which should mean there will be a very big group. Kill yourself with the initial hilly start; sit in till next climb but get to front as you hit climb; expect to drop positions as they try and split group, and hopefully still be within a big enough group to bring it all together by the last 5km. I will guess the average speed for those in front group will be 30mph at least.

I be doing the 19.10 race tomoz.

In the B category of The 18.10 Stage 7 race tonight; Only 3 out of the first 36 riders were under 4w/kg average …. the first 10 riders in the B cat averaged 4.53w/kg …. its a fast course!!