davidtaylforth – Member

It’s a bit after my time. I know it’s downhill with bits of uphill, but the uphill isn’t timed or something (that sounds very “athletic”).

Because of course the timed uphills are a key part of downhill 😆

@mikey74:

XC is a 90 min format, does not require the same high endurance required for a 230km road race.

Road does not necessarily require strong climbing, recall London Olympics, course was flat enough team GB rode for Cav. Likewise with descending, not all courses require decending skill.

XC doesn’t require tactical awareness, its a war of attrition, and often boils down to man vs course.

I think what you really are trying to say is they both wear lycra and require pedalling, so therefore viewed through enduro blinkers are identical.

I’m not particularly an XC racing fan but I appreciate the skill, fitness and commitment of the racers.

It’s a little annoying that what is considered ‘mountain biking’ is so far from what most of us do and enjoy, and at times it’s very annoying that BC and everyone else in officialdom like to pretend that no other forms of mountain biking exist as anything other than leisure activities with consequent effects on funding, but the flip side of that is that they aren’t messing with ‘our’ sport.

There is value in having a sport with everyman grassroots accessibility. Large national series almost automatically exclude many people who can’t make the time and financial commitments – while it was great on many levels you could equally argue that the UKGE scene was almost as removed from reality as the top levels of BC sponsored XC and the Olympic events.

I’m not really sure that the present state of affairs isn’t really a bad thing in that light.

I don’t get why becoming an olympic sport is such a good thing?

Surfing has been confirmed for 2020 & they’re all going on about how great it is, but why?

jambalaya – Member
Olympic criteria are that pretty much all the events have to be held in or around the host city (which these days has to of “capital city” status). So personally yes Enduro or DH would be more interesting but in practical terms I doubt it would work with Olympic bidding rules.

I don’t think that works as an excuse given that they have now added surfing which isn’t noted for being the easiest event to hold close to many cities, let alone capital cities.

It’s a bit after my time. I know it’s downhill with bits of uphill, but the uphill isn’t timed or something (that sounds very “athletic”).

Your trolls are getting lazy, maybe it’s time to talk about long travel HTs?

What most of you do and enjoy is a leisure activity, not a sport. BC don’t pretend to be anything other than a racing organisation, a lot of their funding is dependent on Olympic performance, so it’s not really any surprise where they spend it – a lot of the money is ringfenced so they have no choice.

There is value in having a sport with everyman grassroots accessibility. Large national series almost automatically exclude many people who can’t make the time and financial commitments

Still plenty of XC racing below national level. Now involved with a club which does a lot of work on junior development for XC racing (also plenty of senior involvement) and lots of racing for them at a more local level.

Nah, 2 problems are really apparent with DH

1. telly flattens out the hill too much.

2. It doesn’t really appear to be “hard” enough. The summer Olympics are all about athleticism, you can hear the average punter “what, not even pedalling?…just rolling downhill?…pfft, I could do that”

Sorry to disappoint. But what the vast majority of leisure/hobby/sport mtbers do across the UK and the rest of the world has far more in common with XCO than DH or Enduro.

Despite Enduro/trail bikes being the latest “thing”.

PrinceJohn – Member
I don’t get why becoming an olympic sport is such a good thing?

Funding.

BC puts loads of time and resource into track but virtually nothing into cyclocross for example, despite the latter being far more popular (in terms of participant numbers) and far more accessible. Why? Because track qualifies for UK Sport funding on the basis of being an Olympic discipline. More medals more money.

vincienup – Member
It’s a little annoying that what is considered ‘mountain biking’ is so far from what most of us do and enjoy

Eating flapjacks and comparing tyres? 😀

imo xc racing is everything that is bad about mtb’s. it ruined what bikes looked like for years and the sooner it is forgotten the better

Each to their own, I suppose.
Joe Public watches road racing and goes out and buys a road bike and their fvourite bit of SKY kit.
Joe Public watches xc racing and goes out and buys a xc bike.

Joe Public watches DH, spends six months trying to work out which bike, helmet, body armour, shoes, pyjamas to buy, gives up and buys another KFC for dinner. They count their blessings as they hand’t realised how mental DH courses really are and buy a xc bike because it’s a lot cheaper, safer and family friendly.
How much are sports influenced by the manufacturers?
Now a megavalanche mixed with elimination would be cool. 8)

DH should be an Olympic sport, any average couch potato can see it takes more skill and athleticism than equestrian crap.
Shouldn’t be at the expense of XC, like WTH?

Schurter would destroy Gwin on a XCO technical descent if they were both on XC bikes.

The sailing was in the solent etc could quite easily do bpw etc. Was in Park city last year, the actual venue for the salt lake city winter Olympics.

The Solent?!!! 👿

Get in the ****ing sea!

ghostlymachine – Member
Sorry to disappoint. But what the vast majority of leisure/hobby/sport mtbers do across the UK and the rest of the world has far more in common with XCO than DH or Enduro.

That. And more of that. DH and Enduro are but a fly-speck in the consciousness of most leisure cyclists. Once again, STW Forumites need to stop viewing the cycling world through a narrow lens.

Enduro wouldn’t be hugely watchable, and veeery looong, but DH would be a massive improvement on XC. The stiffs would never go for it though, the UCI would shit a brick.

Schurter would destroy Gwin on a XCO technical descent if they were both on XC bikes.

I’d bet the farm he wouldn’t.

XC in before cyclocross seems crazy, given the heritage of the two disciplines, and CX being a proven spectator sport. Seems unlikely now that you could have both.

You do need a bit of mud to really bring out the best in cross – last I heard it was being pitched for the winter olympics (as a sport that is done in the winter months, rather than a snowsport per se).

imo xc racing is everything that is bad about mtb’s. it ruined what bikes looked like for years and the sooner it is forgotten the better

It’s a little annoying that what is considered ‘mountain biking’ is so far from what most of us do and enjoy, and at times it’s very annoying that BC and everyone else in officialdom like to pretend that no other forms of mountain biking exist as anything other than leisure activities with consequent effects on funding, but the flip side of that is that they aren’t messing with ‘our’ sport.

(+ others)

The average MTBer, and that includes the STAVAisters, stormtroopers and gnarrslayers on their #ENDURO ‘rigs’, have more in common with pony treking than they do with XC, let alone the EWS or DH type riding. The image in their head might be different, but most would probably cry if faced with a decent XC course (even if they could use their own bike!).

That said, that second quote could be read the other way, XC is far more technical than most trail centre black run stuff.

Lots of interesting stuff here, TBH I’m thinking what makes people ( non. MTBers) think wow….!!! For example the day after the Winter Olympics Boarder cross or ski cross it was talked about in the office…..less so super G or cross country skiing.

I was looking at it from a spectacle PoV. I agree that I didn’t think of how XC Is much bigger in Europe etc but again I think for the non biker DH enduro type stages are better viewing?

I recognise the the techie sections on XCO are tough, but I’d fancy one of those more the the techie sections of a world class DH course….( clearly both would result in using my face as a brake!!) I’m not in any way saying it’s easy I’m asking what’s better telly?

Schurter would destroy Gwin on a XCO technical descent if they were both on XC bikes.

I really doubt it, love to see it but I’d put the house on Gwin!

and “London”‘s sailing was down at Portsmouth IIRC

Weymouth. About twice as far from London.

DH would be great.

Currently stuck in Kenya with work, put the MSA DH on the projector in our crew room, Quite happily sat chilling my beans on my own. As people came in to grab a brew, they stayed, before I knew it the room was full and cheering Danny on to the win. It’s dynamic and exciting, especially to those who don’t follow it, be good to see it there but won’t lose any sleep if it doesn’t.

That said, that second quote could be read the other way, XC is far more technical than most trail centre black run stuff.

That’s not true, but who cares? I can enjoy a blue trail centre ride as much as a black DH run. Still eff all to do with the fact that DH is FAR more exciting to watch.

I guess you don’t do much world class (or world cup) xc riding then?

The old “racing round a field” died on its arse about 10 years ago, certainly did in Europe/US.

I guess you don’t do much world class (or world cup) xc riding then?

Yeah great point……because you have to compete at that level to see the tracks they ride don’t you.
This (london olympics final descent);

Isn’t beyond any of us, certainly when you look at the line they all took. It’s a blue.

That’s Beijing. 8 years ago. Things change.

My apologies;

Don’t look like times have changed that much.
Besides it doesn’t matter, DH is still the far more exciting sport for spectators. It just is, and I have no dog in this race. I just ride mountain bikes with no specific purpose other than the enjoyment of it.

Isn’t beyond any of us, certainly when you look at the line they all took. It’s a blue.

I’d put good money on it being beyond quite a few, whilst redlining, on a full on XC race bike.

Maybe if they did an urban DH race through the favellas it’d be good to watch.

Isn’t beyond any of us, certainly when you look at the line they all took. It’s a blue.

DH blue perhaps. It would have half the people at Swinley in ambulances if they came across that 😆 (being fair there is only one rock in Swinley, or clump of couple of rocks 😛 ).

Anyway on the original post, I can see a comparison with Winter Olympics in that downhill skiing is a similar spectacle to downhill mountain biking for the viewer. Start gate, cameras following a racer down each section, goes out of view at points, occasional jumps, spectators clustered at the side whistling and ringing cow bells.

It’s just the Winter Olympics is a bit more specialist with different audience with events often being the main event in the sport. Summer Olympics is to me all about showing off the elite, raising and spending money to show off the host nation and city, than it is about competition and spectacle. In many events they may as well just parade about. The main event in many of the sports over the year or four years is not generally the Olympics (e.g Wimbledon or the Opens for tennis. TdF etc for road cycling). Exception is the athletics.

This:
[video]https://youtu.be/JToIw88YEM8[/video]
Vs
This:
[video]https://youtu.be/DFoQfap9Tic[/video]

There is no two ways about it, niche or not, DH is far more dynamic and exciting to watch than XC and more importantly, for UK cycling, we have better DH athletes than we do XC, that’s a fact. So at the very least, in terms of drawing in funding and support, BC pushing for DH to be included in the Olympics would be advantageous.

The average mtb’er is closer to XCO than DH , most common are hardtails then short travel full sus not an orange alpine; how many actually wear a full-face ?

Current XCO courses are tech enough, The faster you ride them and trying to gap a rider makes it more involving than riding round waiting at the top for your mates

DH is still the far more exciting sport for spectators. It just is, and I have no dog in this race.

It doesn’t matter how many times you say it, it’s still your opinion and not fact!

I don’t really have a preference FWIW, neither translates well to television, but I think the time-trial nature of DH makes it feel very ‘detached’ and dull. The public wouldn’t find it more interesting. Fact (I can do it too see).

It requires a certain topography which would necessitate a separate venue, which is a massive ball ache (speaking as someone involved with organising the Olympic rowing at Eton Dorney). The sailing comprison really doesn’t stack up. To say “ah you could just put it 200 miles away, works for sailing” is totally missing the point.

Meh.
DH is difficult to watch and to film unless you have open courses, and even then is a succession of riders doing the same thing over and over again.
It’s not great to watch unless you are a fan, and even then it gets a bit dull until the top three or four appear.

Sailing…now there’s an exciting spectator sport.

Maybe just allow ebikes also…you can hear the commentary now ,

I’ve heard XC unicycle is in next time round…

I really don’t see how anyone that watches both can claim DH is more dynamic to watch. You spend an hour watching the first 20 go just waiting for the top 5 to find out who wins.
The riders themselves are hidden behind full face helmet, goggles, pads and pyjamas. Not to mention that between poor camera coverage and time between runs you probably spend less than 50% of the time with no rider on screen.

Whereas XC is action right from the gun, riders sprinting shoulder to shoulder. You can watch the top guys literally sprinting up every short climb lap after lap. You can see the expressions on their faces, thighs bulging etc.

njee20 – Member

It requires a certain topography which would necessitate a separate venue, which is a massive ball ache (speaking as someone involved with organising the Olympic rowing at Eton Dorney). The sailing comprison really doesn’t stack up. To say “ah you could just put it 200 miles away, works for sailing” is totally missing the point.

Why?

Whereas XC is action right from the gun, riders sprinting shoulder to shoulder. You can watch the top guys literally sprinting up every short climb lap after lap. You can see the expressions on their faces, thighs bulging etc.

Road, BMX & track all do that. It’s the “lap after lap” bit which bores. There again, F1 is very popular. I prefer WRC personally.

replace – no. as well as – yes.

you mean just like the rider after rider after rider format of DH? But less boring?

Like ski DH? Yes! I think that’s great too!
Watching the splits, not really knowing who’s winning until the very end. Great stuff!

Sounds like you should go and watch some time trials. 24hr events are good.